Fuel price discussion thread (was ‘chaos’)

Chaos here in Lincoln, station down the road is £1.96 for diesel, cheapest is £1.69, some stations running out.
 
Bear said:
Even then you couldnt measure anything repeatedly without any tolerance, as everything measurable has tolerances due to environmental conditions, manufacturing variances etc.
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There is also the issue of proportionality, it’s just not proportionate to fine people for going a couple of mph over momentarily.

That said the fines themselves haven’t really moved in years, £100 is next to nothing these days. It probably costs more to actually catch the person, administrative to actually issue the fine and collect the money.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
You’ll get better fuel consumption doing it manually. Nearly always you’ll be better at anticipating slowdowns than the computer. As you say, you’ll also be better at the speeding up part too.
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really? I had assumed the computer would be better at doing it. Slower braking and slower accelerating. I am sure as a driver you can beat it but takes a lot more concentration and effort. I just stick my adaptive CC on and let it do its thing. Its really good at using coasting/engine breaking to maximise the regen on the hybrid batteries as well. Much better than me as I would be tempted to brake.

Studies showed that normal cruise control saved 3% in fuel and adaptive cruise control between 8-16% compared with "normal" driving. Of course the "normal" driving people werent trying to drive with fuel economy on their mind.
 
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b0rn2sk8 said:
There is also the issue of proportionality, it’s just not proportionate to fine people for going a couple of mph over momentarily.

That said the fines themselves haven’t really moved in years, £100 is next to nothing these days. It probably costs more to actually catch the person, administrative to actually issue the fine and collect the money.
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Indeed, it was 8 years ago it was increase from £60 to £100. Probably should be £125 at least now.
 
Greebo said:
really? I had assumed the computer would be better at doing it. Slower braking and slower accelerating.
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You've not been in ownership of your PHEV long enough to understand just how inefficient ACC is on most vehicles. Most will use friction brakes as opposed to regen when slowing down, and it doesn't know for example that you might only be moving 200m before you need to stop again so you end up going faster than required, etc.
 
Journey said:
You've not been in ownership of your PHEV long enough to understand just how inefficient ACC is on most vehicles. Most will use friction brakes as opposed to regen when slowing down, and it doesn't know for example that you might only be moving 200m before you need to stop again so you end up going faster than required, etc.
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Perhaps I have been spoilt. My last car was ICE and had a plethora of self driving equipment and the ACC seemed really good at not braking too much and using engine braking.

Perhaps it varies between manufacturers just how good/bad their ACC is.

And I only used to use the ACC on main roads/motorways, never in town on my old car. On the new PHEV I left it one going through towns today. Shame the traffic light system isnt legal in the UK. It started to slow me down coming up to traffic lights on green as it expected me to have to stop.
 
Greebo said:
really? I had assumed the computer would be better at doing it. Slower braking and slower accelerating. I am sure as a driver you can beat it but takes a lot more concentration and effort. I just stick my adaptive CC on and let it do its thing. Its really good at using coasting/engine breaking to maximise the regen on the hybrid batteries as well. Much better than me as I would be tempted to brake.
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Yup, I can out ‘efficient’ my TACC with relative ease. TACC only really sees the car in front or perhaps the one in front of that with the radar. I can see and look as far ahead as the conditions allow and can anticipate far better than any computer without even trying.

Don’t get me wrong, I use TACC all the time, it’s worth the cost for the reduced effort but I do manually reduce the speed of I can see traffic slowing ahead because TACC will just drive up to the car behind and then slow down once it gets to within about relatively short gap, I’ll be slowing long before then.


Greebo said:
Indeed, it was 8 years ago it was increase from £60 to £100. Probably should be £125 at least now.
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Id even say they should be triple that, even at £400, the most punitive element is the points and insurance costs.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
Id even say they should be triple that, even at £400, the most punitive element is the points and insurance costs.
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As always though, it just becomes a poor person tax.

It should be linked to income to make it fair.
 
dLockers said:
As always though, it just becomes a poor person tax.

It should be linked to income to make it fair.
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I wouldn’t have any issues with that. It becomes a little tricky for those who are not normally resident but that’s fine.

It’s not really a poor person tax, getting caught speeding is optional, by well not speeding. There still needs to be a not insignificant floor for any fine regardless of income.

The point still stands that £100 is marginally more than an 8 hour shift in your average supermarket these days.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
I wouldn’t have any issues with that. It becomes a little tricky for those who are not normally resident but that’s fine.

It’s not really a poor person tax, getting caught speeding is optional, by well not speeding. There still needs to be a not insignificant floor for any fine regardless of income.

The point still stands that £100 is marginally more than an 8 hour shift in your average supermarket these days.
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Finland do this. Millionaires get a £100,000 fine for speeding like one guy in the article who was fined £100k for doing 46 in a 30 zone.

I dont care how wealthly you are, nobody like losing £100k. Switzerland has the biggest fines. One guy was fined a million pounds.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/06/in-finland-speeding-tickets-are-linked-to-your-income/
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
It’s not really a poor person tax, getting caught speeding is optional, by well not speeding. There still needs to be a not insignificant floor for any fine regardless of income.
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Yeah on the coal face of it, I agree - but life is more nuanced.
 
SDK^ said:
I was travelling on the M1 South last Tuesday night and there was an enforced 60mph speed restriction in place with the electronic signs labelled : 'Speed restriction to reduce pollution'. I was like - But i'm driving an EV !!
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Reducing energy consumption will reduce pollution regardless.
 
prime minister says government will set out revised policy on energy security to try to end 'addiction' to Russian oil
speed limit reduction will definitely help more than increased fuel prices since everyone has to act; would the Germans consider limiting the Autobahn unlimited sections too.
just a pity they can't impose a mandatory thermostat limit for household heating (police with thermal cameras ?)
 
jpaul said:
prime minister says government will set out revised policy on energy security to try to end 'addiction' to Russian oil
speed limit reduction will definitely help more than increased fuel prices since everyone has to act; would the Germans consider limiting the Autobahn unlimited sections too.
just a pity they can't impose a mandatory thermostat limit for household heating (police with thermal cameras ?)
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Wow. Limit heating. 1984 is calling
 
I know the current fuel prices won’t stay this high forever, I hope. Just wonder how many people are now seriously considering moving over to a hybrid or going EV. I must admit it’s crossed my mind.
 
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