Caporegime
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DM ic ant believe you dont liek Song and Sagna. i can think of a lot of players who are worse then those two.
Is it time to sack Wenger?
- Thread starter edwardcasbon1
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Soldato
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Song has his moments, but the thing is, he's too attack-minded and doesn't read the game well enough to be a good DM, and he's not good enough as an AM to consistently contribute with assists and goals. His discipline sucks (yellow card a game, nearly), he gets caught out all the time, and rarely plays at a high tempo.
I don't mind Sagna, I think he just needs better coaching. There are plenty of players in the squad that could probably have better performances coaxed from them by someone who knows how to man-manage/inspire.
I don't mind Sagna, I think he just needs better coaching. There are plenty of players in the squad that could probably have better performances coaxed from them by someone who knows how to man-manage/inspire.
This
Soldato
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If Wenger hasn't lost the dressing room I'd be surprised. We used to be able to bounce back from defeats, but today they were as gutless as against Milan.
Spurs, Newcastle, Liverpool all next.... I'm not the only one seeing 3 defeats, and you can throw another caining by Milan in there too.
Spurs, Newcastle, Liverpool all next.... I'm not the only one seeing 3 defeats, and you can throw another caining by Milan in there too.
Caporegime
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The next two games I can honestly see getting a result in are Villa and Wolves, thats the 24th march and 9th April. 
As for Song, he's a crap DM and he's crap going forwards.
In the team as a DM, well, he hasn't been for most of 3 years, first we sacrificed Fabregas, then Wilshire, now Arteta to "cover" his own damn position. So he gets forward more than otherwise, whats his scoring/assist rate? yeah he makes Ramsey look prolific.
He's rubbish, his passing in anything but going sideways is poor....... and his sideways passing is poor.
Positionally he has nothing, defensively he's a clumsy baffoon who isn't very good at tackling, staying on his feet, or not fouling anyone all the time for no reason.
I'm honest to god not exaggerating when I say he could and SHOULD have been sent off in at least 5 games this season purely for persistant fouling.
Sagna, he looked great till his injury in his first year, he's looked rubbish since. 99% of his crosses hit the closest man, he has a complete inability to make a yard of space to whip a cross in. Defensively he's rarely at right back and consistently out of position up field, he constantly thinks he won't get caught out then has to rush back late. Hell he did it against Milan, offside or not he had every chance to catch Zlatan but instead slowed down, then tried again, but even BEFORE the offside he should have been in line with the back four but as always he was ambling back hoping he wouldn't be needed.
Now, I'll be honest and fair, the first 8 months he actually looked VERY good, so with the right coaching and a bit of effort maybe he can be good again.
Song though, has always and will always be awful, no manager will change that, same for Theo, some players get worse the longer they play under Wenger, Verm is falling apart at the moment and even before his last 2 woeful performances hasn't looked a patch on his first season. Sagna, Vela, Bendtner, Ramsey, Arteta, Verm, Kos, Arshavin are all players you would think would all improve, some a LOT under a decent manager playing them in the right position, right formation and actually having a defensive system that works. Other players, Diaby, Denilson, Song, Theo, Djourou, Gibbs, and a bunch of others I simply don't think will be good and won't "get back to their best" under a new manager.
The problem with someone like Sagna is, he's been so bad for so long, at this point can he get back to his best, I don't know.
As for Song, he's a crap DM and he's crap going forwards.
In the team as a DM, well, he hasn't been for most of 3 years, first we sacrificed Fabregas, then Wilshire, now Arteta to "cover" his own damn position. So he gets forward more than otherwise, whats his scoring/assist rate? yeah he makes Ramsey look prolific.
He's rubbish, his passing in anything but going sideways is poor....... and his sideways passing is poor.
Positionally he has nothing, defensively he's a clumsy baffoon who isn't very good at tackling, staying on his feet, or not fouling anyone all the time for no reason.
I'm honest to god not exaggerating when I say he could and SHOULD have been sent off in at least 5 games this season purely for persistant fouling.
Sagna, he looked great till his injury in his first year, he's looked rubbish since. 99% of his crosses hit the closest man, he has a complete inability to make a yard of space to whip a cross in. Defensively he's rarely at right back and consistently out of position up field, he constantly thinks he won't get caught out then has to rush back late. Hell he did it against Milan, offside or not he had every chance to catch Zlatan but instead slowed down, then tried again, but even BEFORE the offside he should have been in line with the back four but as always he was ambling back hoping he wouldn't be needed.
