For the gym rats

[s0ck]

how straight do you all keep your arms doing flys? mine is totally straight at the moment and lower them down so db touchs the ground almost but most people i see in gym have a slight bend and one of my gym partners even has his arms at right angles almost not sure on correct way?

I been doing right angles for the last few weeks. Just trying a few things out, see what works. Slight kink is more effort so I guess that's better?

 

[Freefaller]

Just be careful you don't over extend the shoulders, you can cause yourself some tissue damage.

 

[BullBoyShoes]

how straight do you all keep your arms doing flys? mine is totally straight at the moment and lower them down so db touchs the ground almost but most people i see in gym have a slight bend and one of my gym partners even has his arms at right angles almost not sure on correct way?

I think it was arnold who said imagine you`re hugging a tree when doing db flys

 

[Ironic Namesake]

Away from training for a few days unfortunately - have to attend a funeral abroad

 

[oddjob62]

The school that the gym I was using was in has been closed since New Years Day so I've done nothing since then except eat and drink.

doesn't go well with what you said in the Goals for 2009 thread

 

[nicktay2605]

Hi guys, you all seem extremely knowledgeable in here so I was wondering if you could help me with my workout plan. Until recently I have not been taking the gym as seriously as I should have been. Although I really try to push myself when I'm at the gym, I haven't been calorie counting, so not really sure how much I've been eating. This has meant the gym has been a waste of my time and money so I figured if I'm going to go to the gym I ought to be doing it properly.

I've started a day-to-day workout diary detailing exactly what I have had to eat each day and how many calories etc this has come to, and also am now weighing myself at least once a week and increasing or decreasing how much I eat depending on my weight gain for that week. I feel like I have finally started to get somewhere with this side of it and now I just want to make sure I am doing a workout plan that is going to be really effective. To give you all a bit of info, I'm 21, am just shy of 6' and weigh 11st 3lbs. At the moment I am looking to concentrate more on size than strength. I do split workouts 5 days a week, with the weekend as rest days. When I'm at the gym I do 5 sets of 6 reps, and this is my workout plan:

Monday

Chest/Tri's

5x6 Barbell Bench Press (sets 1-4 I do 60kg, then sets 5 and 6 I up it to 70kg)
5x6 Dumbell Chest Press (start on 18kg dumbells, then to 20's, then 22's)
5x6 Chest Fly
5x6 Dips (with a 14kg weight)
5x6 Skullcrushers
5x6 Cable Pulldown

Tuesday

Legs

5x6 Barbell Squats (60-70kg)
5x6 Seated Calf Raise
5x6 Leg Curl
5x6 Leg Extension

Wednesday

Shoulders and forearms/wrists

5x6 Dumbell Shoulder Press
5x6 Fixed Shoulder Press
5x6 Front Cable Raise
5x6 Dumbell Wrist Curls
5x6 Rear Barbell Wrist Curl (hard to explain what I mean by this, basically I have the bar behind my back at about bum height, then extend my fingertips so that the bar rolls down to the fingertips, then grip the bar again and curl my wrist)

Thursday

Back and Biceps

5x6 Dumbell Curl (14-16kg)
5x6 EZbar Curl
5x6 Hammer Curl
5x6 Pulley Curl
5x6 Seated Row
5x6 Pull-ups
5x6 Lat Pulldown

Friday

Abs

This day I do different variations on sit-ups, some just standard, then do sets with a medicine ball, then some sets on a gym ball.

Basically, if there are areas I'm going wrong could you suggest ways I can improve things to make my workouts as effective as possible? Thanks for any help and sorry for the ridiculously long post!

 

[FeFiDoh]

Does chong warrior not come on here anymore? Not seen any thing of his for a while.

Ill head over to MP forums now and check out his bit on HST.

 

[Ultra_Extreme]

snip

Well firstly if you want size you're doing too much. Cut the abz day for starters thats stupid, you wouldnt do a bi's day or a calves day would you? take an extra rest day in the middle of your week. All growth is done resting, not lifting. Make sure your diet is good too, you dont sound like a chubber so make sure your getting lots of protein. Look at a meal and if it doesnt have at least 30g of protein in it eat something else!

Next, more reps less sets. Your bordering on a strength training program with 5x6. Personally for size i would adopt a 4x7+3 routine where you do the 7 reps then alternate slow eccentric movments with fast explosive reps. So for example, on the bench press you would lift 7 reps normally at a steady pace and with good form. Then for reps 7-10 you would rep as fast as humanly possible (even if this is not 'fast' in reality you must be trying to press super fast). Then on set 2 complete another seven normal reps, but this time for reps 7-10 lower the bar super slowly to your chest count at least 5 seconds down with at least 3 breaths, press up quickly. Follow this pattern for all sets.

