Intel has a Pretty Big Problem..

[humbug]

Yeah the one thing i would buy used is a CPU, because they always last way beyond their usefulness, they are thing's that last and don't go wrong, unlike GPU's which i don't buy used, they often do go wrong when they have a bit of age.

Having said that i think 13'th and 14'th gen will be an exception to that rule, no way i would buy one of those used.

 

[Tetras]

Motherboards are the much more likely component to fail long before CPUs which is why older CPUs go for dirt cheap while boards hold their price a bit more.

Yeah, I was just meaning that whatever you want to do with these CPUs, to hold onto it or to sell it, the degradation issue (if you have zero symptoms or not) means that for many users they likely aren't going to do what they would normally expect from them.

E.g. by 5-6 years old, maybe most of these CPUs will be dead or inoperable, especially if they were put in a motherboard and forgot about, which means the microcode was never updated to prevent the overvolts.

 

[arknor]

, depending on model return rates have jumped by up to 400%

400% of what? it literally has no meaning if we don't know the original number, it could still be a tiny percent.


Everything is hyperbolic these days like with the melting GPUs which seemed to go away as soon as the frenzied hysteria did. yet were made out to be something that would affect everyone.

Histrionic personality disorder (HPD) is a mental health condition marked by unstable emotions, a distorted self-image and an overwhelming desire to be noticed. People with HPD often behave dramatically or inappropriately to get attention

Which seem to be a lot of people on the mainstream social media these days such as reddit and twitter

to last for 10+ years and it is not unusual on this forum to see upgraders with Intel CPUs that are anywhere from 10 - 15 years old (like a 3770K is 12 years old).

I went from a 4670k to a 12700k

That must be fairly close to 10 years, it was oced the whole time, not massively though.
Towards the end of it's life I did start geting cpu errors in even viewer, but never noticed any degradation nor did I experience instability.

The error went away as soon as I increased the voltage by a tiny margin and I carried on using it for probably 2 years after that with no issues.

Certainly glad I don't have a problem CPU and AMD might be calling whenever I next upgrade.

 

[Grim5]

 

[humbug]

Everything is hyperbolic these days like with the melting GPUs which seemed to go away as soon as the frenzied hysteria did. yet were made out to be something that would affect everyone.

To be fair you can't be hyperbolic about an expensive bit of kit literally going *POP* as it self detonates just sitting in its socket.

The hysteria went away because AMD went "oh erm? Problem BLARP.... BLARP......BLARP, we need to fix this ASAP" and they did in quick time while at the same time being clear about exactly what the problem was and how not to be a victim of it.

Its not so much that there was a problem, ____ happens we get it, its how you deal with that problem and AMD did all the right things.

 

[Grim5]

MLID says 15th Gen has some of the same issues causing instability as 14th Gen. The issue raised is Intel pushing the ring bus too hard and cooking it; an issue suspected by Buildzoid as well

 

[humbug]

MLID says 15th Gen has some of the same issues causing instability as 14th Gen. The issue raised is Intel pushing the ring bus too hard and cooking it; an issue suspected by Buildzoid as well

Even i'm starting to feel sorry for Intel, while at the same time...... this is just incompetence now.

 

[humbug]

Again....

 

[welshrat]

Even i'm starting to feel sorry for Intel, while at the same time...... this is just incompetence now.

Yeah. It's the lowly engineers I feel sorry for. It must be a miserable place to work right now

 

[humbug]

Yeah. It's the lowly engineers I feel sorry for. It must be a miserable place to work right now

Not least because Intel management probably have the whips out, its that pressure to meet performance targets set and in the time given that's causing these problems, no one wants to be the one who says "i can't do it" so overclock it and skip some validation testing to get it out.

Intel haven't been put under pressure by a competitor since the early 2000's and they can't handle it.

