Israel/Palestine Shenanigans

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Amnesia said:
Nearly killing someone is as bad as killing them ?
go on......
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You do realise that in most places attempted murder carries almost the same sentences as murder? The only difference is that you failed to carry it out, but the intent was to kill.

So yes, attempted murder is every bit as bad as murder. Intent is the key.

For Hamas, a rocket that killed Israeli civilians would be a success. A rocket that hurts no one is a failure.
 
You'd have more credibility posting in this thread foxeye if your bigoted hate for muslims and Islam wasn't as blatant as in other threads here in GD. Just can't seem to take you seriously for some reason.....hmmmmmm.

Have you seen the rockets that Hamas have?
Most are the equivalent of the 'warning missiles' that the IDF use.
Compared to the mass destruction the IDF have caused, the Hamas rockets are fireworks.

Maybe they should just bend over and let the IDF have its way with them? it's only been over half a century of oppression and land grabbing that the palestinians have had to suffer.....

One does have to wonder though why if Hamas are so bad that they are willing for the ICC to get involved, whereas Israel refuses to let them get involved.

Hamas declares support for Palestinian bid to join international criminal court
Hamas says it will support proposal that could expose both the Islamist group and Israel to war crimes investigations
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http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/23/hamas-back-palestinian-bid-international-criminal-court

Hell Israel are going so far as to bend their US puppets ears to make sure this doesnt happen

http://www.theguardian.com/law/2014/aug/18/hague-court-western-pressure-gaza-inquiry

The US and other western powers have exerted pressure on the International Criminal Court at the Hague to prevent a war crimes probe of Israel's operation in the Gaza Strip, The Guardian reported on Monday, quoting former court officials.
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http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Po...o-open-war-crimes-probe-against-Israel-371395

http://www.timesofisrael.com/international-court-facing-pressure-to-forgo-gaza-probe/

Credible sources of information not that crap you've linked to above.
 
zoomee, please note that the feeling is mutual. When the war starts, you will be on the side of a backwards, oppressive, violent, abusive, evil religion... and I will be on the other side. Hopefully our side will prevail and you can all go live in the desert with your pre-historic beliefs.
 
As I said, the intent is the key. If I intend to murder you, but my plot is foiled by external forces, or I am subdued in the attempt, that is absolutely punishable to the same extent as an actual murder.

And you'll find that sentences don't make too much differentiation between murder and attempted murder.

If I try to blow up a plane but my bomb fails to go off - if I tried to blow up the plane and that was my intent - then I am guilty of pre-meditated murder, just one that I failed to execute.

In the eyes of most people, they are every bit as bad. And the punishments handed down reflect this.

To argue that a failed murder attempt is not as serious as a real murder is madness. We're not talking about a guy who had 2nd thoughts and decided against it. We're talking about a guy who tried to kill someone and failed.
 
FoxEye said:
As I said, the intent is the key. If I intend to murder you, but my plot is foiled by external forces, or I am subdued in the attempt, that is absolutely punishable to the same extent as an actual murder.

And you'll find that sentences don't make too much differentiation between murder and attempted murder.

If I try to blow up a plane but my bomb fails to go off - if I tried to blow up the plane and that was my intent - then I am guilty of pre-meditated murder, just one that I failed to execute.

In the eyes of most people, they are every bit as bad. And the punishments handed down reflect this.

To argue that a failed murder attempt is not as serious as a real murder is madness. We're not talking about a guy who had 2nd thoughts and decided against it. We're talking about a guy who tried to kill someone and failed.
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I was never discussing sentencing guidelines....

You claimed nearly killing someone is as bad as killing them...i just pointed out for you that it isn't for the guy who didn't get murdered or his family or the other people who know him.

If you don't get that ^^ then i can't make it any simpler for you.
 
Amnesia said:
I was never discussing sentencing guidelines....

You claimed nearly killing someone is as bad as killing them...i just pointed out for you that it isn't for the guy who didn't get murdered or his family or the other people who know him.

If you don't get that ^^ then i can't make it any simpler for you.
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Then to make it simple, if Palestinians stop "trying" to kill Israelis, then the Israelis could stop having to kill the Palestinians..
 
Amnesia said:
I was never discussing sentencing guidelines....

You claimed nearly killing someone is as bad as killing them...i just pointed out for you that it isn't for the guy who didn't get murdered or his family or the other people who know him.

If you don't get that ^^ then i can't make it any simpler for you.
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You're quite simply wrong.

Attempted murder is treated as seriously as murder, for good reason.

What you're trying to say is the the consequences for the victim are different. Of course. But the crime of attempted murder only takes into account that you tried to kill someone. It does not matter in the eyes of any right-thinking person that you failed or were apprehended in the act.

If you tried to kill someone and had the means to do it, you need locking up with the murderers.

So yes, an attempted murder by Hamas *is* as bad as an actual killing by Israel. There is no difference in the "severity" of the crime.
 
... do I honestly need to spell everything out? Really, I'm sure you can put 2+2 together.

You said Hamas attempting and failing to kill Israeli citizens was "not as bad" as Israel, because Israel actually does kill Palestinian citizens.

I said (sigh) that attempted murder makes you every bit as bad as a murderer, if you genuinely attempted the murder and failed.

It actually pains me to have to type this.
 
FoxEye said:
... do I honestly need to spell everything out? Really, I'm sure you can put 2+2 together.

You said Hamas attempting and failing to kill Israeli citizens was "not as bad" as Israel, because Israel actually does kill Palestinian citizens.

I said (sigh) that attempted murder makes you every bit as bad as a murderer, if you genuinely attempted the murder and failed.

It actually pains me to have to type this.
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Given Hamas' lack of success, generally, in killing Israeli civilians (or any Israelis, really), their pitiful rocket attacks are not performed with a likely expectation of dealing death.

It's not the same as killing hundreds of civilians.
 
cheesyboy said:
Given Hamas' lack of success, generally, in killing Israeli civilians (or any Israelis, really), their pitiful rocket attacks are not performed with a likely expectation of dealing death.

It's not the same as killing hundreds of civilians.
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I could swing a knife around randomly in a crowded space. Just because I dont expect to cause a death wouldn't make me any less culpable if I did.

Flawed analogy for a flawed response.

The fact they fire blindly is just as bad as a targeted attack that kills civilians in the blast radius.
 
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