EV general discussion

[b0rn2sk8]

I think we’ve successfully managed to touch on all the EV greatest hits in the last 24 yours, impressive.

I was surprised how many 350kw sites there were already up and running travelling up the A1 to Scotland. Plenty to chose from and not just at the services (Starbucks/Ionity pairing was the best). Can still see this being an issue at peak times but for the EV owner that does the occasional long trip charging wasn't much of an issue at all.

If you include all the 250kw Tesla units which in practice fill a 400V EV extremely quickly, there are significantly more than are listed here.

As someone mentioned above that 350kw chargers are getting to the point that they are too fast and I’m inclined to agree. You’ve barely walked to the service building and the car is ready to go.

Not to quote my own post or anything but this is the reality for motorway service stations going forward:

Now this looks interesting… planning application at Whetherby services: https://uniformonline.harrogate.gov...s.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=S2PSUEHY0EK00

New HGV parking
Old HGV parking rebuilt with 118 new EV chargers (66 looks to be Tesla).
12 new accessible chargers in main car park
Existing 15 chargers retained
54 HGV chargers

184 new chargers to be added to the existing 15 with the option to add another 22 later. 221 rapids in one location is going to be tasty.

It’s a screening application so it’s going to be a way off but it’s what needs to happen.

221 rapid chargers in one location… what’s not to love.

 

[Caracus2k]

so which is it?

My personal circumstances, unlike many would actually currently be suitable to consider an EV.

My house has a drive l, I don't WFH and have a circa 55 mile round trip daily commute.

Partner has her own car so we would likely keep at least one ICE car for longer journeys where motorway charging is currently 1) expensive 2) inconvenient and potentially time consuming especially as 'peak' times.


None of the above however stops me thinking that we aren't collectively walking into a clearly foresable disaster re the 'ambitious' plans to pass out the sale of new ICE's.

EV'S simply are just not suitable for many use cases/ people's situations and there's no guarantee of this being resolved.

I predict certain used ICE vehicles will hold their value very well in years to come as their electric equivalents will still suffer too many downsides.

And I don't think it's just a matter of political will now. I simply do not think there is enough time and skilled people available to march the needs of the goals set.

 

[ICDP]

I would take 7x100 KW charge points every single time at service stations rather than 2x350kw.

a genuine 100kw charge point gives around 200 miles in 40 minutes , which for the vast majority of people that is fine.

destination charge points is what is really needed and whilst I am certain some here believe the BS that the grid will melt despite people who know better not being concerned........ overnight destination charging off lamposts (when the grid is under least load) and in carparks and what not should be easier to roll out.

It reminds of the colleague who replaced his Kona EV with an Ioniq 5 and was eager to try the new ultra rapid charging. On a trip down to Dublin, he was boasting that it had finished charging at a 350kWh rapid in 15 minutes and was ready to go quicker than he and his family were. It turns out they stayed at a service station for about an hour to eat and let the kids play in the play area for a break. He is known for ranting about EV owners hogging chargers. So he was not happy when I asked if he moved his Ioniq 5 when it had finished to free up the 350kWh rapid charger. But he had left it on for 45 minutes and charged to 100% and only moved it to avoid the overstay fee.

He was even less happy when I told him his older slow ass charging Kona would have been ready in the same time if it was plugged in to a 100kWh charger.

 

[oweneades]

what was average speed for the pictured 15/89 miles trips, giving the impressive 185-210 Wh/mi you achieve .(doesn't show that by default?)

Essentially the same, always takes approx 30 minutes door to door due to traffic lights on the A303 and junctions I have to cross. 89 mile section is since charge so a more overall when I wasn't going out of my way to drive efficiently.

 

[bigmike20vt]

My personal circumstances, unlike many would actually currently be suitable to consider an EV.

My house has a drive l, I don't WFH and have a circa 55 mile round trip daily commute.

Partner has her own car so we would likely keep at least one ICE car for longer journeys where motorway charging is currently 1) expensive 2) inconvenient and potentially time consuming especially as 'peak' times.


None of the above however stops me thinking that we aren't collectively walking into a clearly foresable disaster re the 'ambitious' plans to pass out the sale of new ICE's.

EV'S simply are just not suitable for many use cases/ people's situations and there's no guarantee of this being resolved.

I predict certain used ICE vehicles will hold their value very well in years to come as their electric equivalents will still suffer too many downsides.

