If next year's consoles do 4k/60..

[Undesirable]

Then how do you justify a £1000 gpu?

A 1000 GPU was never justified.

Does everyone suddenly demand 4k 120fps?

I demanded 4k @ 120 FPS two years ago. I haven't gotten it since; what I got was a £1000 GPU that still couldn't manage a stable 120FPS @ 4k but did have raytracing at mediocre framerates @ 1080p. And the risk of the card only being able to play Space Invaders.

I don't really understand what route pc gaming will take. Cyberpunk will be amazing on pc, but if its 4k/60 on a next gen console then why even bother with pc?

Cyberpunk doesn't look to have revolutionary graphics. Not compared to how The Witcher 3 was supposed to be graphically revolutionary as shown at E3. But the Witcher 3 was downgraded from E3. This time they've tried to hype up Cyberpunk with storyline cutscenes and Keanu Reeves rather than revolutionary graphics, then casually mention on the side that we'll get raytracing (which was nowhere to be seen in a live demo at E3). Raytracing is the true next gen feature, but you can bet it will be light on the ground ( ) as upcoming consoles will not be capable of all raytracing features and so it'll be downgraded (or never fully realised in the first place for PCs).

The gap seems to be closing and either consoles or things like stadia could finally change the pc gaming world in a way people used to claim for years.

Stadia is yet another streaming service for something you don't physically own. I say the enjoyment / novelty of owning your own hardware and physically having it sat in front of you will last a while yet. Plus there are the compression artifacts and latency worries that aren't going away anytime soon.

 

[DELETED_195422]

60FPS won't be a standard on consoles next year, nevermind 4K/60.

I thought about buying into next gen consoles, then sobered up at even the thought of doing so when i weigh in the pros and cons.

With the lack of a open digital market, it's closed nature, the reliance on retail (i hate physical media and value space), no free online gaming, pay-walled features, ***** network speeds (PSN is held together with duct tape and glue, XBL is only slightly better and Nintendo, well, lets not even go there), lack of original IP, a non existent strategy genre, almost no mod support, it's focus on AAA and sequels, lack of I/O options, adverts embedded within the interface, only 1 of the 3 support digital refunds, etc.

The only positive aspect going for consoles is their very few exclusive first party titles. Everything else, and i do mean everything else, is a step backwards.

Also, don't believe the hype. Console focused games media are useless. Everything is "brilliant" according to them. You see it all the time whenever a high profile exclusive or new console gets released. It's just marketing BS.

You'll see the same nonsense when these next systems arrive next year.

2020 onwards is going to be an exciting period for PC gaming with more competition/new tech (GPU/CPUs) from Nvidia/AMD/Intel on PC, HDMI 2.1 GPUs will have hit the market too, Ray Tracing performance will be increased, 4K/VRR/HDR compatible TVs will be available and less expensive. VR tech will be improving too and we'll finally see Valve's AAA titles within this space at some point.

 

[Maldoror]

Today Ubisoft's earnings report showed that PC overtook PS4 as their main money spinner. And this is coming from a company which has often shunned the PC in the past and developed Uplay as an afterthought once they realised how far they were behind the likes of Valve (and let's face it, even Origin).

PC's probably in a better state than it's ever been and the gap between the PC and consoles remains large in terms of the experience. For example, an Xbox One X can do "4K" as a tickbox on a spec-sheet but realistically most games are upscaled or lose key graphical settings and the experience isn't even close to a high-end PC. The winter 2020 Xbox will do 8k.. do we really think it's going to fare much better than the Xbox One X?

More dangerous is the push for game-streaming. I say dangerous because the end result is garbage: even if we get rid of every last compression artefact, physics will prevent the result every approaching the response of a locally rendered scene. It also means the end for practical gaming modding and risks being extremely anti-consumer by making games a subscription that can be 'turned off' whenever the publisher chooses. No more ancient games kept alive by thriving communities, servers, etc. It has its place of course - and may rightfully kill off the bulky gaming laptop for when you just want to play Civ in a hotel room. But it's not a premium experience nor a consumer friendly one at its core.