Now, I'll be honest and fair, the first 8 months he actually looked VERY good, so with the right coaching and a bit of effort maybe he can be good again.
Song though, has always and will always be awful, no manager will change that, same for Theo, some players get worse the longer they play under Wenger, Verm is falling apart at the moment and even before his last 2 woeful performances hasn't looked a patch on his first season. Sagna, Vela, Bendtner, Ramsey, Arteta, Verm, Kos, Arshavin are all players you would think would all improve, some a LOT under a decent manager playing them in the right position, right formation and actually having a defensive system that works. Other players, Diaby, Denilson, Song, Theo, Djourou, Gibbs, and a bunch of others I simply don't think will be good and won't "get back to their best" under a new manager.
The problem with someone like Sagna is, he's been so bad for so long, at this point can he get back to his best, I don't know.
Caporegime
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yup, they live in Moscow, just about the only place I think they'd all want to live if they would sign up for a Russian team then fly in the day of a game and smeg off asap. There has been terrorist attacks in the local area, cops killed, and the crowd is pretty violent from what I've heard.
Bit crazy but, money talks, Eto'o is on around 350k a week though its unclear if that is pre/post tax, and frankly I have no idea what level of tax they would pay over there, probably next to nothing.
Forget if Hiddink is on a 4 or 5 year contract but 8.3mil a year, heck of a retirement fund for 4 years work.
Bit like Wigan, no players live in Wigan, unlike the Rugby players which all do
All Latics players liver in Manchester area thinking they are big time
Bit like Wigan, no players live in Wigan, unlike the Rugby players which all do
All Latics players liver in Manchester area thinking they are big time
WOW - a whole 15 miles from where they live to where they work, thats a killer of a commute - not really the same comparison if you think about it
WOW - a whole 15 miles from where they live to where they work, thats a killer of a commute - not really the same comparison if you think about it
i know, they must be so annoyed travelling 15 miles in their Range Rovers, Escalades, BMW's and Mercedes. perhaps if they take the Ferrari or the Aston they might tweak their back getting out?!
WOW - a whole 15 miles from where they live to where they work, thats a killer of a commute - not really the same comparison if you think about it
MOre than that, most of them live south of Manchester.
I was trying to joke about Dagastan being like Wigan but you lot missed that, due you think Bolton and Blackburn players live in those towns
MOre than that, most of them live south of Manchester.
I was trying to joke about Dagastan being like Wigan but you lot missed that, due you think Bolton and Blackburn players live in those towns
I doubt any Manchester City / Utd players live in Manchester either (a lot seem to live in Alderley Edge, Cheshire), or Arsenal players there either, but even a 20 - 30 mile commute either way isnt exactly comparable to the 1000's of miles commute by plane for Eto'o et al.
Wigan isnt THAT bad
I know we're suffering with injurys but looking at the team in the last 2 games we really don't have any strength in any position bar RvP who looked completely isolated. I can't see him staying at the end of the season. We need to invest heavily in some decent defensive players and some game changers but i can't see Wenger doing it. The new signings haven't worked out at all really.
Caporegime
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The thing which is so frustrating for me personally is that Wenger will look at the centre of defense for example, see that we have enough players in terms of numbers and then leave it at that. He seems to be completely oblivious to the fact that the players he's bought aren't good enough. I doubt Djourou or Squillaci are even good enough for relegation candidates, they'd probably struggle to play to a consistent standard in the Championship yet we are supposed to rely on them when something happens to Koscielny/Vermaelen, which seems to be a lot.
The backroom staff and coaches have to take some responsibility for the stagnant nature of our club, though ultimately Wenger is the man that picks the team, the tactics, the transfer targets, the areas of the squad to strengthen, the players to send out on loan etc and ultimately this is the squad he built and the players he has put faith into. The buck stops with him and even though he's done so much good for the club during his tenure, he still has a LOT to answer for over the past few seasons.
You can time the point at which our season capitulates, it's happened every season for at least the last two or three but Wenger and his staff seem oblivious to it, they must do otherwise they'd have attempted to fix the problem by now. It's hard to decide where the rebuilding begins, like many others have already said we have a LOT of players that don't have a future at our club. If you took our strongest starting eleven I'd probably only keep three or four players, that's how mediocre the majority of our side has become. And then we have the issue of players unwilling to move due to having to accept a pay cut. People like Diaby, Djourou, Walcott, they don't even earn their wages.
