Greenlizard0 Weekend Football Thread ** spoilers ** [28th - 31st August 2015]

How many premier league games have we played this season? How many goals have we scored?

Awful. Lvg has no clue for tactics that suit our players and no players that suit hos tactics. Sad but fair and true. What bi done understand is how people failed to spot this last season?
 
The problem with stats :p

If you look at net spend this summer it could be interpreted in an even more depressing way or good business (I know which one I would side more with :o).

I'm slightly cynical as Woodward has been reported by many as being all about the bottom line and not about the football itself

The players are just assets for the business not human beings, or what the team actually need to perform better

When he is the person actually signing the players that's a worry
 
I really don't get your Woodward point Frank. In every way you could look at it, Woodward has been spent far more than Gill spent before him. All clubs will base valuations on a number of factors, from ability to age, resale value etc but you've spent far more than before and probably anybody else over the past 3 summers.
 
Woodward is a businessman but buying players is just that, he'll do what LvG instructs him to do and isn't afraid to spend money to get what we need.

I'm mainly worried LvG doesn't think we can be improved without a real superstar player, which is of course ludicrous.

Our midfield is quite well balanced in the middle and full back positions, but there are still a lot of issues:

Goalkeeper (De Gea is probably going so need the best replacement possible)
Centre back (Smalling is OK but Blind has been exposed)
All attacking positions (Not good at all)
 
Would £120m get Griezmann and Reus? That's an idea.

Probably, and they're great players, but surely the focus should be on a top striker, centre back and keeper? Signing three "wingers" in one window, when you've got such significant other deficiencies, won't significantly help you.
 
Gary Neville said:
"They've not got enough cutting edge. They haven't got players who can beat players in the final third, they don't create enough. For me they get lulled into thinking they are playing football really well.

"They dominate possession but they don't dominate matches. You dominate a match by scoring goals and playing at a high tempo. Win the game and then control possession."
This could easily be about Rodgers and Liverpool.
 
Probably, and they're great players, but surely the focus should be on a top striker, centre back and keeper? Signing three "wingers" in one window, when you've got such significant other deficiencies, won't significantly help you.

What top striker? And both of them can and have operated in striker roles before.

Not sure what top centre back is out there, really.

"We were the dominant team but need to score" - Brendan van Gaal :(

And "Today's result doesn't affect transfers" but surely it must.
 
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LVG saying they were the dominant team on Sky right now... is he on crack? People who see possession as dominance are idiots.

I agree. I'd rather have much less of the ball but be a dangerous counter attacking team.

Even possession wise we weren't that dominant really, especially in the second half.
 
What top striker? And both of them can and have operated in striker roles before.

Not sure what top centre back is out there, really.

I agree, but spaffing £120m on players in positions where you're less short seems wrong.

£60m bid for Varane? Maybe 30 for Laporte? Even 20 for Williams would really test Swansea and strengthen you significantly. What's Garay up to now?

Up top, if Arsenal are pursuing Benzema you should be too. Bacca would have been a good signing although not top, top class. Even Llorente as a short term solution could have worked.

Edit: and if you're willing to take the risk on Griezmann or Reus working in the Prem, why not try Lacazzette?
 
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I agree, but spaffing £120m on players in positions where you're less short seems wrong.

£60m bid for Varane? Maybe 30 for Laporte? Even 20 for Williams would really test Swansea and strengthen you significantly. What's Garay up to now?

Up top, if Arsenal are pursuing Benzema you should be too. Bacca would have been a good signing although not top, top class. Even Llorente as a short term solution could have worked.

Edit: and if you're willing to take the risk on Griezmann or Reus working in the Prem, why not try Lacazzette?

Laporte's release clause is £36.5m (I think), given how Bilbao work we might be pushed for time. We have been linked though. Don't think RM will let Varane go under any circumstances.

I don't think Beznema will go either. We need to look at teams below the very, very top level and pluck the best we can.

Reus or Griezmann
Zlatan Ibrahimovic (on loan or whatever)
Laporte
Pogba

Get it done (not sure about keeper). :p
 
I'm not criticising Reus or Griezmann, although they're no better than Di Maria was when he joined you. But for me, you're better off getting Laporte, two "risky" strikers in the hope that one works, and a keeper.

