Just dropped a deposit on some M Power - Trackday Project Car

[Gibbo]

Hi there

Viscous fan removed
Under drive and new idler / tensioner pulleys fitted
CSL air box fitted.

This is how I feel


In more detail
The throttle and response is night and day, simply wow
The sound both inside and outside the car, incredible
Zero hesitations low down and no drivability issues, relocating the air temp sensor seems to work well as in the stock position it will beak soak
Car does seem more powerful as well, just seems to accelerate quicker and picks up much better, feels like a true race car engine.

again

 

[Gibbo]

I'm shocked that you are surprised by this considering you used to own a CSL

That was nearly ten years ago, hard to remember how good the CSL truly was and my car is approx. 100kg lighter and has more power than the CSL had, making it even more


Some photos:-


Under Drive and new tensioner/idler pulleys

Old air box removed, very clean which is good to see!

Air box installed

Because Race Car, Cherry Coke oil catch can!

Gonna get new fixings for top of air box so I can run the start breather and vacuum lines for o.e. look install and might get a proper catch can for the crank case breather.

 

[Gibbo]

why did you get rid of your csl in first place if it was so good ?

Never really fell in love with it, did one track day in it and it was terrible, stock brakes with warped disc made the whole experience not so great. Instead of sorting it I swapped it back for my old Mustang and went on a quest for power, 600 horsepower to be exact. Since then my cars seem to be getting progressively less powerful, 400BHP EVO and now 911 and M3. The 911 is the class event it is in its own league of ability and feel on the road and is no slouch on track either. The M3 is a great laugh and very capable on track and now with the CF air box it really is beginning to tick all boxes, it will never offer 911 dynamics and feedback, but which car does, but its nearly as capable on road and more capable on track.

 

[Gibbo]

A video

Not the full RPM's about 6500-7000rpm, will get more video's done at a later date.


TURN UP THE VOLUME!

 

[Gibbo]

What is the best forum for M3 advice, sales etc?

Me and my brother are thinking about getting an M3 to build into a track car, similar to yours Andy.

Cheers

Sam

If you have 20k spare, Graham Automotive are selling their E46 Track M3, very similar to mine, its a quick car 1:55 at Outlon.
http://grahammartinautomotive.co.uk/what-we-do-at-gma-ltd-gallery/m3-track-car-project-2/


To answer your questions best UK forums are:-
CSL Register
M3Cutters

Pretty much everything you need will be on those two, then you have the US forums which are good as well.

Good choice.

 

[Gibbo]

Hi there

Here is a video from a track day I recently did few weeks ago, just not bother uploading video, shall upload a few more, including one against an slightly track fettled R8 as I get time:-

To give you an idea of how well balanced my car is now, I am doing 1:23-1:24 in traffic and 1:21-1:22 on open track but at same time I am not pushing it. The cars balance is pretty much perfect now, no understeer or oversteer, very neutral, at the limit oversteer is very progressive in the dry, the chassis at the limit is very benign, never driven a car like it.

In the video you can see I am not pushing the car or tyres (Michelin cups) and am not taking curbs, yet it is hugely quick, the Caterham guys who were handy in the R300's were asking me what I'd done to it and the guy in the green Exige was shocked how I kept up with him as he is on slicks and its a tuned 2.0l Turbo unit.

I've now got another set of wheels with slicks, will put those to the test at some point, but first I need to install a new clutch, so am giving the entire gearbox an overhaul, flywheel, clutch kit, guilbo, fork, springs, engine mounts, gearbox mounts, full service etc. I've also got some stunning Eibach aluminium lightweight rear lower camber arms which give upto -4 rear camber and make adjustment mega easy, they are stunning. I need to take some pics of all the new stuff I've being collecting up for it and post them here. I also have an H&R rear adjustable bar, but in all honesty do not think I need it so will just leave the CSL bars on.

Can't wait to get it back on track as on the cups in my hands its good for a 1:20-1:21 lap now, my mate who is a better driver than me but also ruthless in mechanical sympathy reckons he could extract a 1:17ish from it on the cups.



The only issue I have with my M3 is this track project will likely also become my daily as it is so nice to drive on the road now with the interior and setup I have, its still not a 911 but the 911 is a huge chunk of cash I would like to free up soon for a house deposit or better cash in the bank than depreciating in a car. Will miss the 911 like crazy because on the road nothing compares to it, love driving it so much.

