HGVs in the outside lane - Is this allowed?

[ChroniC]

Same, on my commute to work i generally get behind a truck and stick the cruise control on, so much more chilled out no endless speeding up and slowing down as trucks usually maintain a steady speed. I just laugh at those that think you have a slow lane, middle lane and fast lane. Been flashed so many times for overtaking a car in the middle lane doing 65, me doing 70 in the outside.
Was flashed last night on my way home when the M62 signs flashed up 40, how dare i do 40 when Mr important wants to do 80+

Frankly I'd say your worse than my important.
Fine he's breaking the law but you contradict yourself.
If your happy cruising behind someone why pull out into an overtaking lane to overtake someone's who's only doing marginally slower than you.
That extra 5mph aint gona get you anywhere and your getting in the way of many other people.

I know it's a grey area because we have this culture of slow Middle and fast. Even I said it out of habit and I always overtake people in the middle lane and then pull straight into the slow lane which is empty to prove a point.
Drives me crackers..

I advocate removal of the speed limits or variable speed limits in each lane under good conditions so that overtaking is quicker and a minimum speed limit. Plus I'd like to see lane hoggers punished. I.e if you haven't overtaken the car on your inside with a few hundred metres then you shouldn't be in the overtaking lane. (or something similar)

I suffer one of the worse stretches of motorway everyday the m27. Seriously the amount of people who if they just stopped lane hogging would free up so much room.

Most biggest pet peeve of all time.. Is in a traffic jam at 5 to 10mph not being a cars length away at all times. Those people who leave 50metre gaps (because they can't go anywhere) are the reason the queue exists in the first place. I honk them to move and they always look so confused.. It enrages me that they're soo stupid

 

[robj20]

Frankly I'd say your worse than my important.
Fine he's breaking the law but you contradict yourself.
If your happy cruising behind someone why pull out into an overtaking lane to overtake someone's who's only doing marginally slower than you.
That extra 5mph aint gona get you anywhere and your getting in the way of many other people.

I know it's a grey area because we have this culture of slow Middle and fast. Even I said it out of habit and I always overtake people in the middle lane and then pull straight into the slow lane which is empty to prove a point.
Drives me crackers..

I advocate removal of the speed limits or variable speed limits in each lane under good conditions so that overtaking is quicker and a minimum speed limit. Plus I'd like to see lane hoggers punished. I.e if you haven't overtaken the car on your inside with a few hundred metres then you shouldn't be in the overtaking lane. (or something similar)

I dont contradict myself at all you just dont read my post properly.
"On my commute i generally" that leaves weekend where the roads are much quieter when i generally stick the cruise to 70. Even without cruise control its not difficult to keep a steady speed.

I almost never speed anymore my car has a auto limiter on so it just reads the road signs and limits my speed to that, that and dynamic cruise make it all very stress free, but it can wind others up but you know what i really don't care if they want to do 40 in a 30, overtake me.

 

[Joe T]

Yesterday on the M42 I saw two vehicles ignore two red 'X's on a closed Lane 1. 1 was a van marked up as a driver training vehicle (!) and the 2nd was an HGV. The HGV then seemed a bit surprised to come up on a stranded vehicle. He then had to stop, put his indicator and wait for someone in Lane 2 to stop (and thus hold up all the traffic) to let him out. Fortunately an isolated case of an HGV drvier doing this, but van drivers are more frequent perpetrators.

 

[Fusion]

Frankly I'd say your worse than my important.
Fine he's breaking the law but you contradict yourself.
If your happy cruising behind someone why pull out into an overtaking lane to overtake someone's who's only doing marginally slower than you.
That extra 5mph aint gona get you anywhere and your getting in the way of many other people.

I know it's a grey area because we have this culture of slow Middle and fast. Even I said it out of habit and I always overtake people in the middle lane and then pull straight into the slow lane which is empty to prove a point.
Drives me crackers..

I advocate removal of the speed limits or variable speed limits in each lane under good conditions so that overtaking is quicker and a minimum speed limit. Plus I'd like to see lane hoggers punished. I.e if you haven't overtaken the car on your inside with a few hundred metres then you shouldn't be in the overtaking lane. (or something similar)

I suffer one of the worse stretches of motorway everyday the m27. Seriously the amount of people who if they just stopped lane hogging would free up so much room.

Most biggest pet peeve of all time.. Is in a traffic jam at 5 to 10mph not being a cars length away at all times. Those people who leave 50metre gaps (because they can't go anywhere) are the reason the queue exists in the first place. I honk them to move and they always look so confused.. It enrages me that they're soo stupid

This attitude sums up our problems. Some people aren’t interested in the rules and laws, they think their way is best. Yet they’re quick to quote the book when they see behaviour they don’t like.

