Soldato
lol, the most reilable of sauces!
The limit on engine costs is for selling engines to other teams.
F1 2009 Season discussion/development thread
- Thread starter Duke
- Start date
The limit on engine costs is for selling engines to other teams.
Soldato
Give it a few years and it'll be 5 laps of a go-kart course to decide the championship.
Soldato
I think... yes, I just died a little inside.
Isn't it a bit bloody close to the season to be changing these? Anyway doubling the engine life - ok...brings it in line with the gearboxes. However.... 8 engines per season per driver plus 2 for testing - What if a team produces a BMW bomb *150 engines expired in 1 season of racing and testing* This one is stupid. What happens if they go over the 8 engines in a season due to a faulty batch of parts? Can't race anymore that season?
No real opinion on this one.
Fine. Engines are locked down to what they had at the end of last year.
But the engines have had their life doubled - so shouldn't it be 4 races?
Good.
Eh? So the Renault will be the engine to have in 2009 if they're the only team allowed to modify them.
Don't like this one. But it effectively disposes of the test team.
So the teams who have larger than this have just wasted their money. Fine Max....fine....
A forumla to balance Windtunnel and CFD research? If they're not allowed to use the tunnel they will use CFD. Sounds like they are going to try and limit CFD now.
Eh? Why?
Great - because tyre information from one team will be direcly applicable to another team. Look at how Ferrari and McLaren used their tyres last year.
Medals - NO
Qualifying changes - yes. 1 hour - 12 laps. You know, the old one.
Fine. Won't help as the 2009 budgets have already been set and they will spend it all.
You don't have to the standard engine. But if you don't wan to use it you have to have a deal in place by 20/12/08 - WTF?
So it's the same engine for 3 years. Don't like it, but ok.
Just NO! Let them have their individual gearboxes.
Standard chassis may become real. Bye bye F1.
So anything about the car that makes a performace difference may be made a standard part. No thanks.
But some will remain as items that can make the car quicker, but will have to be made from paper and blutack?
Like duh! Like they deliberately find the most expensive way to make each item now.
Great.
No so great. More, dangerous.
Fine.
HOO-BLOODY-RAY! About chuffing time too!
No thanks. I don't want shortened races.
Why not just buy A1GP cars instead?
Simulators then?
Telling the teams what they are and aren't allowed to have at theior factory sites. The interesting thing to me is, it could end up that if the teams participate in GT and F1, some of their facilities may be legal in GT but not in F1.
You wanted them to have KERS - so you push it through for '09 - it costs a bloody fortune to develop and now you may introduce a standard KERS system in '10.
Shove it up your arse Max.
Soldato
Surely
must happen with
Unless we're going to have cars doubling in size.
Also, this.
No the Ferrari and Mercedes engines had been tweaked within the so called "Yes its faster than before but more reliable" BS.Most other teams were hampered by the timing of the freeze, we had spoken to the FIA and Renault back in October as it was clear that with 2 identical chassis ie RB4 and STR3, the STR3 had much more power.
Not really - you just have to be more economical with the fuel - as it used to be in the turbo era. You have to choose when to use the fuel to go fast.
I would agree with that - but I was suggesting (maybe wrongly) that most advertisers would have a set budget, and therefore wouldnt be able to drastically increase their spending even if it did mean bigger profile "adverts" - especially at the last minute.
Your principle is correct, I just dont think that the same level of sponser would be able to find even 1/2 the amount it would cost to put their info on the car (going on a complete guess that suit sponser would be 1/10 of the cost of on car sponser, even if the ratio is wrong Im sure it would be a gigantic difference)
The only other solution - would be for Honda to give away the space on the car for the same price as what sponsers where paying for being on the race suit or whatever, and there is no reason why Honda should do this (and several reasons why not)
Im sure they were running in 07 with less cash - a lot less given the win, Im not sure. Or put it another way, maybe their revenue streams increased a lot due to the win and they thought (rightly or wrongly) they could increase sponsor pricing due to the success of 06......
Sorry for the confusion
edit - In regards to the proposal
Without refueling we may have no overtaking at all!!! At least with going into the pits and stopping etc the race order was changed and people blizting the first lap/last lap before coming in happened etc, (admittedly it was dangerous especially with no lollipop system) but Im sorry motor racing is dangerous, will be dangerous and is still going to be, doesnt mean you need to become a nanny formula imo
The best teams still struggle with two race engines for one reason or another (over a season) - how many teams are going to be able to cope with 4 race ones without being heavily penalised?If it remains at four, are there going to be rolling penalties for cars that engineer a fault for a engine thats only been run for one race (after all with for arguements sake 20 races, with four races per engine means 5 engines per season - with 3 spare per driver - teams have paid for the spares so going to want to use them at some point.....)
As above - I have really died inside with these proposals even if 1/2 of them are approved
Max and Bernie are killing OUR sport
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Soldato
Surely there must be a better system available than penalising drivers/teams whose engines go pop before 4 races? Especially considering it's not the fault of the driver which is who the penalty really affects the most.
How about instead of penalising them, we reward them for using the same engine. For example, teams can use as many engines as they like throughout the year, but for completing two races on the same engine you get 1 point. For completing each further race on that engine, another point.
That's just a hair-brained idea to illustrate my point that the FIA seem hell-bent on using the stick rather than the carrot - obviously that's Max's preference.
How about instead of penalising them, we reward them for using the same engine. For example, teams can use as many engines as they like throughout the year, but for completing two races on the same engine you get 1 point. For completing each further race on that engine, another point.
That's just a hair-brained idea to illustrate my point that the FIA seem hell-bent on using the stick rather than the carrot - obviously that's Max's preference.
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Soldato
Maybe the cars could have holes in the bottom for their feet to stick out of. Fred Flintstone stylee
Caporegime
probably due to italy
I know just about all italian textile factorys close for just about the whole of august
i presume other countries in europe do similar thing, so they are effectively making Ferrari follow local laws
Im not so keen on all the features that have 'Market Research' appended to them. And im also not so keen on a ban on refueling as it removes the unpredictability.
Other than that, im quite impressed. Imposing a cost limit on engines is a good idea. People can develop them, bnut they must be cheap enough to sell for 5m Euros. Mean we will get a veriety of engines that are affordable.
Homologating all sorts of parts could slip either way though. If they start to make things like wings and chassis components standardised, its going to get very boring very fast. I was just saying the other day, that so far of the 4 teams to run 2009 front wings, they all look different, which is nice to see.
Other than that, im quite impressed. Imposing a cost limit on engines is a good idea. People can develop them, bnut they must be cheap enough to sell for 5m Euros. Mean we will get a veriety of engines that are affordable.
Homologating all sorts of parts could slip either way though. If they start to make things like wings and chassis components standardised, its going to get very boring very fast. I was just saying the other day, that so far of the 4 teams to run 2009 front wings, they all look different, which is nice to see.
And making the UK teams follow Italian Law as well.
Well, you could always just close every monday for 30 weeks
Soldato
As many on here might have noticed, I'd love to see re-fuelling banned. This idea being mooted is about, ooh, 14-15 years too late. Still, not bad for the FIA. And better late than not at all. Some of the other stuff being tossed around concerns me somewhat, but what the hell - the sport seems intent on killing itself, why not accelerate the process?
*sigh*
/clears throat
Bring back Formula ******* One!!!!
*sigh*
/clears throat
Bring back Formula ******* One!!!!
Man of Honour
Some of these ideas are pretty good. I can't comment on the more in depth regulations as I don't know enough about them, but:
Slick tyres - great, should make for closer racing and a return to some overtaking around corners hopefully!
Ban on refueling - EXCELLENT!! I used to love the dash to the pits for a 6 second tyre change. I think the different fuel loads currently really ruin the race. At least with a ban on refueling most cars will have a similar fuel load throughout the race.
OPTION of standard engines - also, I think this is good. The big teams have to a point ruined the sport lately. I'd love to see more smaller independents in the sport. With an option of a cheaper engine supply, the sport will be more attractive to small teams and less attractive to part manufacturers.
Slick tyres - great, should make for closer racing and a return to some overtaking around corners hopefully!
Ban on refueling - EXCELLENT!! I used to love the dash to the pits for a 6 second tyre change. I think the different fuel loads currently really ruin the race. At least with a ban on refueling most cars will have a similar fuel load throughout the race.
OPTION of standard engines - also, I think this is good. The big teams have to a point ruined the sport lately. I'd love to see more smaller independents in the sport. With an option of a cheaper engine supply, the sport will be more attractive to small teams and less attractive to part manufacturers.
As many on here might have noticed, I'd love to see re-fuelling banned. This idea being mooted is about, ooh, 14-15 years too late. Still, not bad for the FIA. And better late than not at all. Some of the other stuff being tossed around concerns me somewhat, but what the hell - the sport seems intent on killing itself, why not accelerate the process?
*sigh*
/clears throat
Bring back Formula ******* One!!!!
Yep, they tinkered with the rules any which way they could to try to stop MS winning the season before 10 races where over. All they really needed to do was ban refuelling. Most of his races he won with car superiority and a quick in and out lap with great team strategy.
Rarely did I see him pass on the track to win a race.
Much of modern F1 I hate, nut Refuelling is my most hated, closely followed by qualifying.
Removing refueling would require a redesign of qualifying.
Although the proposed 'knockout' system with prize money is just rubbish.