GT86/GR86/BRZ

Yea It's a shame they don't do any hot hatches now except for the limited Yaris GRMN :/

They are doing a 2.0 of the Corolla with 180hp, but that's nowhere near enough to make a heavy hybrid feel quick. Also AFAIK none of the Toyota/Lexus hybrids are tunable as the ECUs are encrypted and completely locked down, so it's never getting any better.
 
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Nasher said:
Yea It's a shame they don't do any hot hatches now except for the limited Yaris GRMN :/

They are doing a 2.0 of the Corolla with 180hp, but that's nowhere near enough to make a heavy hybrid feel quick. Also AFAIK none of the Toyota/Lexus hybrids are tunable as the ECUs are encrypted and completely locked down, so it's never getting any better.
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My i20 had a locked down ECU but could be written to directly on a bench so I got it tuned.

How about a super charger on the GT86? :p
 
rebel rebel said:
The Corolla looks quite nice, can they be driven in just electric mode?
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Can initiate "EV" Mode through a button just next to the Driving Mode switch (Sport, Normal or Eco). Up to about 35 it's fully electric then it forces the petrol engine to kick in to get any faster. You can only enter this mode if the battery is more than 60% charged from what I can tell.

Overall it's a pretty well designed system, engine only kicking in when the battery is low or if throttle is more than ~50%

I feel like a sporty version of the car would have to be completely revamped as it feels very high up and boat-like. It seems to grip pretty well but it gives you a bit of a sense of it being like a barge.
 
Yea it's a shame you can't make the EV side more aggressive and have it stack on more performance instead of be an eco thing. It's probably why they locked down the ECU or everyone would be doing it :/
 
It sounds ideal for getting me go the hospital and back for dialysis, 3 times a week, 1 mile each trip. But not too great for the days I take the dog to the beach and steam along the seafront and around some country lanes!

I quite like the Lexus RC if I ever decide to get something else.
 
The RC300h is nice, but doesn't really have the power to overcome it's own weight. So ends up a bit like an obese gt86. But I'd still have one if I had to buy a hybrid.
 
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Stephanie Peterson said:
Ugh... hybrid/electric cars..
Someone wake me up when they are 500kilo lighter, the weight kills any notion of them becoming "fun"
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To be fair, the Corolla is only 25kg heavier than the 86. Only with a lot more of a spongey suspension. Can tell the battery is in the back, it feels like it has a pretty 50:50 weight distribution.

Nasher said:
Yea it's a shame you can't make the EV side more aggressive and have it stack on more performance instead of be an eco thing. It's probably why they locked down the ECU or everyone would be doing it :/
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Definitely, it has a lot of "go" up til 30 mph then it struggles... a lot. :P
 
Nasher said:
Yea It's a shame they don't do any hot hatches now except for the limited Yaris GRMN :/

They are doing a 2.0 of the Corolla with 180hp, but that's nowhere near enough to make a heavy hybrid feel quick. Also AFAIK none of the Toyota/Lexus hybrids are tunable as the ECUs are encrypted and completely locked down, so it's never getting any better.
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You'll find it's more likely a case of nobody wants to put the time and effort into reverse engineering the ECUs rather than them being encrypted, it's such a small niche market.

Being able to read/write the ECU is about 10% of being able to tune the ECU, the other 90% is reverse engineering to understand how and when the ECU uses each of the potentially thousands of maps and whittling it down to a subset that you actually need to use to tune the car.
 
Frozennova said:
You'll find it's more likely a case of nobody wants to put the time and effort into reverse engineering the ECUs rather than them being encrypted, it's such a small niche market.

Being able to read/write the ECU is about 10% of being able to tune the ECU, the other 90% is reverse engineering to understand how and when the ECU uses each of the potentially thousands of maps and whittling it down to a subset that you actually need to use to tune the car.
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Yep, they have to be writeable since the manufacturers need to keep this open to them, they may need to push an update for loads of reasons.

I remember back in the days when the Scoobie ECUs were a black box, so you went aftermarket if you needed to change it.
Then one guy as a pet project spent enough time and cracked it, once he got to a certain point he did the lot really quickly. Then it was open season, comparing different ECUs was quick.

I suspect this is harder now as processing power has increased they can support better encryption, so the theory is the same, but the breaking could be harder if human intervention is required.

As you say its really a niche market though, most people dont want to mess with this area, as for most people they buy a car that meets the requirements at the start, they wont mod it (so dont need to adjust ecu), they dont want every possible BHP as it will reduce life potentially and will definately affect warranty, resaleability

I guess the cheap way of doing it (reflash existing ECU) will maybe die, there will be little to stop the full blown ECU swap still, but for many I guess the cost vs benefit is different in that scenario and only people who really need it will do it, where as an ECU flash is a cheap bang for your buck solution.
 
Frozennova said:
Encryption methods have gotten more complex and methods to work around it have followed. ECU Swaps are are also less simple than they used to be as you aren't just controlling the engine anymore as most of the car requires communication with the engine ECU to function properly.
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Yeah agree.
I guess to some extent its a question of if there is much more they will do or can do. My suspicion is sooner or later no, as we will start to see mainstream manufacturers putting less focus on ICE and more on hybrids/pure EV

Its basic economics taking place mainly, if its going to cost too much to allow a modified ECU to be available then the demand wont support the development.
If its cheap and easy to do, as in reality it sort of has been, then people will buy it.
People have relied on the fact they could reset them of course as well so the manufacturer wouldn't detect it, thats now harder as well as some are logging the changes, meaning more chance of rejected warranty work.
 
The ECUs as they are now will probably be replaced with basically a PC built in to the car, networking everything together. But then it makes it even easier to hack as the attack vector becomes huge.

And yea assume all changes made to the ECU are logged at a low level. Manufacturers/dealers can find out when a car has been remapped or clocked if they bother to look. You'd have to swap the whole ECU.
 
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Recall done. Overall time 2.5 days.

Picking my 86 back up tomorrow. Fingers, legs, toes, arms and everything else crossed whilst touching wood that there's no issues. Can't wait to get rid of this Corolla now. Good car but utterly lifeless and soul draining to drive.
 
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