Associate
This has been the case since the inception of the Christian Church, it's documented in the Bible, so the Bible is actually supporting what you feel is wrong with many folks who attend church.
Evolution or God
- Thread starter Steven Rimmington
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This has been the case since the inception of the Christian Church, it's documented in the Bible, so the Bible is actually supporting what you feel is wrong with many folks who attend church.
Soldato
Evolution or God? Both. The two aren't mutually exclusive. Unreasonable fanatics for both will argue it's one pole or the other but actually both hold together without too much drama. I'll let science tell me about science and the Bible tell me about God and eternity. I will not try and use a book of narrative as a scientific treaty anymore than I would argue a recipe book should tell me how to do surgery just because both involve cutting flesh.
Totally agree with you on the contradictory nature of this but it does pose a very interesting question.
If we agree that that statement must be true for both sides of the argument given that something must've created a God then it calls into question of what our understanding of nothingness is.
How can the beginning of anything start from absolute nothing?
Man of Honour
It is an interesting question, but I think I lack the ability to genuinely answer it because my understanding of nothingness is inadequate. I think of nothing in terms of something - nothing is the absence of something. But I understand that's a flawed approach. Understanding time is a related issue because an absolute nothing wouldn't have any time. Our language has time baked into it, which makes even talking about an absence of time difficult. If time is a part of the universe then there wasn't any start of anything because the universe would then have existed for as long as time. The obvious next question is "what about before the universe existed?", but that's an invalid question in this context because there was no "before" because "before" is a function of time. But what is an absence of time?
I like Bill Wurtz's description in their video "history of the entire world, i guess", which starts long before Earth existed. It's on Youtube, but I won't link to it here as it's only the very beginning that's relevant to this subject and I haven't read this forum's rules on swearing in videos recently. It's a brilliant video, though. ~20 mins for all of history and they even manage to get in some lovely little details such as most people in eastern Mediterranean bronze age civilisations not knowing where the tin they used came from.
One possible explanation is that of virtual particles, but they're part of the universe (if they exist, of course - they're an explanation for the cause of some effects that are observable but they haven't been observed themselves). So I don't understand how they could be an explanation for the beginning of the universe.
One thing we can all agree on is that Earth is clearly only 6000 years old, probably younger.
How can I tell this? Well, if it was 5 billion years old, the surface would be 6ft deep in dust. Given that in the short space of 2days without use, the dashboard in my car looks like it's been sprinkled by dust fairies, this is the only logical conclusion.
How can I tell this? Well, if it was 5 billion years old, the surface would be 6ft deep in dust. Given that in the short space of 2days without use, the dashboard in my car looks like it's been sprinkled by dust fairies, this is the only logical conclusion.
Soldato
Go watch or read a brief history of time with Stephen Hawking.
He very nicely highlights how we might better understand scientific theories, including Hawking radiation, black holes and the big bang.
A Brief History of Time | Rotten Tomatoes
In part an adaptation of cosmologist Stephen Hawking's popular book about his theories of the universe, this documentary also shows Hawking's daily life as he deals with the ALS that renders him virtually immobile and unable to speak without the use of computer. Hawking's friends, family, former...
www.rottentomatoes.com
Soldato
You want me to summarise theories that are incredibly difficult to comprehend and understand?
That’s like asking a potato to work out your tax return.
Got the names of the theories which have the answers?
Soldato
It's just the big bang theory but they explain how they try to figure out where anything like it could have happened and what space actually meant using their maths formulas.
Caporegime
God can always retreat a step beyond understanding.
"God makes the sun come up" - Solar system/orbital mechanics discovered
"God made the solar system" - History and understanding of the universe occurs
"God made the universe" - Big Bang or other theory proven to explain universe creation
"God made the big bang"....
Guessing you think the same thing about Batman
Associate
Which god? Given there are thousands.
After years of thought, here are my conclusions;
1. All religions are just manmade stories, they gave us hope hundreds of years ago when life sucked
2. Science is the only way to try and explain what is going on, this is far more amazing than any religion
3. It seems as though life wants to spread throughout the universe, intelligence evolves to further spread life to other planets
4. Evolution is the way life adapts to a planet, the laws of physics shapes evolution
I'm tempted to say an alien race created evolution and DNA, but the logic of who created the creator stops me. The only explanation is there is no explanation, we are just here for no reason.
1. All religions are just manmade stories, they gave us hope hundreds of years ago when life sucked
2. Science is the only way to try and explain what is going on, this is far more amazing than any religion
3. It seems as though life wants to spread throughout the universe, intelligence evolves to further spread life to other planets
4. Evolution is the way life adapts to a planet, the laws of physics shapes evolution
I'm tempted to say an alien race created evolution and DNA, but the logic of who created the creator stops me. The only explanation is there is no explanation, we are just here for no reason.
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It just goes to show you even here, there isn't a definitive answer or belief, we just dont know.
I have come to realise believing in we were created by a 'God' doesn't sound as daft as we evolved from some sort of soup 4 billion years ago.
I have come to realise believing in we were created by a 'God' doesn't sound as daft as we evolved from some sort of soup 4 billion years ago.
Associate
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It happened everywhere, and time as we know it began at the same time. ‘Before’ and ‘outside’ make no sense in terms of the Big Bang, which is still going on to this day - it simply describes the expansion of the universe from its beginning, highly dense, state.
Associate
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Where did the god come from then?
Man of Honour
If you know we don't know, why do you feel any need to pretend you know? That's what belief is - a claim of knowing.
All that making up an external entity does is evade the "how did it happen?" question away by moving the "how did it happen?" question from humans to the entity you make up. It's not an answer. It's a way to avoid the question by pretending it's been answered. Sounds a bit daft to me.
Also, you're confusing biogenesis with evolution. They're completely different things.