 

[Joe T]

Most biggest pet peeve of all time.. Is in a traffic jam at 5 to 10mph not being a cars length away at all times. Those people who leave 50metre gaps (because they can't go anywhere) are the reason the queue exists in the first place. I honk them to move and they always look so confused.. It enrages me that they're soo stupid

Actually we should encourage smooth driving in traffic jams, certainly not ensuring that cars are never a few feet away from each as this causes more heavy braking and accelerating which means the queue will never dissipate.

 

[ChroniC]

Actually we should encourage smooth driving in traffic jams, certainly not ensuring that cars are never a few feet away from each as this causes more heavy braking and accelerating which means the queue will never dissipate.

How., I said leaving huge gaps is bad. What's bad about doing the same speed as everyone else with the correct braking distance.
Leaving huge gaps for no reasons just has a massive knock on effect. Same goes for slow overtaking

 

[Resident]

Yesterday on the M42 I saw two vehicles ignore two red 'X's on a closed Lane 1. 1 was a van marked up as a driver training vehicle (!) and the 2nd was an HGV. The HGV then seemed a bit surprised to come up on a stranded vehicle. He then had to stop, put his indicator and wait for someone in Lane 2 to stop (and thus hold up all the traffic) to let him out. Fortunately an isolated case of an HGV drvier doing this, but van drivers are more frequent perpetrators.

Someone I know once suggested place retractable stinger devices in the road around 100yrds after the gantries. The premise being that it would be activated by a vehicle passing under the 2nd red X.

Its a daft notion but I can't help wondering if it'd work

 

[Joe T]

Someone I know once suggested place retractable stinger devices in the road around 100yrds after the gantries. The premise being that it would be activated by a vehicle passing under the 2nd red X.

Its a daft notion but I can't help wondering if it'd work

 

[russell664]

And there’s no way that speed limit can be changed? I’ve been tailgating doing 50ish countless times and overtaken by them and it sure seems too quick for 56mph. Same with loads of company and parcel delivery transit vans that sometimes have stickers on the back saying limited to 60 or 70mph when all I ever see is them in the outside lane keeping up with everyone who are easily doing 80+

Remember that your speedo is out for 5/10% so you're actually goi ng slower than you think you are. The limiters are set to true speed, so they will appear to be going faster than you at the same speed.
I think HGV's have to be calibrated - so they maintain actual speed, and thinking about it to work out transport times better.

 

[Nasher]

For 56mph you will need to be doing more like 60 on the clock.

 

[ChroniC]

This attitude sums up our problems. Some people aren’t interested in the rules and laws, they think their way is best. Yet they’re quick to quote the book when they see behaviour they don’t like.

Not at all. Quite the opposite. The laws are not fit for purpose anymore due to the quantity of cars. Legally you can have 1 truck doing 50 and a car overtaking at 55 and another at 60. That is ludicrous and would end up with tailbacks on a busy motorway (which everywhere is now)
There are a lot of self riteous people who think they are within the law because the stay under 70 sitting in the middle lane because 1mile down the road they see a truck. Not pulling in and then pulling back out is illegal.
However then when you do pull in as a law abiding citizen, you get someone sitting on your inside backwheel doing the same speed so when you meet the truck and want to pull out you can't. You slow down and then have to try speeding up again or struggle to ever get out of the 1st lane.

It would be easier to make it simple. Have a minimum speed per overtaking lane. No maximum. That way every can do 60 in first but must get to 70 to overtake or 80 to overtake them. It means 3 lanes cannot be occupied by the same speed.

I know the problem is having a minimum speed limit is inforeacble because of weather condition and traffic conditions etc. They just need to much much harder on middle lane hoggers.

I am happy that L drivers now have to learn this but frankly it's the older generation who need the lessons

 

[Entai]

The law is the law whether you agree with it or not.

Speed limits are exactly that a limit pure and simple, certainly never ever a target that you must attain.

The sooner they bring in proper smart cars whereby the vehicle knows exactly the limit and never exceeds it ant any point, and where every vehicle talks to all those around it and they all adjust speed and
course appropriately and safely, the better.

 

[ChroniC]

On that we agree.

 

[robj20]

For 56mph you will need to be doing more like 60 on the clock.

Don't try that in all cars, mine is a fraction over 1mph out. 51 is as near as makes no difference 50.

 

[Entai]

How., I said leaving huge gaps is bad. What's bad about doing the same speed as everyone else with the correct braking distance.
Leaving huge gaps for no reasons just has a massive knock on effect. Same goes for slow overtaking

However what you appear to be missing is that the correct braking distance at 70 or 80 does in fact leave a huge gap between vehicles.

