German Grand Prix 2013, Nürburgring - Race 9/19

Glaucus said:
They are designed to be safe and to code, when used as directed, they weren't used as directed.
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There is no evidence that Pirelli directed the teams with regards to mandating the tyres are run on the correct side and to specific cambers.

Infact, Pirelli were well aware of the teams doing this, and said nothing. If they felt this was dangerous they would have told the teams not to. The fact they didn't and the fact that they have only starting mentioning this after a bunch of failures as a reason, shows that they did not think there would be an issue.

Its all very well pointing fingers at the teams after the fact and blaming them, but its too late. Pirelli thought the tyres were safe, Pirelli thought the tyres continued to be safe when used as the teams were doing so, but they turned out not to be. Therefore, not fit for purpose.

If Pirelli had no idea about how the teams were using the tyres then I would take their point. The thing for me is that they knew what was going on and didn't stop it, but then after some failure are trying to say "well what you were doing was unsafe". If that was true, they would have said something earlier.
 
Pirelli do say, they have left and right printed on the tyres, they advise tyre pressure, they advise camber.

We know they advise these as tyre pressure and camber have come up before. Where certain teams were running it outside the advised camber.

Pirelli can only suggest, they have no right to tell teams what to do, there is no rule forcing teams to adhere to these guidlines.
Again teams need saving from themself.

fIa reduce engine power and aero on safety terms, but won't make them run tyres within the advised guidlines.

Just becuase the teams didnt now the risk, doesn't mean you can blame Pirelli. It's upto the team to take that risk and accept the consequences. It's not like we have thousands of miles of testing these days for teams/Pirelli to find all the limits.
 
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Westyfield2 said:
Why can't we just go back to multiple tyre suppliers?
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Same as last time which ever tire won the WDC everyone changed to that.
I think they should make tires last 5 laps short of half a race and which a driver can race
add to that more fuel and we got a winner?

Next season the cars will be 3 seconds a lap slower less fuel less engines=crap
 
Add more rules to F1 and you are damaging the sport. The only variable that changed in this were the tyres from Pirelli. Hell they managed to make tyres that didn't blow up last year! What changed? The teams started swapping wheels etc? Doubt it they will have been doing that for some time, The teams started running strange cambers? Doubt that as well. Pirelli had less testing this year from last? Not that I've heard? Pirelli changed the construction of the tyres (Effectivly cost saving) Ding ding ding we have a winner.
 
deuse said:
Same as last time which ever tire won the WDC everyone changed to that.
I think they should make tires last 5 laps short of half a race and which a driver can race
add to that more fuel and we got a winner?

Next season the cars will be 3 seconds a lap slower less fuel less engines=crap
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I don't care about the ultimate speed, its almost irrelevant, its how much the cars can race each other I care about mostly. Less downforce seems to be what they are going for, for fuel efficiency. If that brings back cornering being down to skill and and less harmful drag to hurt the car behind I'm very happy with that. Using less fuel and having slower cars and more choice of when to use the extra power is also great as again it brings it back towards the drivers ability to handle the car in corners, breaking and tactically when to use the extra power that could hopefully bring the overtaking back to the sport.

I think one of the key things is because of the efficiency/fuel limit question pushing stupidly hard for more downforce and more aero will let the cars corner faster but mean more fuel usage. Too much aero would simply make the cars unable to finish the race due to fuel limit, so I hope it means they push for better speed, better ability to overtake and frankly better drivers.

What good is a slower pay driver who brings 10mil, if investing that 10mil increasing upgrade would screw the car?

Well thats what I'm hoping the effects of some of the rules will mean, in reality, who knows. While I like innovation when one car gets an exhaust that lets them burn fuel through a corner and increase downforce, while breaking and no one else can match them you get a one sided championship.
 
ZG002 said:
Add more rules to F1 and you are damaging the sport. The only variable that changed in this were the tyres from Pirelli. Hell they managed to make tyres that didn't blow up last year! What changed? The teams started swapping wheels etc? Doubt it they will have been doing that for some time, The teams started running strange cambers? Doubt that as well. Pirelli had less testing this year from last? Not that I've heard? Pirelli changed the construction of the tyres (Effectivly cost saving) Ding ding ding we have a winner.
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Last season RB had way to much camber and when the tires gave up they moaned like hell. The fia said stop it.
And as for tire changing that's been going on for ages same as last season rb used an old Williams trick to warm the tires up.

Next season with the dyson cars it will be boring.
 
Glaucus said:
Pirelli do say, they have left and right printed on the tyres, they advise tyre pressure, they advise camber.

We know they advise these as tyre pressure and camber have come up before. Where certain teams were running it outside the advised camber.

Pirelli can only suggest, they have no right to tell teams what to do, there is no rule forcing teams to adhere to these guidlines.
Again teams need saving from themself.

fIa reduce engine power and aero on safety terms, but won't make them run tyres within the advised guidlines.