 

[welshrat]

Not least because Intel management probably have the wipes out, its that pleasure to meet performance targets set and in the time given that's causing these problems, no one wants to be the one who says "i can't do it" so overclock it and skip some validation testing to get it out.

Intel haven't been put under pressure by a competitor since the early 2000's and they can't handle it.

Can't believe they are carrying the issues into 15th gen. It stops being incompetence and becomes fraudulent

 

[humbug]

AMD keep churning them out at regular intervals with decent performance gains, you have to go back to the 1990's to see this level of continuous progression and yes back then like today Intel struggled to keep up.

 

[Rroff]

MLID says 15th Gen has some of the same issues causing instability as 14th Gen.

And tomorrow he'll be saying something completely different...

I haven't watched the video but from what Intel have presented there isn't much shared between the ring bus on 14th gen and 15th gen.

 

[welshrat]

And tomorrow he'll be saying something completely different...

I haven't watched the video but from what Intel have presented there isn't much shared between the ring bus on 14th gen and 15th gen.

Yes fair enough however if it does turn out to be true questions will have to be asked.

 

[humbug]

Yes fair enough however if it does turn out to be true questions will have to be asked.

We wont know until a year later....

 

[pastymuncher]

People on here and other computer forums are in the minority, the other 99% of people who bought pre-built pc's many of which will only have a 1 year warranty will be clueless about this so when their pc stops working and the years warranty has run out, the place they bought it from will most likely turn around and say tough, it's out of warranty leaving those people screwed. Intel should do the right thing and issue a recall but then again this is Intel and they have done many scummy things in the past. I almost bought a 14700k when they launched but after reading some reviews was put off by the horrendous power draw and temps. I dodged a bullet there!!

 

[Rroff]

I almost bought a 14700k when they launched but after reading some reviews was put off by the horrendous power draw and temps. I dodged a bullet there!!

So far I've not had a problem with my 14700K but dunno what the future holds, far too little information so far.

Personally don't find the power draw or temperature much of a problem, unless rinsing out Cinebench MT. A lot of time in games it is sitting between 70 and 150 watt and ~70-80C on air cooling (and that is with the fans on silent profile). I did have it configured for up to 4 core 6GHz turbo which would push temperatures up a bit but with this whole issue blowing up I've disabled that to be on the safe side.

EDIT: Something which may or may not have relevance - I noticed I have almost zero undervolting potential with this chip - looks like one core is right on the edge of stability minimum voltage wise - while there seems to be quite a lot of frequency headroom without touching the voltages (or only minor increases).

 

[Aretak]

This is hilarious

* Intel says microcode won't fix your instability

* Intel says the damage in your cpu can't be fixed

* Intel says no recall

All in the same statement

All that means is that Intel's legal department has done the maths and decided that whatever lawsuits come their way over this will cost the company a lot less than doing a recall. They're almost certainly right about that too. Previous class action suits like the AMD FX "fake cores" or Nvidia GTX 970 "fake specs" ones have resulted in them having to pay $30 in compensation, to US customers only and even then only to those that bother to claim. That's a bargain for these companies relative to replacing or refunding every unit.

 

[Daytrader]

I just want a full £600 refund on my 13900K regardless if its even bad or not at the moment, i have been getting crashes from day 1 thou on a new build, don't want the worry in the future if any crash is down to bad cpu or something else, had my Skylake 6700K for 10 years and stiff perfect.

 

[G J]

Yes fair enough however if it does turn out to be true questions will have to be asked.

Lets entertain the leak for a moment, their aware of the problem aparently and nobody has these yet and it will be fixed as no company will want to release potentially flawed products on purpose. Esp when a company is already in trouble with existing issues.

AMD just caught an issue that also caused them a delay with Zen 5 so MLID can speak any **** he wants and it should be believed while providing no reciepts what so ever but just wrapping it up in my sources/contacts said....

We wont know until a year later....

AMD was going to or started shiping their chips, found a problem and pulled them and did not say what the issue was so I guess we won't know until a year later also.