Greenlizard0 Weekend Football Thread ** spoilers ** [1st - 4th December 2017]

Atkinson's trying to make his decision not to send Mignolet off seem not so bad with his performance today. He got pretty much everything wrong today.
 
BaZ87 said:
Watching motd and it's quite fitting how Arsenal scored from a mistake by Ramsey. Had he controlled that he'd have probably missed.

edit: and Koscielny's the biggest myth in football. He's by far the worst 'world class' defender I've ever seen.
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This is a decent post :cool: Koscieniny is decent in Fifa and thats about it!
 
Yea, I'm not sure Utd planned for De Gea to have to make more saves than any keeper in PL history.

It appears as if Mourinho was more confident of attacking Arsenal than previous away games because we all know Arsenal can crumble at any moment but I'm sure he planned on being stronger at the back. Utd were as bad as Arsenal were defensively though, if not worse, and it was only thanks to De Gea that they won.
SpeedFreak said:
In control - No
Endangered opponent - Yes.
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I'm really not sure how you can't see the difference between the two incidents. It's possible to seriously injure a player with any challenge - I can remember Djibril Cisse breaking his leg from a challenge that wasn't even a free-kick. Whether a challenge is considered serious foul play isn't determined by the outcome but by the risk/likelihood a player would get injured from a challenge like that.

Koscielny and Matic have ended up clashing heads and yes, Matic could have got injured but it was unfortunate rather than likely to happen because of the way he challenged. He's made a fairly standard attempt to win a header, he's not sprinted 30 meters and flown in with a diving header giving no consideration for anybody around him nor did he head-butt Matic. At worst you could argue it was reckless and worthy of a yellow card but that's it. Pogba's challenge is completely different though. As soon as you're stretching/lunging with a straight leg, your full force going down, studs first onto the opponent you're risking a serious injury. It's actually lucky that Bellerin's leg was flat on the ground because if his leg was planted normally there was a serious chance that Pogba would have snapped it had he caught him flush.
 
If bellarins foot had been planted he would have been nowhere near where pogbas foot landed. Any full blooded tackle could break a leg if the opposition players leg was planted in just the right spot. I think it was bellarin absolutely cleared Young out as he was breaking down the line. Nothing wrong with the tackle but if Young’s foot was planted in the wrong place he would have snapped like a twig.

It’s a pointless argument.
 
BaZ87 said:
I'm really not sure how you can't see the difference between the two incidents. It's possible to seriously injure a player with any challenge - I can remember Djibril Cisse breaking his leg from a challenge that wasn't even a free-kick. Whether a challenge is considered serious foul play isn't determined by the outcome but by the risk/likelihood a player would get injured from a challenge like that.

Koscielny and Matic have ended up clashing heads and yes, Matic could have got injured but it was unfortunate rather than likely to happen because of the way he challenged. He's made a fairly standard attempt to win a header, he's not sprinted 30 meters and flown in with a diving header giving no consideration for anybody around him nor did he head-butt Matic. At worst you could argue it was reckless and worthy of a yellow card but that's it. Pogba's challenge is completely different though. As soon as you're stretching/lunging with a straight leg, your full force going down, studs first onto the opponent you're risking a serious injury. It's actually lucky that Bellerin's leg was flat on the ground because if his leg was planted normally there was a serious chance that Pogba would have snapped it had he caught him flush.
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You argue that it was unfortunate that Matic got hurt, the same can surely be said for Bellerin. I believe both Koscielny and Pogba went for the ball, there was no intent, there was nothing inherently dangerous about what either did and while an opponent was injured they were both just footballing incidents. If Pogba had intended to land one on Bellerin is it not a little surprising that the Arsenal players weren't berating him?
 
SpeedFreak said:
You argue that it was unfortunate that Matic got hurt, the same can surely be said for Bellerin. I believe both Koscielny and Pogba went for the ball, there was no intent, there was nothing inherently dangerous about what either did and while an opponent was injured they were both just footballing incidents. If Pogba had intended to land one on Bellerin is it not a little surprising that the Arsenal players weren't berating him?
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No you can't say Bellerin was just unfortunate - he was put at risk by the way Pogba went into the challenge. As soon as you're lunging into a challenge with a straight leg and all your force going down into the challenge it's dangerous - if a ref (clearly) sees anybody challenge like that then they're getting sent off.
 
Are we still arguing over the Pogba sending off? :rolleyes:

Sure, Bellerin challenged in an odd way, but that doesn't excuse Pogba for standing on his leg. Pogba's intent is irrelevant, though I personally don't buy that he did it on purpose the only person who truly knows whether it was intentional or not is Pogba. On another note, it's nice to see Martin Atkinson follow up one stellar display with another yesterday in the Spurs game. I think refs who have a couple of bad performances should be dropped for a week. It might be he's got something going on in his personal life that's distracting him, because he's clearly not putting in decent performances. A player who played like that for multiple games would be dropped for their club.

Also, as much as I hate to admit it as a United fan, Liverpool's front three looked terrifying yesterday and they didn't even play Mane. They sure do play some nice counter-attacking football.
 
People debating something on a forum! What next? :p

I mentioned yesterday that Atkinson seemed to be trying to get everybody to forget about the Mignolet decision by getting every decision wrong yesterday. Spurs should have had a foul prior to Watford's first goal, Watford should have had a pen prior to Spurs' goal, the red card wasn't a red (I think one of his assistants gave that tbf) and then doesn't give a clear handball in the final moments for another Watford pen.

And yea, our counter attacking yesterday was a bit special. I was giving Brighton a bit of stick for sitting back even at 2-0 but it's easy to see why - the second they overcommitted in attack we sliced through them in a matter of seconds.
 
Ok so intent is irrelevant.

So if someone jumps for a header from a corner and lands on someone who has fallen over it's a straight red card? Good to know.
 
Shamikebab said:
Ok so intent is irrelevant.

So if someone jumps for a header from a corner and lands on someone who has fallen over it's a straight red card? Good to know.
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Have you answered your own question? No it wouldn't be a red card as they haven't done something that was likely to cause a serious injury, if they landed on a player and caused an injury it would have been a freak incident.

Using driving as an example - if you're driving at the speed limit and somebody steps in front of your car you might kill that person but it's completely accidental and there's no blame on your part. If you're driving at 80mph in a 30 and somebody steps in front of your car then you're going to prison whether you meant to hit that person or not. You're driving at a speed deemed to be unsafe and have increased the likelihood of killing that person by doing so.

The outcome of the challenge is irrelevant as is the intent. The only question the ref has to ask himself is whether the player making the challenge has done so in a way that risked causing a serious injury. If you don't think that lunging into a challenge with a straight leg, studs first going down into the opponent fits that criteria then fine but you're going to be constantly disappointed when players get sent off for it because, if seen, refs will always hand out reds for those challenges.
 
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