Is the end of Battery EVs coming?

SkodaMart said:
I rarely even bother posting anymore, its that toxic on here.
The wheels seem to be falling off the rEVolution far faster than I had dared to even imagine. It's hilarious.
Click to expand...

It was never going to work as long term solution, people told governments that very early on. Too much change and investment is needed in too short a time. Same thing is happening with heatpumps. People just aren't buying them, too expensive even with the grants.

I said they would push the deadline back from 2030 and they did. They'll keep doing that until synthetic fuel or better carbon capture tech arrives. The US haven't even set a date. The way they just gave permission for new oil fields is a big clue.
 
Last edited:
Which dealine moved exactly? See thats the press headline for a paper swallowed by the ill-formed - all the mash, no gravy.

The 22% BEV mandate for 2024 remained at 22%. So for whats happening in the actual real world nothing has changed...
 
Nasher said:
The ban on new petrol and diesel cars started at 2030, it's now 2035.
Click to expand...

Its just a political decision, it could be back to 2030 next week.
Really it was all just a simple political ploy for Rishi to try to win over some of the demographic that hate change.

Nasher said:
It was never going to work as long term solution, people told governments that very early on. Too much change and investment is needed in too short a time. Same thing is happening with heatpumps. People just aren't buying them, too expensive even with the grants.

I said they would push the deadline back from 2030 and they did. They'll keep doing that until synthetic fuel or better carbon capture tech arrives. The US haven't even set a date. The way they just gave permission for new oil fields is a big clue.
Click to expand...

Heatpumps are now cheaper than a boiler if you have a suitable property.
A few of us on here have quotes that are less than a boiler replacement.
Including if any changes need to be made to rads etc.

Now running costs thats a different consideration.
 
Diddums said:
youtu.be

I'm back in a diesel after 4yrs running both EV & PHEV. What needs to change to get me to go back?

Why I've gone back to driving a diesel after 2 years with an EV and then 2.5 years driving a PHEV as our family car. What needs to change to get me to go bac...
youtu.be youtu.be
Click to expand...
I saw that yesterday, I generally don't mind his comments, but he seemed exceedingly uneducated in some ways and honestly a bit of an idiot in this one.

The icing on the cake was his finance comparison..

He said the £600 a month diesel rangie was 'half the price' of the £1025 PHEV version..
He seemingly can't understand that
1. He was getting a healthy additional finance contribution on the Diesel (so presumably struggling to sell)
2. The electric was a Dynamic SE Trim, the Diesel just an SE, that's £3k difference minimum, and obviously (he did mention it but seemingly was happy with apples to oranges) 160BHP less.
2. The £20K deposit was not factored in remotely, that's £555 a month on his term.
3. So if you take the deposit and finance contribution into account for a fair comparison, it's £1575 vs £1293 amortised cost.. seems about right considering the lower spec/power.

His battery degradation seemed unaware of LFP and where things are battery tech wise these days.. Using a Nissan Leaf/Kia Soul to hammer degradation agenda is crass, those are very old tech known to not look after their batteries.. There are recent studies on Battery degradation which shows how well they can last these days..

And I was genuinely gob smacked at his inability to understand current EV pricing.. it's been discussed in many places, there is a huge uplift in demand YoY for EVs (41%), which is good, but we have gross over supply on a huge scale (leases now ending etc).. This means there is potentially an end in sight and actually a good time to consider buying, because EVs 'reset' in the first half of 2023, they are back on quite slow depreciation curves for all the ones I'm tracking (including our ID.3).

But, I can agree that things need improving, buyers need to be 'aware' and going EV isn't seemless at times.. The only question is balancing the ultimate convenience / cheap running cost of charging from home with the occasional long trip.
 
Last edited:
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Its just a political decision, it could be back to 2030 next week.
Really it was all just a simple political ploy for Rishi to try to win over some of the demographic that hate change.



Heatpumps are now cheaper than a boiler if you have a suitable property.
A few of us on here have quotes that are less than a boiler replacement.
Including if any changes need to be made to rads etc.

Now running costs thats a different consideration.
Click to expand...

Suitable property being the issue. Unless it has been built for a heatpump it probably won't be. Which adds a lot of extra costs. You also need somewhere to install the inverter, which can be quite noisy (especially once the fans start to go) and may get complaints from neighbours. Plus a large hot water tank.
 