The PC remains the place for the high end gaming experience - and for supporting an ecosystem of tools around which gaming communities hinge. We may well get to the point of £5000 Nvidia Titans and the like (much as such products exist in high end audio) but that doesn't mean there won't be reasonably priced PC parts that still offer an awesome experience.

 

[Hedge]

Don't you think we become a little bit elitist about our pc gaming. I work in an environment where all my colleagues chat about gaming at lunch. Many of them own high end pcs (1080ti - 2080) And we all play on at least 1440p 144hz. There is also my friends who play on ps4 Pro. They chat about the fun they had on their games more than us pc gamers who tend to chat about our performance on a game.

I've no doubt whatsoever that pc games will continue to look spectacular. But when console games start to look pretty damn close from a sofa - TV distance then I don't see myself sat in front of my big water-cooled pc quite so much.

 

[Dave2150]

Every single time there's a new console generation people predict that we'll see [resolution]/60fps, and every time we end up with [resolution]/30fps for most "AAA" games, because publishers would much rather crank up the graphics rather than the framerate, as great graphics are a lot easier to sell to people than 60fps. It will be no different this time.

This time it really is different. PC GPU's have stagnated, and the next consoles are set to get a radeon 7/1080ti + 20% GPU which really is much faster than the majority of PC's. Couple that with a 8 core 7nm Ryzen, and console optimization, only true hardcore nerds will continue to use PC's.

 

[Rofflay]

This time it really is different. PC GPU's have stagnated, and the next consoles are set to get a radeon 7/1080ti + 20% GPU which really is much faster than the majority of PC's. Couple that with a 8 core 7nm Ryzen, and console optimization, only true hardcore nerds will continue to use PC's.

You sound like a Liverpool fan every year is thier year. You mean a 1080ti plus some weak 8 core APU right? Like the last time? Console Optimization? Whats that like Ark or PUBG?

 

[Brazo]

This time it really is different. PC GPU's have stagnated, and the next consoles are set to get a radeon 7/1080ti + 20% GPU which really is much faster than the majority of PC's. Couple that with a 8 core 7nm Ryzen, and console optimization, only true hardcore nerds will continue to use PC's.

Do we know it’s going to be 108ti is 20%?

I was under the impression of 1070 performance plus the nerfing to run at at 4K.

 

[opethdisciple]

How expensive are these consoles gonna be? With all that under the hood hardware, these sound expensive!

 

[Hedge]

How expensive are these consoles gonna be? With all that under the hood hardware, these sound expensive!

600 quid wouldn't be unbelievable.

 

[subbytna]

Oh I thought the graphics card forum was about framerates in games. I must have missed all the threads people make here about nvidia performance in Microsoft Office.

 

[Bluntwrapped]

The saddest part of gaming is it’s more interesting to talk about GPU’s and frame/refresh rates than it is to play an actual game.

The reason for this is most games are ****. No originality, just essentially the same genre of pish we see stream from the bladder of Hollywood. Year after year of reboots, each time becoming slightly more cringe and unplayable compared to the first.

 

[Mauller]

The saddest part of gaming is it’s more interesting to talk about GPU’s and frame/refresh rates than it is to play an actual game.

The reason for this is most games are ****. No originality, just essentially the same genre of pish we see stream from the bladder of Hollywood. Year after year of reboots, each time becoming slightly more cringe and unplayable compared to the first.

I have had more fun playing Indie and small publisher/studio games compared to big AAA games over the past decade.

Gameplay always trumps graphical fidelity, as long as the game has a good visual style and great gameplay, im more than happy.

 

[opethdisciple]

I have had more fun playing Indie and small publisher/studio games compared to big AAA games over the past decade.

Gameplay always trumps graphical fidelity, as long as the game has a good style and great gameplay, im more than happy.

