Japanese Grand Prix 2011, Suzuka Circuit - Race 15/19

Mr Men said:
Your post certainly made me laugh :D

Alonso had to have independent observers in his garage due to his own team racing against him, no wonder he left them :) I would hardly use 2007 as a yardstick for Alonso's talents.

Alonso is well above Lewis in overall F1 driving, even the current F1 drivers voted Alonso as the best, but what do they know right :D
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2007 is as perfect a yardstick and you will find in F1. Both drivers were new to the team and had no serious input into the design of the car.

Alonso had to resort to playing politics to try and psyche out the fresh faced 22 year old who was outdriving him. Take a peek back through history and you'll find a pairing called Prost and Senna who did it all 20 years previously in the same team. I don't think you'll find anyone who would refer to Senna as average.
 
MagicBoy said:
2007 is as perfect a yardstick and you will find in F1. Both drivers were new to the team and had no serious input into the design of the car.

Alonso had to resort to playing politics to try and psyche out the fresh faced 22 year old who was outdriving him. Take a peek back through history and you'll find a pairing called Prost and Senna who did it all 20 years previously in the same team. I don't think you'll find anyone who would refer to Senna as average.
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Perfect apart from McLaren racing against Alonso you mean? Perfect in that Alonso needed to be sure his own team did not mess up his tyre pressures in qualifying? Being new helped Lewis as Alonso had to adapt to the new tyres, while Lewis never :D Alonso was still beating him until after Monaco when Lewis threw his toys out the pram and uncle Ron acted to keep him happy, we all know the rest and how that team imploded.

Are you comparing Lewis to Senna? I know Lewis likes to do that, but really...be serious :)
 
Lucero said:
Just watching the replay now, IMO, Jenson shouldn't have yeilded to Vettel. He's too British sometimes in his driving approach..

"No No Mr Vettel, after you....."
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If he hadn't have yielded he'd have put all 4 wheels on the grass and most probably spun :rolleyes:
 
Planet F1 -

Eddie Watching
Some very rewarding stuff collected by EJW ([email protected]). Before we indulge ourselves, for Eddie Watchers there's a little moment you have to watch out for. When Jake is talking to the camera Eddie beams into the lens and occasionally, just occasionally, he'll agree with him and give a little beaming nod. Who is he nodding to? Nobody knows. Eddie has the nods and Jake has the cheeky cockney elbow nudge. He'll be talking to a team member and has to go off somewhere or wants him to leave. So he gives them the Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins elbow. That's along with the myriad mentions of parties (see TMW in the week).

EJ to Ross Brawn talking about the 2012 Mercedes: "Ross have you got a car into a tunnel position?"
EJ trying desperately to avoid using the word "side" twice in a sentence: "Just put the financial side to one...place."
EJ talking about Schumi's ability to make Australian trousers during a grand prix: "Michael has made some very good strides in the last races." (Notwithstanding the fact that he creamed it into the barriers last race).
And finally, a bit of magic from qualifying when Eddie confused 'the hare and the tortoise' saying with 'the hair of the dog'.
EJ: "Sauber versus Renault and Force India - I'm intrigued with all this. At the moment you have got the hare and the dog..."
Jake: "Eddie, what's this hare and dog analogy?"
DC: "No wonder his strategy meetings were so confusing - 'boys we've got to be more like the hare and less like the dog'!"
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Can't help but love the hare and the dog analogy :D - can't help but love Eddie sometimes.
 
1uke said:
No 90% of his races this year have been runined either by the stewards or other drivers. Have you even watched all the races this year as it appears not.
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What elitist and utter fanboi drivel. :)

Lewis has been driving poorly, wait until the season is officially over and for the in depth interviews where Lewis will say as much. Mind you, some of you fanbois would probably still argue even with Lewis' own thoughts !
 
deuse said:
Vettel is not a racing driver..yet..he is just a one lap wonder....well he did do one good overtake this season.

Alonso and Lewis to me are the only ones that would make a dog of a car look good.
I don't think any driver builds a car around them BUT people like Brawn\Adrian newey built a great car for MSC\Button and vettel..
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Made me laugh that.
 