This is where Wenger needs to buck his ideas up, spend however many million over the next few years on Djourou who clearly doesn't have a future at the club, or sell him before he's had a ridiculous wage increase and then spend that money on a proven player. I still don't know why we didn't make a move for Roger Johnson, Cahill or Dann. Probably because that's what 99.99% of people wanted and Wenger has the habit of doing exactly the opposite of what people want.
The backroom staff and coaches have to take some responsibility for the stagnant nature of our club, though ultimately Wenger is the man that picks the team, the tactics, the transfer targets, the areas of the squad to strengthen, the players to send out on loan etc and ultimately this is the squad he built and the players he has put faith into. The buck stops with him and even though he's done so much good for the club during his tenure, he still has a LOT to answer for over the past few seasons.
You can time the point at which our season capitulates, it's happened every season for at least the last two or three but Wenger and his staff seem oblivious to it, they must do otherwise they'd have attempted to fix the problem by now. It's hard to decide where the rebuilding begins, like many others have already said we have a LOT of players that don't have a future at our club. If you took our strongest starting eleven I'd probably only keep three or four players, that's how mediocre the majority of our side has become. And then we have the issue of players unwilling to move due to having to accept a pay cut. People like Diaby, Djourou, Walcott, they don't even earn their wages.
This is where Wenger needs to buck his ideas up, spend however many million over the next few years on Djourou who clearly doesn't have a future at the club, or sell him before he's had a ridiculous wage increase and then spend that money on a proven player. I still don't know why we didn't make a move for Roger Johnson, Cahill or Dann. Probably because that's what 99.99% of people wanted and Wenger has the habit of doing exactly the opposite of what people want.
Caporegime
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Agreed about Djourou and Squillaci . both wouldnt get into a relegated Premier league side. Look at Bendter, His not even first choice at Sunderland
Here's a question, how bad would a new Arsenal manager have to do for the fans to start wanting Wenger back/wishing he hadn't gone?
It does happen, sometimes it can take a manager going to realise how bad you would do without him. Or those players, tactics, how the club was run etc were actually taking you in the right direction all along. But is that what's happening with Wenger? It's not a couple of below par seasons is it, it's 6 or 7 years of slow decline. And not just that, if I was an Arsenal fan I'm pretty sure I'd feel like we were going down without a fight. Maybe part of that is hindsight, but again, it's not over a short period of time now, you could have predicted Arsenal's current status 3 or 4 years ago at this point as I'm sure many did.
He can stay forever as far as I'm concerned, because in doing things his way it seems Arsenal aren't interested in fighting it out at the very top. But for any Arsenal fan that would prefer a change, I certainly don't see that as turning on him, 5+ years is enough time for any manager to prove the doubters wrong and Wenger has failed to do this.
It does happen, sometimes it can take a manager going to realise how bad you would do without him. Or those players, tactics, how the club was run etc were actually taking you in the right direction all along. But is that what's happening with Wenger? It's not a couple of below par seasons is it, it's 6 or 7 years of slow decline. And not just that, if I was an Arsenal fan I'm pretty sure I'd feel like we were going down without a fight. Maybe part of that is hindsight, but again, it's not over a short period of time now, you could have predicted Arsenal's current status 3 or 4 years ago at this point as I'm sure many did.
He can stay forever as far as I'm concerned, because in doing things his way it seems Arsenal aren't interested in fighting it out at the very top. But for any Arsenal fan that would prefer a change, I certainly don't see that as turning on him, 5+ years is enough time for any manager to prove the doubters wrong and Wenger has failed to do this.
I'm absolutely shocked at people defending Alex Song in this thread, in my opinion apart from Gibbs he is the worst player in the team. His passing is woeful, his defensive awareness completely lacking and I imagine that if you were to total up his bookings at least 75% of them would come from hauling people down in the centre circle. He is ****.
This tbh...i mean who the hell would want Djourou, Diaby, Rosicky, Denilson to name but a few???...we wouldnt be able to sell them so we give them new contracts. I can see where DM is coming from when he talks about wages and contracts...problem being is the current crap we have, we wouldnt be able to offload them...maybe we can give them to Wigan or some other rubbish team lol but i wouldnt be surprised if those teams turned round and said thanks but no thanks.
Dunno how we are going to challenge for trophies anymore tbh...we have far too many crap players that dont know how to win or how to play...quite saddening really and yet Wenger and the board wont do FA about it...so while other teams get better, we get worse and worse yr by yr.
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