Edit: I forgot Mandzukic went to Juve, nearly suggested him. Absolutely top player
 
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I really don't get your Woodward point Frank. In every way you could look at it, Woodward has been spent far more than Gill spent before him. All clubs will base valuations on a number of factors, from ability to age, resale value etc but you've spent far more than before and probably anybody else over the past 3 summers.

Transfer fees have gone up considerably (because of the huge TV deals etc) so its not surprising Woodward has spent more.

Its also a well reported point that Fergie didn't spend much at all in the last few years he was at the club. Which is why by the time Moyes arrived majority of the squad wasn't good enough or was too old for the EPL (which is shown in how many LvG has already shipped out for little to no money coming in - in comparison)

You have to be completely crazy if you think that Utd couldn't attract a better centre half than Blind (and probably even Smalling), and it wouldn't even be a case of waiting on the bench - they would step into the first team straight away.

Even this morning there were reports that Utd were not interested in Laporte because he was too expensive at @£35m (which isn't exactly a huge fee for someone highly thought of as Laporte is meant to be, and is still pretty young)

If we really wasted Barca's time talking about Neymar (who is never likely to leave, and has multiple years left on his contract) instead of going for Pedro (who would have helped us considerably, probably even getting another 2 points vs Newcastle and probably 1 today if not 3 - while weakening a direct competitor) - our targets are a complete joke.

Someone like Neymar is never likely to come to Utd with the rest of the squad (excluding a very few) so terrible. You have to build the squad up and get it balanced in all areas of the pitch and then get a marque signing (otherwise the marquee is never likely to get the ball anyway so its pointless anyway)

Depay (in the EPL) is good in flashes but all summer Ive been saying he should be a substitute until he gets more used to the EPL, Mata is adequate but nothing more on the other flank and kills any pace we might have on the break. May get more space in general in Europe, will have to wait and see but at the moment he is too invisible in the league to keep giving him starts.

Romero (very weak) , Darmian /Smalling /Shaw - fantastic so far but we desperately need another proper centre half - which was blatantly obvious last season. Midfield is ok - but attacking options are non - existant.

Most of this was blatantly obvious last season - and apart from midfield (and Darmian) , nothing has changed in the window at all.
 
Not convinced most of them would want to move, tbh, considering if they were available other (more appealing) clubs would be interested.

Maybe, but we aren't that unappealing (despite your protests) and have as much money as anyone.

Either way, we should have a list of other targets, it's not like we need the ones on my list to improve the team...
 
I agree, but spaffing £120m on players in positions where you're less short seems wrong.

£60m bid for Varane? Maybe 30 for Laporte? Even 20 for Williams would really test Swansea and strengthen you significantly. What's Garay up to now?

Up top, if Arsenal are pursuing Benzema you should be too. Bacca would have been a good signing although not top, top class. Even Llorente as a short term solution could have worked.

Edit: and if you're willing to take the risk on Griezmann or Reus working in the Prem, why not try Lacazzette?

Garay didn't do very well at RM reportedly so wouldn't want to touch him, too much of a risk imo. Laporte (or before City) Otamendi I would have bitten your hand off for a month ago (and Otamendi wanted to come to the EPL). Varane isn't an option as Robbo said.

Lacezette I think extended his contact again recently for another year, but at this point why not - Griezmann I'm really not sure about being viable (would be fantastic player, just links appear tenuous at best). Llorente just moved too I think


Reus has hardly been mentioned at all in any rumours - seems like ages ago he was linked with a move to RM, but that hasn't happened. Seems a die-hard BD "fan" though, so doubt it would be an easy deal to do
 
Transfer fees have gone up considerably (because of the huge TV deals etc) so its not surprising Woodward has spent more.

True but as I said, no matter how you look at it (even factoring in football inflation, Woodward has been far looser with the purse strings than Gill was.
I
ts also a well reported point that Fergie didn't spend much at all in the last few years he was at the club.

I know and you have to ask yourself why. Taggart was never afraid of spending previously.

I'm not sure the rest of your post has any relevance to what I said. Again, I find your complaint that Woodward is buying assets rather than footballers strange - I certainly don't think the amounts you've spent on Mata, Fellaini, Di Maria etc were great financial decisions anyway.

edit: Not to mention the £20m burnt on 1 season from Falcao.
 