Mr Men said:
Perfect apart from McLaren racing against Alonso you mean? Perfect in that Alonso needed to be sure his own team did not mess up his tyre pressures in qualifying? Being new helped Lewis as Alonso had to adapt to the new tyres, while Lewis never :D Alonso was still beating him until after Monaco when Lewis threw his toys out the pram and uncle Ron acted to keep him happy, we all know the rest and how that team imploded.

Are you comparing Lewis to Senna? I know Lewis likes to do that, but really...be serious :)
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What are you - Alonso's spin doctor? A double world champion with 6 years experience in F1 fighting a little dirty to protect his reputation? Absolutely.

In 2007 Hamilton was an F1 rookie. No one in history got anywhere near his results in their first season of F1. An argument could be made for Villeneuve but he was older, the reigning IndyCar champion and had enormous amounts of pre-season testing under his belt. As much as I like and respect Damon Hill who was his teammate for the year, Alonso is the more talented driver.

As for the Senna/Lewis thing, I'm not comparing Lewis to Senna other than in the McLaren inter-team rivalry context. They might share a Yellow helmet but that's about it.

Experienced world champion who's not afraid to play politics and pulls the unequal equipment joker when their reputation starts to suffer? That'll be Prost and Alonso

Fresh new whippersnapper who is ruthless on the track, has nothing to lose and just enjoys driving fast? That'll be Senna and Hamilton.

Feel free to pull the Hamilton fanboi line. It isn't true. I wave the flag more or less equally for all the British drivers.
 
MagicBoy said:
Feel free to pull the Hamilton fanboi line. It isn't true. I wave the flag more or less equally for all the British drivers.
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Which shows why you are so blinkered :) I love how you just dismiss JV to suit your point :D

Facts are McLaren done wrong with Alonso, and Whitmarsh admitted it.

It was also a fact Senna was getting special qualifying engines, while Prost was not, and if you want to talk dirty tactics then go watch Suzuka 1990. Again you compared Senna with Lewis lol, Senna and Prost have nothing to do with Alonso or Lewis. Senna was not a rookie at McLaren so no idea what on earth you are trying to achieve with such comments.
 
I demand proof on your statement that Senna was getting special engines. From my recollection Honda at the time Prost kicked off (Monza 89?) stated the engines were randomly allocated from a pool. The drivers had different ECU settings to suit their driving styles, but that was the only difference that I'm aware of.

I'm not dismissing JV. It was a stunning debut season even accounting for the fact that he got handed the best package developed by one of the best test drivers in the business (Hill).

I'll concede that McLaren could have dealt with the Alonso/Hamilton situation better. I would stand to reason that the 1988/89 experience would have helped in this regard. I don't believe the team thought that Hamilton would be so quick out of the box. Most rookie drivers have a steady first season while they adjust to the formula. No one ever expected him to equal Alonso and win a race in his first season, let alone nearly take the World Championship.
 
Rybo89 said:
He wasn't, i thought i seen the suit but it was Jensons dad wearing white trousers.

Pretty sure there was no hammy there.
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he was there, he was to the right of jensons dad
he followed them in for the team pic
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MagicBoy said:
No one in history got anywhere near his results in their first season of F1. .
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and 99.9% of rookies dont get anywhere near a leading car for two years or more of coming into F1, without considering the gigantic amounts of funds McLaren invested in getting LH to F1 and staying with them

Im not knocking his results, they were very good indeed - but they also shouldnt really be considered comparable to pure "rookie" status either given the facts above
 
so we cant compare anything to anything else because there is always something slightly different.

this argument has gone on for far to long.


anyone think that vettels 2nd WDC mite get a bit forgotten about? they didnt really celebrate today as they had to pack up and be away for next weeks GP and when it comes to the end of the season it would have been won for 2 months.
 
utajoker said:
Anyone think that vettels 2nd WDC mite get a bit forgotten about? they didnt really celebrate today as they had to pack up and be away for next weeks GP and when it comes to the end of the season it would have been won for 2 months.
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Nah, I think when RBR secure the constructors championship they will do a massive double-celebration.
 
I see JB has come up with his own Vettel-esque finger gesture. The W for Winner symbol :p

Or if you used to watch The Big Breakfast... W for Web Master!!!
 
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