ISIL, ISIS, Daesh discussion thread.

Hiijinx said:
Ironic really since its yet another country the US is wanting to invade for its oil reserves when there is a renewable alternative growing out there in the form of hemp which could eliminate the West's desperation for fossil fuel all together if allowed.
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just no, please don't buy into all the silly stoner omg weed solves everything!!!

it really doesn't (don't worry i was just the same when i was a young naive stoner).

But the oil billionaires want to stay billionaires and arms dealers will never stop making a literal killing selling rebels weapons while they enjoy the spoils of war as they watch the world slowly but surely implodes into a pitiful mess of human greed and corruption.
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and the trillionaire oil companies would not pass up the chance to safely grow their product in a safe country, and every government would jump at the chance of having their energy needs met domestically (try telling your army that you are deliberately strategically crippling them because you're against drugs)

if hemp could replace oil, then America wouldn't be subsiding corn crops it would be subsiding hemp crops.
 
Before we fall into a willy waving contest about who knows most about different planes and then playing top trumps on who will beat who in an air combat show down let's take a step back from the sensationalism that the media wishes to whip up.

There isn't going to be an air to air situation between the coalition and Russian aircraft.
F16s/F15s can shoot down sukois.
Russia are quite clearly testing reaction, just like they do by flying bombers over to Scotland.
 
Terminal_Boy said:
You are assuming an equal level of pilot skill, experience and leadership.
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I am, however also factoring in the numbers advantage and the technology advantage. The amount of pilot skill required to offset that simply doesn't exist in civilised countries. If it was North Korea instead of Russia it may be a factor worth considering but it's marginalised in this instance.


RoboCod said:
There isn't going to be an air to air situation between the coalition and Russian aircraft.
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The very nearly was the other day, six Su-30's intercepted four Israeli F-15's and chased them out of Syrian airspace (they actually ran into Lebanon as it was closer than Israel lol). I'm sure you can see how that situation could have gotten very messy very fast.
 
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You don't realise that Russia have limited airborne C2 in Syria, like the US have. Their air picture is probably very restrictive and I'd hazard to guess that they are in fact employing the Su-30s to clear a path for their Su-25s, since they have the capacity to search (albeit locally) with their enhanced detection RADAR. Wording it as being "chased out of Syrian airspace" isn't really as you think. It's not an engagement, they're simply deconflicting this way seeing as the coalition aircraft aren't going to know exactly when and where Russian aircraft are going to be flying. It's not like they just email them their ATO everyday is it? You never know though, air coordination and deconfliction might actually happen if all nations pull their fingers out and just work together on this!
 
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...-islamic-state-terrorists-20151006-story.html

Interesting read about a Russian plot to supply Islamic State with radioactive material to build a dirty bomb - they wanted an Islamic buyer because they'll bomb America. Now, there's nothing to link the Russian government to this plot but I do wonder about the exact nature of the relationship between the Russian mafia and the Russian government. I note that the alleged ringleader of the plot has fled to Russia.
 
This is turning more and more messy

So we now have

Assad's Syrian Army supported by Iran, Russia, Hezbollah VS Western backed Rebels & ISIS

Western countries, Turkey, Saudi Arabia VS Assad & ISIS

ISIS Against everyone and Israelis floating around somewhere in there too.

I've probably misses something


This seems like a recipe for disaster
 
XeNoN89 said:
This is turning more and more messy

So we now have

Assad's Syrian Army supported by Iran, Russia, Hezbollah VS Western backed Rebels & ISIS

Western countries, Turkey, Saudi Arabia VS Assad & ISIS

ISIS Against everyone and Israelis floating around somewhere in there too.

I've probably misses something


This seems like a recipe for disaster
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I've seen no evidence that Russia, Turkey and Saudi Arabia are taking action against the Islamic State. So it's even more messy than you think.
 
scorza said:
I've seen no evidence that Russia, Turkey and Saudi Arabia are taking action against the Islamic State.
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Have you tried reading or watching any news from the last week or so? :P

Joking aside, I don't think the is a credible news source on the planet that has claimed Russia aren't battering ISIS, the thing they are complaining about is that they are hammering the US backed rebels too.
 