Man U are in a kind of awkward area these days for transfers, as they have the money for very good players but those players can be afforded by other teams too who can (currently) offer better chances of silverware.

I think they'll have to do a City soon, ***** an absolute fortune to really get the best in and then build slowly from there, otherwise it's going to be a difficult catch up game for them.

That money also needs to be spent in the right places though, the transfer policy so far seems a bit haphazard and targeted more at what name they can get rather than what position they need.
 
True but as I said, no matter how you look at it (even factoring in football inflation, Woodward has been far looser with the purse strings than Gill was.
.

Turning Utd into the Arsenal of the last few years - trying to "gaurentee" top 4 without spending over the top?

The options to improve the team drastically are definitely out there - so that isn't a viable excuse.

I know and you have to ask yourself why. Taggart was never afraid of spending previously.

I'm not sure the rest of your post has any relevance to what I said. Again, I find your complaint that Woodward is buying assets rather than footballers strange - I certainly don't think the amounts you've spent on Mata, Fellaini, Di Maria etc were great financial decisions anyway.

edit: Not to mention the £20m burnt on 1 season from Falcao.

Fellaini HAD to be bought to show Utd could still do it - remember how desperate Utd were to sign anyone that summer, and right at the death Utd got Fellaini..... even Mata (in Jan) could be argued it really wasn't what Utd needed at the time. Utd had to show they were backing Moyes somehow.

Compared to how much Falcao was to buy (~£50m before wages) it was worth a punt. It didn't come off, but it was worth it at the time.

There have been a lot of reports that Utd have shied away from deals because they are too expensive - even though they are comparative (or even cheap) in comparison to some other EPL deals going through in the same time frame.
 
Shied away yet offered £120m for Neymar? It's either all a bit desperate or the media are full of lies, I think it's a bit of both as there's no way LVG will be satisfied with Romero as GK and Rooney as the only ST option. Disappointing not to see Wilson on the bench at least.
 
Man U are in a kind of awkward area these days for transfers, as they have the money for very good players but those players can be afforded by other teams too who can (currently) offer better chances of silverware.

We could have sealed both the Pedro and Otamendi deals well before Chelsea and City got them over the line, whats sad is that we didn't even fight for them.

Considering how this season is going - with both of those players, we would be well ahead of Chelsea and not too far behind City (if at all) - and I honestly don't think we would be that far away from competing properly for silverware - edit would still need a striker and gk, but with better centre half I doubt we would have conceded at all today)
That money also needs to be spent in the right places though, the transfer policy so far seems a bit haphazard and targeted more at what name they can get rather than what position they need.

I agree about that - too interested in a big "name" rather than positions that can be radically improved
 
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Turning Utd into the Arsenal of the last few years - trying to "gaurentee" top 4 without spending over the top?

The options to improve the team drastically are definitely out there - so that isn't a viable excuse.



Fellaini HAD to be bought to show Utd could still do it - remember how desperate Utd were to sign anyone that summer, and right at the death Utd got Fellaini..... even Mata (in Jan) could be argued it really wasn't what Utd needed at the time. Utd had to show they were backing Moyes somehow.

Compared to how much Falcao was to buy (~£50m before wages) it was worth a punt. It didn't come off, but it was worth it at the time.

There have been a lot of reports that Utd have shied away from deals because they are too expensive - even though they are comparative (or even cheap) in comparison to some other EPL deals going through in the same time frame.

:confused:

I've not said there aren't players out there that can improve you or whether anybody had to be signed or not.

Forget 'reports' because quite often they're bs. Look at what's actually happened. Giving Rooney that mega contract, spending ott on Fellaini, Mata and Di Maria and spending what you did to loan Falcao were not business decisions. Nobody can say any of those decisions made good financial sense or represented good value. Woodward has shown that he'll spend what it takes to tie down, sign and loan players.

Why Utd haven't signed a CB or a striker is anyone's guess but criticising Woodward's willingness to spend seems misguided. There might be an argument that he's been naïve in the market and allowed Utd to be played by players wanting new contracts etc but he's been prepared to spend the money when he's had the chance to.
 
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