And I don't think it's just a matter of political will now. I simply do not think there is enough time and skilled people available to march the needs of the goals set.

fair enough. I don't agree I think it is absolutely doable (which doesn't mean our country WILL do it) however different views are fine and needed. I have no issue at all people disagreeing, just obvious troll bait and lies (prime example the sun posted an article about how a womans brand new EV was ruined in a flood, with the intimation the car was at fault. 1) any car would have been ruined. 2) it was a 5 year old car and ,3) it was a ******* diesel.

or how about the claims that both the ferry fire and Luton airport car park fires were caused by EV cars battery fires...... nope on both occasions but it's funny how the retractions are always quieter than the initial lies.

eventually an EV fire will cause a disaster. there will be hell to play and the media will absolutely LOVE it, even more so if people die..... what is that all about?

 

[VincentHanna]

I see the Ioniq 5 N has gone on sale now - £65k

Hyundai Motor UK announces IONIQ 5 N range pricing, specification and technical information

www.hyundai.news

650PS and 770Nm torque
0-62 in 3.4 seconds.

Not sure what to make of that really. That's supercar levels of power, but also luxury car pricing for a Hyundai.

Weirdly, they haven't confirmed the range yet but it has a bigger 84kw battery

Jack Rix of Top Gear magazine seemed to like it.

 

[jpaul]

[

Essentially the same, always takes approx 30 minutes door to door due to traffic lights on the A303 and junctions I have to cross. 89 mile section is since charge so a more overall when I wasn't going out of my way to drive efficiently.

OK I see it had current journey time so ~ 30mph
]

 

[bigmike20vt]

I see the Ioniq 5 N has gone on sale now - £65k

Hyundai Motor UK announces IONIQ 5 N range pricing, specification and technical information

www.hyundai.news

650PS and 770Nm torque
0-62 in 3.4 seconds.

Not sure what to make of that really. That's supercar levels of power, but also luxury car pricing for a Hyundai.

Weirdly, they haven't confirmed the range yet but it has a bigger 84kw battery

Jack Rix of Top Gear magazine seemed to like it.

it's their "silly" version with very low production numbers , I would not look at that car to judge the rest of the models. that said Hyundai are no longer cheap cars... far from it.

 

[Greebo]

It’s why the PHEV works for me. Most of my journeys are local so a 30ish mile range is fine. On long journeys I’m just hybrid and don’t bother charging.

This. I am not fully committed to EV yet due to range anxiety for when I do long journeys to vist family but a PHEV with a 60 mile range is perfect for me. My commute is 30 miles each way and we have chargers at work so the vast majority of my annual mileage is done on electric.

 

[VincentHanna]

The main reason I went with an EV is the tax benefit for company car drivers.

But the power and instant peak torque is pretty addictive.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

My personal circumstances, unlike many would actually currently be suitable to consider an EV.

My house has a drive l, I don't WFH and have a circa 55 mile round trip daily commute.

Partner has her own car so we would likely keep at least one ICE car for longer journeys where motorway charging is currently 1) expensive 2) inconvenient and potentially time consuming especially as 'peak' times.

So what makes you think your use case is not suitable for an EV?

You have all the things you need to make it the cheapest and most convenient experience.

You can charge at home for 7.5p, your daily commute you can do in pretty much any EV on the market bar a Gen 1 Leaf with extreme battery degradation. You have an ICE car for longer trips.

I get you don’t like the price but the reality is, ICE cars are also very expensive these days.

The price difference isn’t that significant and nothing like it used to be on most models. Outside of Tesla, list prices are utterly meaningless. The list prices anre £lol but you can get over £10k off list on even cheaper stuff like an Corsa-E without even negotiating, dealers have them up on Auto Trader for £22k for a pre-reg.

It’s odd you say you don’t think there is enough time when you can buy ICE cars for another 12 years and always could, the latest policy change didn’t actually change that.

It’s not like in 2035 there will all of a sudden be 32 million EVs on the roads and 100% EV ownership. There will still be hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of ICE cars on the roads in 2050 given any car can reasonably last 15-20 years of it’s looked after plus all the classics.

I find the whole argument bizarre. You don’t need to look very far to see what can be done is there is the will and a competent government that shows a bit of leadership.

This. I am not fully committed to EV yet due to range anxiety for when I do long journeys to vist family but a PHEV with a 60 mile range is perfect for me. My commute is 30 miles each way and we have chargers at work so the vast majority of my annual mileage is done on electric.

We are fully electric now but that’s a nice setup and very convenient.

I’ll be towing a caravan behind our Model Y when it arrives which will be a new experience…

 

[Caracus2k]

So what makes you think your use case is not suitable for an EV?

My use case would be somewhat suitable for an EV. But I am aware that my case is different to many. At movement I just have kept an older 62 plate diesel as my daily driver/ commute car and the wife has a somewhat newer, Euro 6 compliant, diesel for her use and for if we ever need to go to London or anywhere with a LEZ.