Last edited:
As usual I think the government have done this arse about face. I'm fairly negative on EV's because of the lack of infrastructure. But I've started to come around to them just slightly. What has started that little inkling of change in my mind has been researching solar panels for the house. If I could get enough solar capacity at the house then heat pumps and EV's become more attractive. I completely accept that a lot of people wouldn't have the ability to do that. But some will.

If the government went on a massive incentive programme to install solar on houses that can take them, then I think the update of EV's would be higher. Get people generating their own renewable energy and it will go a long way to tacking climate issues.
 
Nasher said:
Suitable property being the issue. Unless it has been built for a heatpump it probably won't be. Which adds a lot of extra costs. You also need somewhere to install the inverter, which can be quite noisy (especially once the fans start to go) and may get complaints from neighbours. Plus a large hot water tank.
Click to expand...

Simply not true.
Most modern (ie built in the last 20 years or so) that have double glazing and half decent insulation, and have at least 10mm piping are now suitable

The difficulties lie around small rads, especially things like towel rails, and for many combis.

The heat exchanger (not inverter) are no noiser than a normal AC unit in effect which have some restrictions where you can place them, but are not that noisy in reality.

A large pressured hot water tank is a massive benefit, you make out like its a negative ;)
(As I type this I am heating my large hot water tank for free from an Octopus power up)
 
Nasher said:
Suitable property being the issue. Unless it has been built for a heatpump it probably won't be. Which adds a lot of extra costs. You also need somewhere to install the inverter, which can be quite noisy (especially once the fans start to go) and may get complaints from neighbours. Plus a large hot water tank.
Click to expand...

See the heatpump heat exhanger that needs airflow is the item that has a fan and is noisy from what ive seen. Yet you go all obscure not knowing how forced convection is required for a heat flux management system and instead talk about the inveter and the fan when it fails!?!

Like what on earth?
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Simply not true.
Most modern (ie built in the last 20 years or so) that have double glazing and half decent insulation, and have at least 10mm piping are now suitable

The difficulties lie around small rads, especially things like towel rails, and for many combis.

The heat exchanger (not inverter) are no noiser than a normal AC unit in effect which have some restrictions where you can place them, but are not that noisy in reality.

A large pressured hot water tank is a massive benefit, you make out like its a negative ;)
(As I type this I am heating my large hot water tank for free from an Octopus power up)
Click to expand...

But you need to use up a lot of storage space to install it. Most people took the tanks out years ago when combi boilers became popular as you get an unlimited supply of hot water.
 
Nasher said:
But you need to use up a lot of storage space to install it. Most people took the tanks out years ago when combi boilers became popular as you get an unlimited supply of hot water.
Click to expand...

Combis suck, get a proper unvented system ;)
I can't help it if people are stupid and removed tanks and used the space due to lack of forethought.
The funny thing is many, quote no where for it to go when they removed the tank from a property that pre dates central heating. Get your brain cells wrapped around that one ;)

Anyway, the modern tanks are so well insulated you can put them in a loft, in an attached garage etc.
 
Last edited:
the heat pump is courtesy of tax payer subsidy too, if that wasn't in Kiers 28BN, subsidies which are also contributing for the chosen ev companies to
provide domestic battery production and avoid the future impact of rules of origin, itself an impediment for achieving 22%, as the other companies may remonstrate.
 
Jonnycoupe said:
Ive already got a hot water tank as i have a proper house...
Click to expand...
Solid flex. How many litres can you store in that bad boy? ;)

Our house was built in 2015 and while the guy who did the original plumbing said that it would probably be OK for a heat pump install even he admitted that if it was being specified as a heat pump installation today then they would have used a closer spacing on the underfloor heating. So we could take up the entire ground floor, roll the dice with a heatpump and 200mm underfloor heating spacing or stick with gas. I'll let you guess what we are going to do.
 
Last edited:
Nothing wrong with a nicely sized modulating combi.. ours freed up loads of room in the loft and airing cupboard, it's been nearly 20% cheaper to run for us...

If I go 'heat pump', I'll go air to air so I can cool as well and run that off battery storage charged overnight on a cheap EV tarriff..
 
Demon said:
Nothing wrong with a nicely sized modulating combi.. ours freed up loads of room in the loft and airing cupboard, it's been nearly 20% cheaper to run for us...

If I go 'heat pump', I'll go air to air so I can cool as well and run that off battery storage charged overnight on a cheap EV tarriff..
Click to expand...

Exactly. Heats the place up FAR quicker than a heatpumps too. Heatpumps only heat the water to something like 55c which is the reason you need giant radiators for them. It actually isn't hot enough to kill leagionella bacteria either, but like the government, let's just gloss over that for now.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom