Football - John Terry's red card fiasco...

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It's unfortunate that the referee chose the wrong reason for the sending off and that means that on a technicality the red card must be rescinded (the correct decision) but it is even more unfortunate that there is no mechanism in the rules to reduce a red card to a yellow on appeal because the challenge did at least merit that.

Looking for positives: the situation does now highlight this rather gaping flaw in the rules so hopefully it will be addressed although I'm not exactly holding my breath.
 
cheets64 said:
And diving does, its part and parcel of the game and cheats teams out of points every week but it happens, the tackle was crazy but no different to a player stopping the ball going in the net with his hand, apart from the fact the striker had to run half of the pitch beat a keeper and 2 defenders closing him down.
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...and for some reason it's all just accepted as 'part of the game'. These are 'professionals' paid ridiculous amounts of money because they are supposedly the best of the best... Yet they have so much respect for their sport and each other that they dive, pretend, and generally just cheat...

...and for some reason this is all just accepted... Why?

I know my point is somewhat lost on this specific case, it's more the bigger picture. Terry took his chances, commit a foul on purpose, and his gamble lost (good!) so he got a red card... But the FA it seems, in all their great wisdom, decide there is nothing wrong infact with cheating... They have basically endorsed this behaviour...
 
semi-pro waster said:
It's unfortunate that the referee chose the wrong reason for the sending off and that means that on a technicality the red card must be rescinded (the correct decision) but it is even more unfortunate that there is no mechanism in the rules to reduce a red card to a yellow on appeal because the challenge did at least merit that.

Looking for positives: the situation does now highlight this rather gaping flaw in the rules so hopefully it will be addressed although I'm not exactly holding my breath.
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The FA said the other day that they know they need look at their system, especially after they announced that they are powerless to do anything further about Guthrie's challenge the other day which by the way is a far more serious miscarriage of justice than the Terry incident.
 
semi-pro waster said:
It's unfortunate that the referee chose the wrong reason for the sending off and that means that on a technicality the red card must be rescinded (the correct decision) but it is even more unfortunate that there is no mechanism in the rules to reduce a red card to a yellow on appeal because the challenge did at least merit that.

Looking for positives: the situation does now highlight this rather gaping flaw in the rules so hopefully it will be addressed although I'm not exactly holding my breath.
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How often are players sent off for another player pretending to be fouled? How often do players get away with a foul because the ref doesn't see it? How often are goals incorrectly given/not-given because an offside has/hasn't been seen? And how often are these decisions rescinded? Basically never...

But for some reason, Terry has been smiled upon by the FA even though he cheated.

To be frank, we should all be a bit embarressed the captain of England cheats, but for some reason we just accept it, and the FA even endorse it.
 
NeilFawcett said:
How often are players sent off for another player pretending to be fouled? How often do players get away with a foul because the ref doesn't see it? How often are goals incorrectly given/not-given because an offside has/hasn't been seen? And how often are these decisions rescinded? Basically never...

But for some reason, Terry has been smiled upon by the FA even though he cheated.

To be frank, we should all be a bit embarressed the captain of England cheats, but for some reason we just accept it, and the FA even endorse it.
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You haven't listened to anyone have you?
 
JohnnyG said:
The FA said the other day that they know they need look at their system, especially after they announced that they are powerless to do anything further about Guthrie's challenge the other day which by the way is a far more serious miscarriage of justice than the Terry incident.
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Absolutely... It seems what happens on the pitch stays on the pitch (unless your name is Terry). Players should be made accountabe after games from video evidence:-
- Pretend to be his to get another play send of? Ban them for a game.
- Dive to gain a free kick/penatly? Ban them for a game.

At the moment all this cheatin on purpose makes football look a bit of a joke at times... These are 'professional sportsmen' and should be expected to behave as such.
 
JohnnyG said:
The FA said the other day that they know they need look at their system, especially after they announced that they are powerless to do anything further about Guthrie's challenge the other day which by the way is a far more serious miscarriage of justice than the Terry incident.
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I certainly hope they do but like I said I'm not holding my breath, the powers that be in football are frequently about as much use as a blamange as a base for building a bridge on.

NeilFawcett said:
How often are players sent off for another player pretending to be fouled? How often do players get away with a foul because the ref doesn't see it? How often are goals incorrectly given/not-given because an offside has/hasn't been seen? And how often are these decisions rescinded? Basically never...
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Should we second-guess all referees decisions? Sometimes life is unfair, that's just one of those things. While I'd agree that video evidence could and should be used I'd prefer to see a system akin to rugby where in the case of doubt they refer to a specific video referee which allows the referee to make a quick decision and right any wrongs that day, it might take a few minutes more but it seems an acceptable trade off to me.

NeilFawcett said:
But for some reason, Terry has been smiled upon by the FA even though he cheated.

To be frank, we should all be a bit embarressed the captain of England cheats, but for some reason we just accept it, and the FA even endorse it.
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Terry being captain of the England team should have no bearing on the application of the rules though, that should be entirely irrelevant for the matter. If anyone wants to take action in that regard (his standing as a role model) then it should be Chelsea or England, perhaps both. The FA in this instance should only have regard to the Premier League and the punishment for it should be the same as would be applied to anyone else in the same circumstances.

wedgie said:
Does fouling now = cheating? :confused:
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It depends on how it is done, I'd say it certainly can be but it isn't automatically cheating.
 
wedgie said:
Does fouling now = cheating? :confused:
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It depends on the situation surely? Wreckless or accidental challenges obviously aren't cheating.

An intentional foul to gain an advantage, hacking a man down when you're the last defender to stop him scoring.

Kinda like how Ole "took one for the team" for us a few years ago.

If you get away with it people will brand you as cheats, if you get caught and carded then you've been reprimanded.

I think most of the outbursts have come from the fact that Terry has basically got away free from this because the FA can't downgrade that red to a yellow.

Although even if it was turned into a yellow for it, I still think some people wouldn't be happy.
 
semi-pro waster said:
Should we second-guess all referees decisions? Sometimes life is unfair, that's just one of those things. While I'd agree that video evidence could and should be used I'd prefer to see a system akin to rugby where in the case of doubt they refer to a specific video referee which allows the referee to make a quick decision and right any wrongs that day, it might take a few minutes more but it seems an acceptable trade off to me.
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I think you're spot on. The argument that seems to come back about this is how do the lower leagues manages it. Well how do the lower rugby leagues manage it? They just don't bother at the lower levels which is absolutely fine.
 
cheets64 said:
It was never a red card in the first place.

Loved how Fergie moaned that Vidic shouldn't of been sent off for 2 clear yellow bookable offences and now is moaning at this.
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hadn't seen that, how on earth can he argue that, either could have been a straight red
 
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