I'm a bit confused now, Russia has peppered ISIS with 26 cruise missiles launched by their ships in the Caspian sea, 1500km away. But on maps the Caspian looks like a giant lake, how do they get ships there? do they have battleships that just stay there all the time? lol.
 
How do you even differentiate between IS and the so called 'rebels'? both are running around with weapons waging war against the Syrian army. They'd all be branded as terrorists in any other country.

It's a proxy war, first Ukraine to try and cut Russia off from Crimea and now it's moved on to Syria. Scary times hopefully it doesn't escalate.
 
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scorza said:
Interesting read about a Russian plot to supply Islamic State with radioactive material to build a dirty bomb - they wanted an Islamic buyer because they'll bomb America..
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....tinfoil etc.

The Turkish government are duplicitous, they're bombing the Kurd's for starters. Not trustworthy at all.

It was widely reported in Western media that the 'moderate rebels' or 'FSA' were spent a long time ago. Given a proper thrashing by ISIS, Al-Nusra and the Syrian army. Those missiles have blown up mostly Sunni Jihadist groups who have been the boogeymen since 2001. Deciding to call them all 'moderates' doesn't make any sense, somebody is telling a big porky pie. Russia never made a secret of supporting Assad and attacking his enemies whether that is ISIS, FSA or some jihadis. In any other situation they would be enemies of the West.
 
ubersonic said:
I'm a bit confused now, Russia has peppered ISIS with 26 cruise missiles launched by their ships in the Caspian sea, 1500km away. But on maps the Caspian looks like a giant lake, how do they get ships there? do they have battleships that just stay there all the time? lol.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caspian_Flotilla

basically yeah - they have a fleet there all the time,
 
jl10000 said:
....tinfoil etc.
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Well not really, as that part of the story resulted in actual criminal convictions.

jl10000 said:
The Turkish government are duplicitous, they're bombing the Kurd's for starters. Not trustworthy at all.
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I know, but that just makes them the same as Russia, who are also bombing Islamic State's enemies for them.

jl10000 said:
It was widely reported in Western media that the 'moderate rebels' or 'FSA' were spent a long time ago. Given a proper thrashing by ISIS, Al-Nusra and the Syrian army. Those missiles have blown up mostly Sunni Jihadist groups who have been the boogeymen since 2001. Deciding to call them all 'moderates' doesn't make any sense, somebody is telling a big porky pie. Russia never made a secret of supporting Assad and attacking his enemies whether that is ISIS, FSA or some jihadis. In any other situation they would be enemies of the West.
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I'm not quite sure that's true, sure they've been hampered by the lack of any external support ever, but if you look at the map of Syria in the following link then they still control significant areas of Syria: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34465425
 
scorza said:
Well not really, as that part of the story resulted in actual criminal convictions.
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Certainly is a good yarn, when is the Tom Clancy book coming out? I'm struggling to match up your previous comment with the article.

scorza said:
I'm not quite sure that's true, sure they've been hampered by the lack of any external support ever, but if you look at the map of Syria in the following link then they still control significant areas of Syria: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34465425
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But who control those areas? Many of them are 'insurgents', many of them are what the US would consider worthy of a drone strike. Dozens of different groups are in those areas, perhaps the Peoples Front of Judea will make an appearance? How they can be lumped into one group and called 'moderate rebels' is beyond me. The US has already made huge mistakes by helping the wrong groups who turn out to be the enemy, seeing fighters it has trained capitulate to ISIS or Al Qaeda along with equipment. Many rebel groups were targeted by Al Qaeda for getting support from the US, the whole thing is a total failure and the notion of a Syrian rebel army that controls large areas of the country seems far fetched at best. Russia will bomb all of them anyway, whether they are "moderate" or "Jihadist lunatics", they are all enemies of Assad.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34278233

http://www.ibtimes.com/four-years-later-free-syrian-army-has-collapsed-1847116
 
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