 

[Gibbo]

Hi there

Any suspension experts able to answer this question for me:-


Normally for track I set my KW's to Ring dry settings which is:-

0.75 turn from hard front compression
0.50 turn from hard rear compression
6 clicks from hard front rebound
9 clicks from hard rear rebound

But on last event I did not adjust compression as hard to get too so left in softer road settings:-
1.25 turn from hard front compression
1.00 turn from hard rear compression
6 clicks from hard front rebound
9 click from hard rear rebound


The car felt absolutely fine with absolutely tons of grip, now to my knowledge normally harder is better on track, but with the compression set softer the car felt more confidence inspiring and felt like it had more mechanical grip.

Am I just imagining it or is it essentially less on the edge with the softer settings, giving me more confidence and as such suiting my smoother driving style more do you guys think?

I am no suspension expert, but one of the guys at track said suspension setup is more driver preference and some drivers want a sharp edgy car which feels like it will kill you and others want a more benign car that feels safe to push in. Is this what I am experiencing with softer compression settings do you think?

 

[Gibbo]

You need to brake harder and later

Dude I am out breaking some of the caterhams and race machinery in something twice as heavy.

I am now not braking until the end of the blue chevrons on the pit straight, also remember when I go for the brakes I am travelling at 130mph and aiming to slow down to 60-70mph at the turn in point, its like 100 yards. You can see this easily 4 minutes onwards in the video where I am catching the Radical type thing under braking.

The video does not portray the speed or braking effort so well, you should come on a Donny track day with me and you will see m8.

Also there was a guy in an M3 on slicks and I caught and passed him eventually.

 

[Gibbo]

You know I like to wind you up

You need to drive as hard as you do on the road

Hahah, sliding round a roundabout at 40mph is easy, sideways through craners at 120mph is not easy.

 

[Gibbo]

It would be easy if the car wasn't yours I'm sure

Yup, then id not care about crashing and would be a kamekazi pilot behind the wheel.

Drove like that once in my old 525i SE round Donnington with 250,000 miles on the clock, was passing 911's, Aston Martins in something with 170BHP and 1600kg, I simply did not car if I chucked it at the scenary, I was DK that day!

 

[Gibbo]

What is the best forum for M3 advice, sales etc?

Me and my brother are thinking about getting an M3 to build into a track car, similar to yours Andy.

Cheers

Sam

If that 20k track prepared one is too much, check this out:-
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...ynew,new/page/1/make/bmw/radius/100?logcode=p

Get that for 3.5k-4k could be a perfect track car base.

 

[Gibbo]

That's a great price, yes it has 202k miles but as long as the suspension has been kept correctly I imagine the engine will go for another 200k. Looks in good condition

If they are really motorway miles engine and box be fine.
Suspension all gets replaced on a track car anyway.

 

[Gibbo]

Indeed. You'd probably make a fair bit back selling the dash/door cards/seats etc.

For a track hack you don't really want to spend the extra on a low mileage example for twice the price.

How much is a second-hand engine?

Tempted myself.

Normally 1.5-2k including all ancillaries.

On an SMG gearbox and flywheel tend to not wear, just clutch, which is £150 for clutch kit plus labour.

On that car you could sell:-
Interior: £400
Hi-FI: £250
Satnav: additional £200
Stock brakes and suspension: £200

You can normally get 1k back from stock parts.

Then you need what I've done, suspension bush refresh, coilovers, big brakes, buckets and harnesses along with a full inspection 2 service.

Or just buy it, fit uprated pads, take out what you don't need, fit buckets and enjoy as is, you'd be all in for 5k then with a decent road and track car.

 

[Gibbo]

Someones selling a 66k miles m3 on fb for 7k. Could be worth a gander.

Good price!

 

[Gibbo]

Gibbo, who are you insured with? I thought my insurer did track day insurance, as advertised on their site, but it seems they don't now I've enquired. I've got quotes coming out at £280 for 1 day on the GTR, hoping a joint road/track insurer can do it cheaper than that!

edit:

Just had a search and it looks like you're using someone who specialises in specific car manufacturers, I'll have to keep looking!