Just becuase the teams didnt now the risk, doesn't mean you can blame Pirelli. It's upto the team to take that risk and accept the consequences. It's not like we have thousands of miles of testing these days for teams/Pirelli to find all the limits.
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Exactly.
 
Skeeter said:
Honda isn't joining McLaren until 2015. Next year its Whitmarsh and a completely closed off to them engine :(
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I'd like to see Brawn running McLaren with the Honda engines. Would make a great partnership. Sadly Whitmarsh isn't turning things around and a change is needed if McLaren are to get back into winning ways.
 
Westyfield2 said:
Why can't we just go back to multiple tyre suppliers?
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The FIA don't want it. Michelin expressed serious interest in returning to F1 in 2010, but only if they could be part of a competitive tyre formula. The FIA weren't interested.

Mike306 said:
I'd like to see Brawn running McLaren with the Honda engines. Would make a great partnership. Sadly Whitmarsh isn't turning things around and a change is needed if McLaren are to get back into winning ways.
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Whitmarsh is useless and should fall on his sword. Bring back Ron!
 
Mike306 said:
I'd like to see Brawn running McLaren with the Honda engines. Would make a great partnership. Sadly Whitmarsh isn't turning things around and a change is needed if McLaren are to get back into winning ways.
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A change is needed quickly too, or they are going to become the next Williams.
 
Multiple tyre suppliers massively increases costs for every supplier involved and results in some tyre manufacturers, cough *Bridgestone* favouring a single team and providing tyres uniquely designed to benefit their car and any other teams get no input at all. It may also result in one tyre being massively better than another on certain tracks or having an intermediate tyre like Bridgestone used to which when worn in drying conditions became more like a slick tyre and the behaviour wasn't far off a slick either.

Then you have episodes like Indianapolis where one tyre is dangerous to use and teams can't race under safety grounds. One tyre supplier is preferred over that happening again.
 
Bought NowTV pass again so I can watch the Lions but it also gives me German GP coverage. Anyone who hasn't got Sky, like me, I can confirm it works well off an XBox. As you were men.
 
Glad that Friday Practice was rain free all day. Mclaren desperately need Fridays to gather lots of data from which we were able to do today. Been very unlucky this season with the amount of washed out Fridays we've had so it's been a refreshing change.

Also glad that the tyres were fine, I'm getting a bit bored of hearing so much about them it was good to see that there weren't any incidents. The less incidents the better as far as tyres are concerned!

Mclaren seem to be improving race by race. It's still possible that there could be race wins this year, weather conditions and luck may need to intervene but if we keep on improving it could be possible, anythings possible in F1 anyway!

And it would be truly awesome to see Mclaren getting podiums / wins at the back end of the season, trolling a few teams and thwarting, say, Hamilton's title hopes, just to see the reaction of all the Hamilton loving Jenson haters on here explode if nothing else :D :p
 
BOOM \o/

Formula 1 race drivers will not be restricted to exclusive tyre work at the young driver test, following a clarification from the FIA.

After a number of racers questioned the value of taking part in the Silverstone test on July 17-19 because they could not work on car set-up, motor racing's governing body issued a note to teams at the Nurburgring about what is and is not allowed.

Although the original stipulation still stands that race drivers can only take part in the test if they are not involved in car developments, the FIA has agreed that racers taking part will now be allowed to work on car balance with the new tyres.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/108583

In your face Mercedes :D
 
smr said:
Glad that Friday Practice was rain free all day. Mclaren desperately need Fridays to gather lots of data from which we were able to do today. Been very unlucky this season with the amount of washed out Fridays we've had so it's been a refreshing change.

Also glad that the tyres were fine, I'm getting a bit bored of hearing so much about them it was good to see that there weren't any incidents. The less incidents the better as far as tyres are concerned!

Mclaren seem to be improving race by race. It's still possible that there could be race wins this year, weather conditions and luck may need to intervene but if we keep on improving it could be possible, anythings possible in F1 anyway!

And it would be truly awesome to see Mclaren getting podiums / wins at the back end of the season, trolling a few teams and thwarting, say, Hamilton's title hopes, just to see the reaction of all the Hamilton loving Jenson haters on here explode if nothing else :D :p
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Never mind all that You got to get in to Q3 first :D:D:D:D then finish in the top ten :D:D
 
My word, Jenson Button to replace Mark Webber is 5/1 on Sky Bet... Sky must be taking advantage of people that don't know anything about F1 at all!

Although it's not as though Horner doesn't like Jenson...

"Jenson's a class act, as a team player, a human being, a driver … he's done a great job in his career. He's not on our radar because he's not available. He's married to the team that he's driving for."

And he's contracted to Mclaren until the end of this year isn't he? I'm pretty sure it's undisclosed but I'm not sure what his contract clauses are on seat jumping.
 
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