James Cameron's 'Avatar' - The next gen of cinema

[NeilF]

I'll credit Terminator, Aliens and The Abyss as good movies. The rest were nothing to write home about. Cameron can be a good little workhorse on his day, but he has trotted out some pretty mediocre stuff.

Paying top dollar for a bunch of CGI in a movie with a plot which hugs the safe wall of Hollywood clichés isn't really groundbreaking stuff. It certainly brings nothing new to cinema. And if you still have to wear 3D glasses to watch it, what exactly is "revolutionary" about the technology?

Show me another action director who has produced films with such solid scripts (don't forget he writes his own stuff), with such solid characters, all backed up with such stunning production standards?

As regards your second paragraph are we talking about the same man? You're suggesting Cameron takes the easy route? There's a reason why The Abyss is probably one of the most solid & well produced underwater flicks ever made, and that's because he did it the hard way. And don't forget, this is a man who decided to shoot on location for 'Titanic', with home grown new camera technology. A couple of models in a tank would have been the easy way!

I'm sure some people don't enjoy Cameron's work, which is of course absolutely fine... But at least give the man his due credit for the writing, filming and production skills he has brought to the table over and over again.

When I read your second paragraph I thought you were talking about Michael Bay... Now there's a perfect fit!

 

[shifty_uk]

How is it pure hype? He has developed new camera technology and is using new motion capture techinques to allow real-time motion capture results to be viewed on virtual monitors?

Yes, technology progresses, but there are true advances being introduced here... So it's not really fair to dismiss is as 'pure hype'...

Perhaps 'overly hyped' would've been a more accurate term?

I don't entirely understand the concept of viewing realtime motion on virtual monitors but isn't that what they've been doing for a good few years now?

 

[NeilF]

Perhaps 'overly hyped' would've been a more accurate term?

I don't entirely understand the concept of viewing realtime motion on virtual monitors but isn't that what they've been doing for a good few years now?

Overhyped? Definately... It's a big budget film by a renound director who's not been around for a decade... People are interested and will get excited

I'm certain it will not live up to expectation, but as long as it's anywhere in the same league as his previous films what more can you ask for...

As regards your question... From memory...
1) normally individuals are filmed and then the CGI is added in later, possibly months later. Some modern techniques allow CGI backgrounds to be added in realtime, so the directory can see on his monitor the actors with the CGI background as if it were there, meaning he can see straight away if the shot is to his liking.

Cameron has gone one step further by allowing even CGI characters to be added (to some degree) into the shot realtime.

2) He's also upgraded motion capture techniques for actors faces meaning far more natural/better CGI character facial movements.

3) Also, add to this as well new 3D cameras to better handle the 3D capture process to attempt to better replicate human sight.

 

[Makunouchi]

I just hope the film has a damn good story line to go with these hyped effects. If they gloss over the reason why we would go billions of miles through space just to blow **** up, I'm going to walk out of the cinema.

 

[just Scott]

Cameron can be a good little workhorse on his day, but he has trotted out some pretty mediocre stuff.

What director hasn't? I don't think Cameron is the greatest director of all time lol, but you don't often come across a director whose worst films are True Lies or Titanic, which are by no means awful films. Just mediocre as you said.

 

[tisonlyme]

I've never bothered to see a movie in 3D before, I suppose because I don't have a problem with 2D movies, they're good enough for me, plus I never wanted to pay the extra money.

Then I saw a news piece on Avatar last night. Even on my 2D TV screen, it looked stunning. I have no idea what the plot will be like, but I'm pretty much sold already. Will definitely be seeing this when it's out! (and no doubt posting on here how rubbish I thought it was afterwards! )

 

[Sankari]

Show me another action director who has produced films with such solid scripts (don't forget he writes his own stuff), with such solid characters, all backed up with such stunning production standards?

I'm not a cinema aficionado, but I doubt that Cameron is the only one who does this. Good grief man, he's not the Messiah.

As regards your second paragraph are we talking about the same man? You're suggesting Cameron takes the easy route? There's a reason why The Abyss is probably one of the most solid & well produced underwater flicks ever made, and that's because he did it the hard way. And don't forget, this is a man who decided to shoot on location for 'Titanic', with home grown new camera technology. A couple of models in a tank would have been the easy way!

I'm sure some people don't enjoy Cameron's work, which is of course absolutely fine... But at least give the man his due credit for the writing, filming and production skills he has brought to the table over and over again.

When I read your second paragraph I thought you were talking about Michael Bay... Now there's a perfect fit!

I'm not saying he always takes the easy route. I've already given him credit where it's due. Remember that the financial success of Titanic owes a great deal to the hordes of Japanese schoolgirls who flocked to see Leonardo Di Caprio at least four times each. The story was bog standard Hollywood drivel; invent an imaginary romance and make it the central feature of the plot. Oh, and some boat sinks, taking more than 1,000 people with it - but never mind that.

Is anyone going to tell me what's so "revolutionary" about the technology used for Avatar?

 

[NeilF]

I'm not a cinema aficionado, but I doubt that Cameron is the only one who does this. Good grief man, he's not the Messiah.

You're the one who's got all excited and brought 'messiah' into the conversation... I've always just refered to him as a director. But the question you dodged still stands, give me another director who has brought us so many intelligent solid action films? You'll have to think long and hard about it. The point being you're trying to label him as mediocre when clearly it's unfounded...

I'm not saying he always takes the easy route. I've already given him credit where it's due. Remember that the financial success of Titanic owes a great deal to the hordes of Japanese schoolgirls who flocked to see Leonardo Di Caprio at least four times each. The story was bog standard Hollywood drivel; invent an imaginary romance and make it the central feature of the plot. Oh, and some boat sinks, taking more than 1,000 people with it - but never mind that.