This is just one way of tailoring for size, the key to size is fibre activation (musle used) the best way to activate the most fibres in a workout is to use fast and slow tempos and correct volume, volume being total reps multiplied by sets multiplied by weight.

My last note is to cut down the exercises, as a relative beginner isolated work is pointless. Back and biceps should consist of deadlifts/chins/rows and pulldowns ONLY your biceps will grow just fine (mine are 18" and i gave up normal curls long ago!). Not sure what pulldowns are in chest and tri's day? Maybe tricep press downs? Either way dont do both those and skullcrushers in the same session. Move flies to the end of the session and only complete them if you feel your chest hasnt been hit hard enough, alternativley swap them in instead of bench press o shock horror) now and again and do a close grip bench press.

Rest looks good but jesus i just looked again at back and biceps day and you HAVE to change that! 3 isolated bicep movments? Rookie mistake and counterproductive. You want big biceps get a big bent over row, big deadlift and big lat pull/chin+weight, doing 90 goddam curls in a session will get you nowhere!

 

[Freefaller]

He's had a bit of a bad time over christmas and the new year, I think he's slowly getting himself back on track.

 

[toxic]

I seem to have developed a slight problem last few months...every time I do Bicep work....both my forearms cramp a few hours later. It seems to be the large muscle at the front top of the forearm (whatever its called)...and bascially when i raise my forearm like to tense my bicep..my forarm spasms and cramps and i have to pull it back mith my other arm....Its painfaul! It now happens every time I work biceps...and seems to be getting worse. Anyone had this before or know of such a condition??

 

[Freefaller]

Worry less about bicep work, you seldom need to do any anyway if you do big back work outs they get worked out pretty well doing that as it stands. Look at U_E and I, we're hovering around 18" and that's without doing any/much bicep work at all.







Tuesday:

Another melee session but a good one:

Deadlifts (no straps or belt, but I bloody need straps or even chalk lol!):

12x100kg
10x120kg
8x140kg
6x160kg
6x180kg
2x200kg (grip completely failed and for fear of bad form i stopped)

BORs:

10x60kg
10x80kg
8x90kg
8x100kg
7x110kg
5x120kg

Front lateral rises super setted with side lateral rises:

8x10kg / 7x10kg
8x10kg / 8x10kg
7x10kg / 6x10kg
8x10kg / 7x10kg
7x10kg / 8x10kg

Seated DB Press:

10x21kg
8x22.5kg
8x25kg
6x27.5kg
6x30kg

Quick Tricep superset, cable pull downs / DB french press:

7x100kg / 8x30kg
6x100kg / 7x30kg
6x100kg / 6x30kg


And that's it. And I have the biggest pump ever! I know my training is still a bit disjointed, but until I get used to being back a more regular hours and once I realise how much the rugby affects my training cycle I won't modify it that much yet. However I might try the push/pull cycle Dtlv suggested - I need to work out how to integrate it first.

Pretty happy with the session, however I need to get straps, I didn't even have chalk today so if I want to progress on DLs I'm going to have to bite the bullet and go for it.

 

[Pigeon_Killer]

I only find chalk helps in the summer when my hands are sweaty. Never had a problem any other time although I think I've got quite a strong grip compared to most people. If it's actually the weight of the bar that's breaking your grip as opposed to sweat I'd probably give straps a try.

Nice workout btw

 

[Freefaller]

Well the bar has no grip and is pretty smooth now - but I think with straps I might have more confidence and worry less about grip. I can hold the bar up till the cows come home, I just feel that my grip was giving today

 

[PAz]

doesn't go well with what you said in the Goals for 2009 thread

Don't worry, no booze now until I go back to Poland in March.

hopefully anyway

 

[Shicky]

You double overhand deadlifting Freefaller?

I found using a mixed grip when breaking into new weights helped me gain a bit of confidence and probably strength for switching back to overhand. I realise you mention it seems purely to be grip but maybe its an option to go mixed for a while till you get some straps or chalk. You seem to rank grip strength highly though so I can't imagine you'll be strapping up anytime soon

 

[megatron]

I did 200Kg x 2 deadlift for the first time. I arched my back on the 3rd rep so I let it go till next week, should be good for more than 2 reps. Still 13st. The gym owner said he would take a look at my bench cause I said it was lagging now. I am on 80kg bench but I swapped it out for dumbells last few months. I have made some strength gains on those, mostly being able to do 4 sets with 30kg a side rather than one big set then drop to 28kg.

