F1 2009 Season discussion/development thread

Shame, Honda were upbeat about moving up the field this year, and from what I know their KERS implementation was right up there too.

But, as others elsewhere, F1 is more of an advertisement for the manufacturers, and as Honda's main cash cow is the US, and the US has no F1 exposure now (Canada GP gone), there is no real financial incentive to run their F1 team.

It is a drop in the ocean for Honda, even in todays Credit-Crunch *yawn* scenario, but Honda as a company has always been a pragmatic one, and (very rough estimate) £100-300million spent on a F1 team for no major gain was always going to be under the spotlight.

Keep an eye on Toyota next year. I doubt they'll go this year...but next?

Fingers crossed a buyout of the team will happen. F1 needs different manufactuers/works teams/etc in order to keep it flourishing.

(well, I say flourishing....hmm :) )
 
Toyota might pull out now that Honda have gone, with them being japanese manufacturer rivals and all imo.

Williams could go because they're low funded apparently and rumoured to be pulling out for years.

Force India could go, their owner has money but it depends if he wants to keep sinking money into it and getting nothing back.
 
if honda doesnt find its viable, who would actually be able to run it? I think finding a buyer is going to be very hard, but tbh, they were bottom of the ranking so no great loss in terms of the competition up front!
 
digisatman said:
if honda doesnt find its viable, who would actually be able to run it? I think finding a buyer is going to be very hard, but tbh, they were bottom of the ranking so no great loss in terms of the competition up front!
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Wont be as hard as many people think. Walking in to a fully setup running F1 operation is still a very attractive proposition.

Was told last night of 2,possibly 3 groups that are interested.
 
Unless Bernie can put together a very good plan for this year, we may see a another team go.

Williams are a bit hit and miss. They are very loyal to F1 but how long can this loyalty last we don't know.
Toyota have a really good reason to quit now. One of their main competitors has now quit so they may go and join them on that idea.
Force India may go but i feel VJ Malia is into his sport and has got a good package this year using Mclarens KERS and engine/transmission.

These are the only 3 i can see leaving really.
 
NathanE said:
I think we may see one more team quit yet :(
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I think so too. The renault boss was never keen on the money F1 was costing before the global economic meltdown. I'm currently trying to find the article where he says he cannot understand spending 200 odd million for no gain.

Toyota really has no need to keep throwing money in, especially with Honda not around.

Williams are rumoured to be in financial trouble.

One thing for sure, Berger sold out at the right time. Perfect timing.

It's going to take another team to go and the threat of Mclaren and ferrari having to run a 3rd car to make the really big boys have a hard look at what they have done to prolong the life of the sport they are in.

Max and Bernie obviously have an idea of whose in real trouble which is why they are so desperate to come up with ideas to save money.
 
I really think a buyer will come forward, as said, walking into a full F1 setup is a great opportunity, and Honda have done a lot of 2009 development already (at least that is what I thought, correct me if i am wrong).

Provided they can get in and up and running quickly, the new owner could well hit thefloor running. Especially with the big changes that are going on :)

Anyone wanna club together and buy a share in the team :p
 
They were spending 300 million a year to be at the back. People are all ready going to be bailing out. They can't have much confidence in the new car or even how much has been spent on developing it.

They are apparently willing to sell for a £1.

I'm half tempted to bid just so I can sack Rubens.

You sir forfeited your career to be MS's lap dog, your fired!
 
*smacks head against monitor*

No... no no no no no!

Sounds like the standard engines and transmission have been forced through for 2010 to 2012 by you know who. :(

But the teams will be able to say we don't want them and use their own engines for now. Which makes the standard engine pointless.. But the Teams own engine will have to produce the same output as the standard engine - and they'll have to use the standard gearbox with their own engine.

On the plus side - Cosworth back in F1. Yay!

On the down side - Standard engines and transmission. Boo!
 
Mikey said:
I too don't think it'll be the last..

My money is on :
Williams or Renault..

But then lets not forget about Force India and STR
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Williams have been running at a loss for the last 3 or 4 years.
Renault are French.

Neither are good things.

It's sad to say, but I think that Williams may cease to exist soon, Renault could pull out at the end of the year as could Toyota.

However, with Honda's pull out - will we still have Suzuka on the calendar next year? I hope so. We need good circuits now more than ever.
 
Mikey said:
They aren't the only big guns changing their motorsport programs..

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72314

Equally I can't see Corvette competing in GT racing as a works team, but if they do I think they are steping down to GT2.
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Welcome to 6 months ago;) Corvette announced ages ago they were going to GT2 as the GT1 grids are becoming very rare, with only 3 cars in GT1 in the ALMS this year and would have only been the 2 corvettes next year, Corvette will run the GT1 C6.r for the first 2 rounds of the ALMS, and the Le Mans 24hrs then retire them and run the GT2 C6 for the rest of the ALMS Season.
 
The problem is viewing figures I expect are dropping too?

I'd rather watch GT racing and have no intention of attending a F1 race meeting, Le Mans 24 Hours..

Wonder if Ford are going to pull the plug on WRC
 
Full letter to the team from Max 'Hit me with your rhythm stick' Mosley

Gentlemen

Further to my letter of 18 November (copy attached for convenience), we have completed the tendering process and are now in exclusive negotiations with Cosworth together with Xtrac and Ricardo Transmissions (XR) to supply a complete Formula One power train starting in 2010. The engine will be a current Formula One engine while the transmission will be state-of-the-art Formula One and a joint effort by two companies which already supply transmissions to most of the grid.

The cost to each team taking up this option will be an up-front payment of £1.68M (€1.97M) and then £5.49M (€6.42M) per season for each of the three years of the supply contract (2010, 2011, 2012). This price is based on four teams signing up and includes full technical support at all races and official tests, plus 30,000 km of testing. The annual cost will reduce if more teams take up the option, for example to £4.99M (€5.84M) per team with eight teams. It will further reduce if less than 30,000 km of testing is required. Neither engine nor transmission will be badged.

As suggested in my letter of 18 November, teams participating in the 2010 Championship would then have three options:

  • the above;
  • the right to build an engine themselves, identical to the above, having been supplied with all the necessary technical information;
  • the right to continue to use their existing engine, with the current ban on development and requirement for engine parity still in place (noting that the engine supplied will become the reference engine for output and other performance indicators and no engine will be permitted to exceed those indicators).

Teams opting for one of the latter two options would nevertheless use the XR transmission. In combination with the programme of cost reductions for the chassis, race weekend and team home base outlined in my letter of 18 November, these arrangements have a number of advantages. These include:

  • enabling the independent teams to survive in the current difficult economic climate;
  • facilitating the replacement of a manufacturer team if (as seems likely) we suffer additional losses;
  • stabilising Formula One while new road-relevant technologies are introduced together with a state-of-the-art high tech engine, which could be in Formula One as early as 2013 should the car industry by then be in a position to fund its development;
  • avoiding any change to the Formula One spectacle and keeping the technology at current levels.

These arrangements are on the basis that at least four teams enter into contracts to use the power train described above, and do so no later than close of business (5pm CET) on Thursday 11 December 2008. In the event of fewer than four teams signing up, the FIA may still proceed but the price on offer will vary. The supply contracts will be with Cosworth but in the first instance teams are requested to make their intentions known to my office.

Yours sincerely
Max Mosley
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