Here's the broken record again.... OK, so you didn't enjoy Titanic... Fair enough... Get over it...

Is anyone going to tell me what's so "revolutionary" about the technology used for Avatar?

Google is your friend...

 

[Muzy]

Negative comments all over the interwebs.....

The story ain't original: Humans discover a civilization on a planet = send troops = kill everyone = take the planet.

Where is the story ?

 

[Sankari]

You're the one who's got all excited and brought 'messiah' into the conversation... I've always just refered to him as a director. But the question you dodged still stands, give me another director who has brought us so many intelligent solid action films? You'll have to think long and hard about it. The point being you're trying to label him as mediocre when clearly it's unfounded...

I'm not trying to label him as mediocre; I'm saying that this movie sounds mediocre. And I didn't dodge the question; I simply admitted that I don't know, because I'm not qualified to answer it.

Here's the broken record again.... OK, so you didn't enjoy Titanic... Fair enough... Get over it...

Google is your friend...

Why can't you be my friend instead?

 

[NeilF]

Negative comments all over the interwebs.....

The story ain't original: Humans discover a civilization on a planet = send troops = kill everyone = take the planet.

Where is the story ?

LOL! Let's see...

Star Wars = Goody space ships blow up baddy space ships
Jaws = Shark eats some people, goodies kill shark
Shall I continue?

The importance is what's between the lines, which in reality we have little/no idea about... Stop looking for things to whine about and let's just wait till the film is out shall we before we pass 'qualified' comments...

 

[Demoniser]

Watched the trailer earlier.

Certainly looks good and im loving the sci-fi feel of it. Definitely looks like one of those films that has to be seen at the cinema to be fully appreciated.

 

[LostPhil]

We use binocular and monocular cues for depth perception (that is, 3D). However, almost all the 3D films use stereoscopic systems, whereby different information is fed to the left and right eye. Simplest example is those red blue glasses. I have such poor vision in my left eye (can't read for instance with any magnifier), in day-to-day use my brain virtually ignores my left eye. If I force it to use it, I will have 1/2 the 3D image so blury after 30s I'll probably throw up and have a migraine for days.

My local cinema is only showing Final Destination in 3D and it's really annoyed me.

I have the same problem and it's a bit disappointing that films are going this way! (same eye too... we're not related are we?) It's bad enough losing pool games just because I don't actually know where the end of the cue is in relation to the ball... ha.

Looks intruiging though! As long as it's not just a gimmick for the sake of it I'm sure it'll be good.

I'm tempted to see it regardless.

 

[Chimerical]

I'm not saying he always takes the easy route. I've already given him credit where it's due. Remember that the financial success of Titanic owes a great deal to the hordes of Japanese schoolgirls who flocked to see Leonardo Di Caprio at least four times each. The story was bog standard Hollywood drivel; invent an imaginary romance and make it the central feature of the plot. Oh, and some boat sinks, taking more than 1,000 people with it - but never mind that.

Yeah but it is primarily the box office haul of that movie which singularly earns it so much respect.

It was also Cameron's vision for the movie that garners attention for example building half a physical ship or something, the first $200m budget for a movie, the casting of not-massively-famous-actors in the star roles (Di Caprio and Kate Winslet hadn't made much before Titanic), the CGI, going against all the doubters who said it would fail, etc. etc.

The script really isn't important when looking at these aspects although for such a long movie, it got huge audience figures but as anyone knows, the more you spend on a film, the more constrained you're going to be in terms of story.

Although I don't personally like Titanic, I have respect for it simply due to how much money it made.

 

[NeilF]

Although I don't personally like Titanic, I have respect for it simply due to how much money it made.

+ you got to respect anyone who decided to shoot on location two miles down on the actual orginal ship!

 

[Camalot]

+ you got to respect anyone who decided to shoot on location two miles down on the actual orginal ship!

If i remember, they built their own set and the detail of it was epic, even down to the plates used. Then they had to dismantal it to make way for the boat in a James Bond film.

Avatar looks good, can't wait

 

[Azagoth]

So is this yet another film I won't be able to see due to the stupid 3D glasses not allowing me to wear my current glasses, and thus having a blurred view?

 

[Phonesis]

Personally, I can't wait to see this. I really like the sound of the story and Cameron is one of the best out there when it comes to making this type of thing.

The game sounds good too. Cameron recently announced it was going to be in 3d. Not quite sure how that's going to work.

 

[NeilF]

So is this yet another film I won't be able to see due to the stupid 3D glasses not allowing me to wear my current glasses, and thus having a blurred view?

Personally I'd foot the £2000 bill for corrective surgery just for this flick

Just kidding...

You'll find (possibly) some cinemas might be showing a 2D version?!

 

[Meridian]

Ummm...
Terminator
Aliens
The Abyss
Terminator 2
True Lies
Strange Days

Here we have some truly great scripts. In many of them the stories are almost flawless and more importantly we have some incredible characters with memorable strong dialog.

Of those films, only two show as a sole credit to Cameron: The Abyss and Strange Days. Since the others are shared credits, in one case with about five other people, it's hard to know how much Cameron was involved - for instance he may only have story-boarded. The Abyss is a classic case of the point I was making: several parts of it give the feeling of having been written at the bottom of a treacle well (to paraphrase Martin Gardner), to the extent that it jars against the better bits. It's a long time since I saw Strange Days, but it's generally considered one of the weaker films he has been associated with. He needs to co-write, because his tendency towards cliche and bathos need curbing.

And yes, the script of Titanic is embarrassingly bad - more cliches crammed together than normal mortals thought possible.


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