have AMD stopped competing

ubersonic · 12 Feb 2018 at 12:14

4K8KW10 said:
Please calculate all the numbers for the Vega 64, and come with the figures. In the worst case the difference is 2%ish.

According to your charts the 295X2 is 24% faster than the Fury-X and the Vega 64 is ~27% faster than the Fury-X. That makes the Vega 64 comparatively faster than the 295X2.

Yes that's only ~3% but you said the Vega 64 "is not faster than Radeon R9 295X2" not that it wasn't more than a few % faster.

4K8KW10 · 12 Feb 2018 at 12:23

ubersonic said:
According to your charts the 295X2 is 24% faster than the Fury-X and the Vega 64 is ~27% faster than the Fury-X. That makes the Vega 64 comparatively faster than the 295X2.

Yes that's only ~3% but you said the Vega 64 "is not faster than Radeon R9 295X2" not that it wasn't more than a few % faster.

Vega 64 also has figures for the Power saving modes, what is the difference then?

2 or 3% is the statistical error. Gamers never feel or see such a difference.

NZXT30 · 12 Feb 2018 at 12:41

varkanoid said:
More likely they are just sitting back counting the money rolling in from the miners. They dont need to bring out new cards. They could then play the long game and use the money incoming for a better thought out card for 2019 and beyond.

This^

I really hope they take their time like they did with ryzen and release a kickass product that will shake the gpu market.

DELETED_195422 · 12 Feb 2018 at 12:53

Yes. AMD buying ATI was probably the worst thing that could've happened for the PC market. AMD didn't have the finances (even back then) to fund ATI the same way as Nvidia funded their R&D.

Look at what we have now, as of January 2018 AMD's GPU market share on Steam is a pathetic 8%.

Nvidia view consoles as the main threat now, not AMD.

LambChop · 12 Feb 2018 at 12:53

4K8KW10 said:
Mantle is NOT garbage

Waste of time, development, money and used in about 2/3 games. AMD would have been better investing that money into proper R&D. Their hype still didn't generate profit.

This is why AMD are lagging. They seem to continually back the wrong horse.

4K8KW10 · 12 Feb 2018 at 12:54

NZXT30 said:
This^

I really hope they take their time like they did with ryzen and release a kickass product that will shake the gpu market.

The thing is if Nvidia would allow it to happen. GPUs are not CPUs, and Nvidia is not Intel to fall asleep for 5 years, doing incremental updates.
I'd rather expect the distance between GeForce and Radeons to further increase.
Imagine the upcoming Amperes what will do to Vega 64.

Vega 64 will fall to the GTX 2050 - GTX 2060 level of performance and with the upcoming lack of anything new from AMD, their graphics cards department is in a deep trouble.

This is the chance for Nvidia to force AMD RTG bankrupt.

LambChop · 12 Feb 2018 at 12:54

NZXT30 said:
This^

I really hope they take their time like they did with ryzen and release a kickass product that will shake the gpu market.

They absolutely need to, I would welcome that in a heartbeat.

4K8KW10 · 12 Feb 2018 at 13:06

Rock_n_Roll said:
Yes. AMD buying ATI was probably the worst thing that could've happened for the PC market. AMD didn't have the finances (even back then) to fund ATI the same way as Nvidia funded their R&D.

Look at what we have now, as of January 2018 AMD's GPU market share on Steam is a pathetic 8%.

Nvidia view consoles as the main threat now, not AMD.

Absolutely.
And it gets even worse because AMD confuse and lie mostly themselves that the demand is for cards below RX 480/ RX 580. The thing is that the customers don't buy into that confusion.

hominid · 12 Feb 2018 at 13:33

4K8KW10 said:
Absolutely.
And it gets even worse because AMD confuse and lie mostly themselves that the demand is for cards below RX 480/ RX 580. The thing is that the customers don't buy into that confusion.

Haha... You don't know what most customers buy AT ALL. An RX 470 is still a respectable card for 1080p, even a 460 with a few settings turned down some will do ok.

We are coming to a point where APU's will do 1080p fine, so the likes of NVidia without the license for x86/64 will be shut of of the market completely on the lower end. It'll start with the lower end cards going, even intel are using the Vega architecture to boost their graphics capability so you won't get NVidia with Intel laptops any more either.

That's why NVidia diversified into other markets, AI, automotive etc, they could see this coming years ago.

4K8KW10 · 12 Feb 2018 at 13:35

hominid said:
Haha... You don't know what most customers buy AT ALL.