When you drive on a road with the chevron spacers, and you are following the car in front with the full clear two chevrons distance, which is in fact virtually 3 chevrons, as to have two fully clear ones, the vehicle in front will be over one, you will see two fully clear ones, and you will be pretty much over the fourth, that is the correct driving distance at 70mph, that is in fact a pretty darn huge gap, but is the correct thinking and braking distance according to the law.

Travelling at 70mph, stopping distance is 96 metres.
Chevrons are 40m apart
So if the vehicle in front is on chevron one, and you are on chevron 3, that's only 80 metres, (one clear one between you)
If you are on chevron 4 you are on 120 metres.
So if you can see 2 clear chevrons between you, you are about 100 metres. Bingo, the correct safe braking distance.

And yes I know cars have better brakes etc than when the system was first imposed, but that is not a legal excuse in a court of law.

Although failure to comply with various rules of The Highway Code will not, in itself, cause a person to be prosecuted, the Highway Code may be used in evidence in any court proceedings under the Road Traffic Acts to establish liability, and establishing liability is pretty much 8 out of ten times, establishing guilt of an offence.

 

[Nasher]

If everyone drove 100m apart on the motorway, the traffic would be even worse. Last time cars needed 100m to stop from 70 was when they used drum brakes all round.

 

[Outcast]

Depends how worn out the trucks tyres are on the drive axle.

That and if the workshops has increased the "over-read percentage". We have about 30 Scanias that have that done. Basicially when the speedo reads 56mph we are actually doing 53mph, now remove two inches of tyre rubber and it's a drastic difference especially for us night trunkers going long distance.

Oh, Those Scanias are locked to economy mode too. No kick-down, ALL manual gear modes disabled after 30mph and that stupid eco-roll locked to enable !

Re: Truck in outside lane....

It's PLATED WEIGHT not actual weight. So a bobtail unit (44t) could be prosecuted for nipping through a 7.5t zone if the driver has no legitimate reason for being there. (And if the copper can be bothered)

That section of the M6N (Knutsford roadworks) is notorious for numpties dualling up and letting their speed drop right down to 38mph, refusing to go by each other. I'm not surprised that bobtail truck thought "Sod that" and nipped passed them. It should be noted there is an off duty DVSA person deliberately riling truckers into doing that and then reporting them (one of ours got reported).

 

[Entai]

Most biggest pet peeve of all time.. Is in a traffic jam at 5 to 10mph not being a cars length away at all times. Those people who leave 50metre gaps (because they can't go anywhere) are the reason the queue exists in the first place. I honk them to move and they always look so confused.. It enrages me that they're soo stupid

Afraid to say I am one of those, I always leave a big gap in front of me in a slow moving queue.

But then I can see further up the road, yeah sorry about that I am also one of those weirdo's that look as far as I can see into the distance and not just at the number plate of the car in front, so I can see that the queue in the distance is concertinering up again, so I leave a huge gap, travel at a slower speed so by the time I reach the concertina, that has usually come to a stop before moving again, they are in fact moving again, so I keep moving all the time, and do not have to come to a stop every 10 meters, then accelerate, then stop, then accelerate, etc etc I just keep moving all the time.

 

[lordrobs]

Eventually we'll look back and rue the day dashcams became a thing. It's yesterdays indignant headlight flashers and the terminally paranoids latest hobby it seems. The way people go on about getting them you'd think our roads are like those in Russia rather than basically the safest on the planet.

I'll hold my hands up and admit that I've got one in my car BUT I've never felt the need to upload any footage. In fact in approximately 6 years of having one I've taken the card out twice to actually view the footage. Once to get the reg of a fly tipper we spotted and another time when I thought someone had thrown something at my car on the A47 which turned out to be a false alarm as viewing the footage showed it was debris on the road that got flicked up at a weird angle. Yet somehow there are people who manage to have whole YouTube channels of clips and they don't exactly come across as being Mr Sales rep covering 50k a year!

 

[Semple]

On normal road conditions most HGV's i come across tend to be absolutely fine.

During average speed check zones... most then become a law unto themselves.

They turn into a bunch of impatient ***** who want to stick at ~55mph and try and push all the cars to the inside lane, yet when it comes to a gap in the avg speed check zones and all the cars return to 70mph, they just overtake the HGV's again, and we're now back to square 1.

The majority of the cars will actually stick to ~50 during these zones, and i'm certain that due to the large wheels on HGV's a cars indicated 50 is probably something like a 47 in a HGV.

Either way it makes absolutely no logical sense for them to perform these overtaking manoeuvres during these zones.