Check out Hollow Knight. (If you haven't already)

 

[Mauller]

Check out Hollow Knight. (If you haven't already)

Already have it, played the hell out of it and waiting on SilkSong

 

[Rudge]

I'd find it hard to justify a £1000 GPU in any case, but there will be people that can afford it and are happy with the purchase. Some areas I can think of that PC arguably is the better area for them are simulation games (flight sims, racing sims), Virtual reality (Vive, rift and WMR are generally better than PSVR currently). I and others prefer the more open environment on PC as well with mod support and the ability to use a range of input devices.

If the next gen consoles enabled a desktop environment (word processing, CAD, modding and so fourth) then I think it would have a bigger impact on the PC and GPU market than just 4K games.

 

[Terrorfirmer]

The biggest 'problem' facing current gen consoles is the crap CPUs. The next generation will be the first where 60fps will become a general standard, as they'll be Ryzen-based. Some games on console are fine, but it does annoy me when games chug along.....Fallout 4/76 are a nightmare on console for example, drops to what feel like single digit FPS are common.

I think the next Xbox and PS5 will be much closer to PC standard due to the improved CPUs.

 

[VincentHanna]

How much do you think a console capable of 4k60 will cost? Will it support variable refresh? Can you opt to use it's graphical power for high frame rates at 1440 instead of 4k? Can you opt for ultra wide instead? Can you pick games up for under £10? Can you play all your favourite games from any generation on it?

A console is a one trick pony, and the next generation will not be capable of 4k60 at Ultra settings/textures.

Well the Xbox One X already supports Variable Refresh Rate, and it's built in to the HDMI 2.1 spec so yes, they will support variable refresh.

My C9 Oled supports VRR as well.

It's likely that the PS5/Next Xbox will also support 1440p @ 120hz or 4k/60hz

And you are very blinkered if you think that next gen consoles won't run at 4k 60hz. A closed system is going to be much quicker than 'like for like' hardware on a PC which isn't just focused on gaming speed.

 

[Hedge]

It's also kinda depressing that over 4 years down the line people still use The Witcher 3 to showcase pc capability.

The poster who is waffling on about experiencing the work of art at its best. 4k 120fps etc. Waiting 4 years to play a game. Using that logic he might aswell wait 15 years until it comes free within a "classic" library on PlayStation 10 lol.

I'm a pc enthusiast but I'm not so stubbornly blinkered. Most of my game enjoyment has came from things like Ori and the blind forest, la noir, hollow Knight, tekken 7 and countless hours on Dota 2. None of which needed any gpu power.

We might be leagues ahead on benchmark numbers but people have been having unforgettable gaming experiences on things like Horizon Zero Dawn, God of War and Uncharted without being nearly as hung up on things as we are here.

 

[VincentHanna]

Agreed, most of my top game experiences recently were on console, even if PC is my preferred platform in terms of running things at 4k 60hz.

 

[Poneros]

Raytracing and 4k alone would take a whole new console generation each just to do each feature correct and true. Be honest here 4k is 4x the current perf they talked up taken. So the next gen is exactly like the last gen but 4k aka x4 performance!

You'd think so, but it doesn't actually scale that way. Luckily, I was collating some info just a few days ago wrt FHD -> UHD scaling + RT. The data is from the Metro Exodus performance review at Techpowerup (2080 ti). Vanilla = Ultra preset; High/Ultra refers to the RT quality. You can very clearly see it is not even close to 0.25. In reality the performance demands are lesser than in theory, but great nonetheless.

(which was nowhere to be seen in a live demo at E3).

Cyberpunk 2077 E3 2019 Demo Ran at 1080p Ultra Settings with RTX On; Visuals and Ray Tracing to Improve Further

How expensive are these consoles gonna be? With all that under the hood hardware, these sound expensive!

My guess is they'll not got a penny over £500. Consoles are very price sensitive and with the large marketshare Sony has I don't think they'll make the mistake of upping the price and giving Microsoft an opening. Besides, I think the hardware that's going to be in them isn't going to be too expensive for either of them, so probably won't even sell at a loss. Let's remember the kind of deals you get when you sell hundreds of millions of anything. I wouldn't worry about it.