Sure

The other member posted the number of 8% Steam share for AMD cards for nothing?!

Shiari · 12 Feb 2018 at 13:37

4K8KW10 said:
No, man
You just don't appreciate it. Of course, the R9 295X2 is the better one because it is still a single card. AMD hasn't created anything dual-GPU card afterwards.

Have you looked at the verdict written by the reviewers?

I bought the card back then because it was a reasonable offer, and based on many reviews. Yes, great card, and I did appreciate it a lot ... but it's only great when CrossFire works. Mostly though it means running out of VRAM with a large resolution screen, and waiting for CF support or still having to cope with things such as flickering in places. It was also quite noisy, a single 120 rad isn't going to offer super cooling, and I often had throttling issues because of that.

I still stand by that the Vega 64 is a much better card, even in the basic reference edition. Vega 64 also idles a lot lower.

4K8KW10 said:
This is the chance for Nvidia to force AMD RTG bankrupt.

And that would benefit us consumers in what way exactly?

RavenXXX2 · 12 Feb 2018 at 13:44

AMD are done in the discrete GPU business.

Rroff · 12 Feb 2018 at 13:45

4K8KW10 said:
Absolutely.
And it gets even worse because AMD confuse and lie mostly themselves that the demand is for cards below RX 480/ RX 580. The thing is that the customers don't buy into that confusion.

Generally the biggest sales volumes are the like one up from slowest and one down from fastest mid-range cards - AMD wasn't actually that misguided with the idea of focusing on trying to pickup the mid-range area with the 480 but the problem is consumer perception - they can't carry that indefinitely without a halo card that is in the same ballpark as the top dog even if it isn't the top dog.

The current top 4 on Steam HW survey for instance are the 1060 (impossible to know how much of that is the slower one). 960. 750ti and 1050ti.

humbug · 12 Feb 2018 at 13:58

Yes.

AMD have not been able to sell enough cards to remain competitive, its down to mindshare, even if 'as they have been' AMD cards are as good as nVidia's or even better people still buy nVidia.

Years of that has drained AMD of funds, no funds no R&D, no R&D no new cards.

AMD know they cannot ever make any money in Gaming GPU's and they will probably never bother making a serious gaming GPU ever again.

ubersonic · 12 Feb 2018 at 14:27

humbug said:
its down to mindshare, even if 'as they have been' AMD cards are as good as nVidia's or even better people still buy nVidia.

It's been like that for like 25 years though and they haven't died yet. Plus you can replace the words "cards" and "Nvidia" with "CPUs" and "Intel" and it's just as applicable, didn't stop them punching back with Ryzen. Never count anyone out in this business until they're out. Hell 20 years ago all the smart money/forecasts had Apple out of business by 2005 lol.

sideways14a · 12 Feb 2018 at 14:27

Folk were saying the same thing about AMD and there CPUs not long ago, things can change very quickly..

humbug · 12 Feb 2018 at 14:34

It took AMD 6 years to recover from Bulldozer.

AMD may make a Ryzen GPU comeback somewhere down the line but don't forget they will still be stuck with the same problem that got them to this stage in the first place, even when their GPU's are good people still buy more nVidia than AMD need people to buy theirs.
If people don't buy your cards no matter what you can never be competitive.

LambChop · 12 Feb 2018 at 14:35

ubersonic said:
It's been like that for like 25 years though and they haven't died yet. Plus you can replace the words "cards" and "Nvidia" with "CPUs" and "Intel" and it's just as applicable, didn't stop them punching back with Ryzen. Never count anyone out in this business until they're out. Hell 20 years ago all the smart money/forecasts had Apple out of business by 2005 lol.

AMD crippled ATI. They should never have bought them over. I think they should now sell that branch off and concentrate on CPU's and let someone else take over.

JediFragger · 12 Feb 2018 at 14:37

Rock_n_Roll said:
Nvidia view consoles as the main threat now, not AMD.

Yup, it's the only way they have to keep their (non-miner) prices in the realm of sanity or people will just switch in their droves!

humbug · 12 Feb 2018 at 14:39

Which also helps AMD ^^^^ just not in a way that people here would like, it just confirms AMD are better off scaling back and selling IP to MS and Intel and the likes...

LambChop said:
AMD crippled ATI. They should never have bought them over. I think they should now sell that branch off and concentrate on CPU's and let someone else take over.

The last ATI GPU was the 3000 series, the first AMD GPU was the HD 4000 series.

AMD saved ATI from oblivion.

Competitor rules

have AMD stopped competing

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