Try classic line car insurance, they do track cover included, £515 per year on 911

 

[Gibbo]

Cheers, will give them a bell on Monday. Reis quoted me £3.5k for normal insurance plus 4 trackdays. Sky Insurance can do it per trackday for £280 (with 10% excess).

I was insured with Mannings who only do Aston, TVR and Porsche, they wanted £640 a year with unlimited track day cover including Europe and the ring, so good value.

But as I don't track the 911 any more all my cars are now insured with
http://www.classiclineinsurance.co.uk

911 upto 5 track days UK: £515
M3 with track cover: £380
Jaguar S-Type: £275

They are all classic policies and don't use my NCB but are all capped at 5000 miles per annum which is fine for me. My NCB is not used but protected as I have like 8 years worth.

 

[Gibbo]

Another video:-

 

[Gibbo]

There's quite a few missed apex's in the middle section of the track during the faster (est 90-100mph?) right hand corners, is it pushing out wide when turning right or are you just turning in later?

The left handers and the slower 50-60mph corners are all fine though

In a car you miss the first one after red gate which is 100+ and keep a set steering lock which naturally brings you to the next. Then try to ride the curb down through craner and then take as much curb at old hair pin then flat to the top of the hill, apex at top then apex for blind turn coppice but don't take the apexs in a car, that's the bikers line.

 

[Gibbo]

Gibbo, what did you buy as RTAB limiters? The Rogue Engineering spacers/Turner Motorsports kit or other?

I've just ordered some new OEM RTAB's and want to fit some limiters but unsure what to go for?

Have you done engine/gearbox mounts?

Neil.

Neil, hope you are well mate, enjoying the Z4?
Yes for the limiters I have Rogue Engineering ones, but both are fine, they are just spacers to prevent un-necessary movement but give a noticeable improvement, cost about £30-£50.

OEM RTAB's with spacers are the best solution and all OEM RTAB's are now the revised CSL ones.

In answer to your question about engine/gearbox mounts:-

New clutch kit, flywheel, engine mounts, gearbox mounts, new springs and knuckle joint for gearbox going in along with all other components refreshed, re-greased on it before going in. I am sticking with OEM as the OEM stuff did 100,000 miles and over 30 track days, they are clearly more than upto the job.


Also some additional bling:-

Lightweight aluminium adjustable rear camber arms, upto -4.0, I shall run around -2.00 in the rear and -3.00 up front, these are also so easy to adjust, no more seizing camber bolts.

When my bootfloor is repaired and re-inforced in September these shall go on and every single bush in the rear shall be replaced for new OEM or Lemforder, so that's all suspension, rear subframe and diff bushes. Its all new upfront anyway and with new engine/gearbox mounts this car will drive like it just rolled out from the dealership brand new, just better.


Oh and an item people rarely service but should:-

That's the air oil separator located just under the cam cover, it clogs up and causes your engine to use oil, mine is original and after 100,000 miles was a little grubby so I am leaving it to soak in hot soapy water for a few hours. Takes 5 minutes to remove so its a good idea to service it on any engine especially when so easily accessible on the S54, or simply buy a new one, about £25 from dealership.

 

[Gibbo]

Yeah I'm good thanks, enjoying the car overall but there's a few things that could be improved I feel. Most notably the ride quality over bumpy b-roads is extremely lively to say the least so will sort the RTAB's and get the car geo'd asap with a good check over of all the suspension.
It does seem like the car is sprung a bit weirdly with soft springs on the front and hard ones at the rear make for a fair bit of pitching under acceleration/braking.

Where are you getting your boot floor repaired? The place I'm taking mine for the work does a full on repair scheme with plates etc:

http://www.redish-motorsport.com/E46M3FloorSubframeCrackRepairReinforcement.html

Mine doesn't use any oil at all, none in 2K since I've owned the car
They'll also be checking the VANOS and investigating a flat spot I've got between 1-2k which seems to be a Z4M trait as it runs a few different components to the E46 such as the ecu etc.

Neil.

Mine uses a bit of oil and the oil separator was a bit cloggy so no doubt why, cleaned it with degreaser and hot water, quite a bit of junk came out, shall also order a new one as for £20 be silly not to.

Yes Redish I know them, they are very good, but my friend is the owner of Mprove and they do the same thing with plates and well its at mates rates.