If we were looking to replace my car it might well be with an EV.

You have all the things you need to make it the cheapest and most convenient experience.

You can charge at home for 7.5p, your daily commute you can do in pretty much any EV on the market bar a Gen 1 Leaf with extreme battery degradation. You have an ICE car for longer trips.

Yes all true

I get you don’t like the price but the reality is, ICE cars are also very expensive these days.

True to a degree but the lower ends of the second hand market are going to get interesting

The price difference isn’t that significant and nothing like it used to be on most models. Outside of Tesla, list prices are utterly meaningless. The list prices anre £lol but you can get over £10k off list on even cheaper stuff like an Corsa-E without even negotiating, dealers have them up on Auto Trader for £22k for a pre-reg.

I would probably buy 2nd hand anyway so the depreciation is mostly good for me as I usually buy and hold onto cars for a long while if I can. Doesn't change the suitability for EV's for the wider marker though.

It’s odd you say you don’t think there is enough time when you can buy ICE cars for another 12 years and always could, the latest policy change didn’t actually change that.

Although technically its 12 in reality it 7 as only hybrids with a longer range will be available after 2030.

It’s not like in 2035 there will all of a sudden be 32 million EVs on the roads and 100% EV ownership. There will still be hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of ICE cars on the roads in 2050 given any car can reasonably last 15-20 years of it’s looked after plus all the classics.

like I said short of some big advancements in EV's some ICE vehicles will remain very much in demand after they stop being made as EV's just aren't anywhere near as suitable for some use cases.

I find the whole argument bizarre. You don’t need to look very far to see what can be done is there is the will and a competent government that shows a bit of leadership.

I think there's some big issues coming up for our ability to produce and distribute electricity and I don't think there's enough time, regardless of the political will to resolve these in the timeframes that have been set.

I’ll be towing a caravan behind our Model Y when it arrives which will be a new experience…

Towing is one sure way to currently highlight some of the weaknesses of EV's I will look for your future comments on the experience!

 

[Kenai]

Although technically its 12 in reality it 7 as only hybrids with a longer range will be available after 2030.

That changed recently, there's no element of ban coming in 2030 but sales targets for different drivetrain options will gradually trend towards EV only by 2035.

 

[Nasher]

I see the Ioniq 5 N has gone on sale now - £65k

Hyundai Motor UK announces IONIQ 5 N range pricing, specification and technical information

www.hyundai.news

650PS and 770Nm torque
0-62 in 3.4 seconds.

Not sure what to make of that really. That's supercar levels of power, but also luxury car pricing for a Hyundai.

Weirdly, they haven't confirmed the range yet but it has a bigger 84kw battery

Jack Rix of Top Gear magazine seemed to like it.

Super cars levels of power but not supercar performance. It's an "on paper" performance car TBH. Too heavy for track work and a low top speed for 600hp.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

Super cars levels of power but not supercar performance. It's an "on paper" performance car TBH.

Where did you get to that conclusion from just that video?

 

[Nasher]

Where did you get to that conclusion from just that video?

That video isn't the only source of information...

 

[b0rn2sk8]

I think there's some big issues coming up for our ability to produce and distribute electricity and I don't think there's enough time, regardless of the political will to resolve these in the timeframes that have been set.

The big issues are actually the NIMBYs. Around my way we are meant to be one of the renewable and nuclear superpowers of the country and yet the local population is fighting every last meter of infrastructure being proposed.

All the funding and plans are there but they are getting bogged down in constant litigation. The absolute irony of their arguments is ‘the environment’, cracks me up. So many jobs are at risk though it’s a real issue for the local economy.

Towing is one sure way to currently highlight some of the weaknesses of EV's I will look for your future comments on the experience!

I’ll be sure to post about it here. I’m expecting a ~35-40% range drop and will drop the model Y to a 150 mile range with a caravan on the back.

I’m certainly not the first to do it and it’s well tested at this point. The biggest issue is the lack of chargers with trailer provision (or unnecessary height restrictions) but it’s getting better on that front. It just adds an extra dynamic to charging having to unhitch before plugging in.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

That video isn't the only source of information...

Why did you quote it, why did you add nothing else, why do you make stuff up?

Do the ... ellipses make you feel more important than you really are?

 

[Caracus2k]

That changed recently, there's no element of ban coming in 2030 but sales targets for different drivetrain options will gradually trend towards EV only by 2035.

Think Labour will switch it back when they come into powerin a year or so (unless something very unexpected happens in the meantime).... and regret that decision within a couple of election cycles when it comes back to bite them

 

[Uther]

It’s ok. I’ll do my euro road trip from summer one day here ha

Do it!