Concerning grip I have to stop my hands from going too far round the bar since it may be the cause of getting bruising in the middle of my palms, I use a mixed grip and a belt for only the heaviest set.

I train deadlifts with 1 heavy set and then 12 x 140kg to warm up and then pyramid after, which is different to all my other lifts. I train most lifts with 4 sets, squats I do 4 working sets and 2 warm up, so I end up doing 120Kg x 7-9reps 4sets.

 

[PAz]

Have you tried benching again after the break megatron?

I was lagging with bench, stuck in a rut around 80-90kg varying each workout, took about 8 weeks off bench and did only incline and flat dumbells. Comfortably benching with 100kg for reps now.

*Although we will see how that goes today after a week of booze and kebabs

 

[Freefaller]

You double overhand deadlifting Freefaller?

I found using a mixed grip when breaking into new weights helped me gain a bit of confidence and probably strength for switching back to overhand. I realise you mention it seems purely to be grip but maybe its an option to go mixed for a while till you get some straps or chalk. You seem to rank grip strength highly though so I can't imagine you'll be strapping up anytime soon

I use the supinated grip up to 150kg without any problems. I think it was a combination of the bar being very slippery (i.e. no grip left on it) and lack of grip through sweaty hands as 210kg comes up and down fine without straps. However, I think for moving onto heavy weights (my target is 300kg) I will need straps. My grip is very very good (I can do 2 fingered pull ups, do 1 min static holds with over 60kg) maybe not the strongest in the world but I can do the CoC #2s for a good 6-7 reps with relative ease.

I just think that to concentrate on higher reps without worrying about how good my grip's going to be straps will be the way forward. I'd rather concentrate on good form than ego with not using straps.

I will probably start using a belt at 250+ as there's no point in being daft. As strong as my core is if I'm pushing more than 2.5x my weight it's going to put a strain on the body.

I did 200Kg x 2 deadlift for the first time. I arched my back on the 3rd rep so I let it go till next week, should be good for more than 2 reps. Still 13st. The gym owner said he would take a look at my bench cause I said it was lagging now. I am on 80kg bench but I swapped it out for dumbells last few months. I have made some strength gains on those, mostly being able to do 4 sets with 30kg a side rather than one big set then drop to 28kg.

Concerning grip I have to stop my hands from going too far round the bar since it may be the cause of getting bruising in the middle of my palms, I use a mixed grip and a belt for only the heaviest set.

I train deadlifts with 1 heavy set and then 12 x 140kg to warm up and then pyramid after, which is different to all my other lifts. I train most lifts with 4 sets, squats I do 4 working sets and 2 warm up, so I end up doing 120Kg x 7-9reps 4sets.

Dude, be careful, arching your back certainly with so much weight is bad news, very bad news. Even using a belt (which I still don't feel I need) you can't rely on that to protect you, form is paramount at all times.

Sounds like you have a pretty powerful frame, though surprised at the small weight for squats, and even more so at bench!

 

[nicktay2605]

snip

Thanks for the advice Ultra, I'll make the changes you suggested. So this would be my new workout plan:

Monday

Chest/Tri's

4x7+3 Barbell Bench Press
or
4x7+3 Dumbell Chest Press
4x7 Dips
4x7 Cable Pulldown
4x7 Dumbell Chest Fly (if necessary)


Tuesday

Legs

4x7 Barbell Squats
4x7 Seated Calf Raise
4x7 Leg Curl
4x7 Leg Extension

Wednesday

Rest

Thursday

Shoulders and forearms/wrists

4x7 Dumbell Shoulder Press
4x7 Fixed Shoulder Press
4x7 Front Cable Raise
4x7 Dumbell Wrist Curls

Friday

Back and Bi

4x7 Deadlifts
4x7 Chin-ups
4x7 Bent-over Row
4x7 Lat Pulldown

Does that sound more like it? In terms of what order I do all of these in, would that be just down to personal experience and preference? Or is there an order that would be best? Thanks again.

 

[Ultra_Extreme]

Much better as an intro program nicktay2605, remember no one single method is 'correct' yoyu must learn what works and change your routine often (but like every 4-6 months not every week!)

Remember concentrate on getting a big deadlift/squat/bench/row and getting good at chinning and dipping. Once you've nailed those and are movoing good weight you will have totally changed your physique

Good luck!