Malaysian Grand Prix 2013, Kuala Lumpur - Race 2/19

deuse · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:44

Neo4 said:
Which is worse, Nico having to slow because he managed the fuel better than Hamilton or what happened between Mark and Seb?

Your post wins hands down

CaptainRAVE · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:45

deuse said:
I gave you mine where horner said he didn't know and started to mutter silly stuff. Now where is your
link that said they was on the same mode?

Skeeter selectively skips over posts that ask him for a link and thus the facts.

DRZ · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:45

Neo4 said:
Which is worse, Nico having to slow because he managed the fuel better than Hamilton or what happened between Mark and Seb?

Nico wasn't ahead at the prescribed point, his race was done, he accepted it (eventually) and that was that. Another 3-4 laps of racing and maybe it would have been Hamilton behind while Nico nursed the fuel levels to the flag. We don't know, we don't have the data.

What it wasn't, however, was a catastrophic implostion of sportsmanship and teamwork. Unlike RBR.

deuse · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:46

CaptainRAVE said:
Skeeter selectively skips over posts that ask him for a link and thus the facts.

True.

Skeeter · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:47

deuse said:
I gave you mine where horner said he didn't know and started to mutter silly stuff. Now where is your
link that said they was on the same mode?

Dont you mean Jase's link?

Neo4 · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:47

CaptainRAVE said:
Skeeter selectively skips over posts that ask him for a link and thus the facts.

To be fair, nobody has offered facts supporting otherwise, just what they have heard.

Neo4 · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:48

DRZ said:
Nico wasn't ahead at the prescribed point, his race was done, he accepted it (eventually) and that was that. Another 3-4 laps of racing and maybe it would have been Hamilton behind while Nico nursed the fuel levels to the flag. We don't know, we don't have the data.

What it wasn't, however, was a catastrophic implostion of sportsmanship and teamwork. Unlike RBR.

and none of you have the data on Red Bull?

Skeeter · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:49

CaptainRAVE said:
Skeeter selectively skips over posts that ask him for a link and thus the facts.

I don't have a link, that's why I've asked for one?

I'm with you on this, I want to see what Horner said.

Kenai · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:49

Neo4 said:
To be fair, nobody has offered facts supporting otherwise, just what they have heard.

Well so far we have Webber saying he turned his engine down, Vettel saying nothing on the subject and Horner mumbling 'err, i'll have to check later'.

Skeeter · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:51

Kenai said:
Well so far we have Webber saying he turned his engine down, Vettel saying nothing on the subject and Horner mumbling 'err, i'll have to check later'.

So... no facts.

Neo4 · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:51

Which is as i have said, what you have heard. you dont have the telemetry of either car so it is all what you have heard, that is all i am saying.

Matteh · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:52

DRZ said:
Nico wasn't ahead at the prescribed point, his race was done, he accepted it (eventually) and that was that. Another 3-4 laps of racing and maybe it would have been Hamilton behind while Nico nursed the fuel levels to the flag. We don't know, we don't have the data.

What it wasn't, however, was a catastrophic implostion of sportsmanship and teamwork. Unlike RBR.

Surely you could say the same for Seb? He could have raced hard, got past webber and wrecked his tires in the process ending up second or worse anyway? They both made their choice. One was sporting, the other was Sebastian Vettel.

Mr Men · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:52

Neo4 said:
Which is as i have said, what you have heard. you dont have the telemetry of either car so it is all what you have heard, that is all i am saying.

If Webber was lying then RBR would be saying so without a doubt. Why would they let Webber tell lies that paint Seb in a very bad light?

DRZ · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:53

Skeeter said:
Imagine you work in sales and get a bonus for being top salesman in your team at the end of the year. Your second after month 11 and your boss says your already all over quota so reel it in, have a quiet month, don't take any risks as the company is more important than any egos.

The guy in the lead books a week off. Do you lay back and chill, or do you go for that big sale you ha e been working to get it in before hear end and nab the bonus?

Terrible analogy. This is month 1, not 11. We don't know if the rival salesman hasn't had a day off all year whereas you could have had some time off before.

Additionally, you haven't factored in any risk to the company.

Let's improve the analogy then:

Its week two of FY13 and you are competing to be top salesman to get the bonus. If you two generate above X sales, the overall company can afford to do Y which will vastly benefit the company.

Sales Manager sees the two salesmen competing for the same lead that will net the company maybe 15% of the revenue target, and, seeing that one of them has a clear 'in', orders the other to back off in order to protect the sale and to allow him to concentrate on bringing in some smaller but just as important revenue.

If the 2nd salesman in that scenario was me, I'd do what I was told because I'm capable of seeing the bigger picture. I might not be happy about it and I might look for another job but I wouldn't risk sinking the deal for both of us and ruin the company's chances at doing Y, harming the long term future of all the company employees.

I'm guessing you'd be the **** that tried to steal the deal and risk the whole lot?

Skeeter · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:54

Matteh said:
Surely you could say the same for Seb? He could have raced hard, got past webber and wrecked his tires in the process ending up second or worse anyway? They both made their choice. One was sporting, the other was Sebastian Vettel.

One got him the win, the other kept him 4th.

Depends what means more to you. Clearly winning means more to Vettel than sportsmanship.

Neo4 · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:55

I dont know that, my point is, neither do you but you proceed to make posts that are fact based on what you have heard. If it turns out that you are correct then the discussion changes.

Kenai · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:55

Skeeter said:
So... no facts.

Well unless we are to assume Webber is a liar, then we know that he turned his engine down and no one else has elected to comment on what Vettel did with his.

From this, some of us have speculated that this means Vettel did not also turn his down.

Such speculation is a far cry from 'Horner has stated they were the same' when so far it seems as if he has done absolutely nothing of the sort?

Skeeter · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:55

DRZ said:
Terrible analogy. This is month 1, not 11. We don't know if the rival salesman hasn't had a day off all year whereas you could have had some time off before.

Additionally, you haven't factored in any risk to the company.

Let's improve the analogy then:

Its week two of FY13 and you are competing to be top salesman to get the bonus. If you two generate above X sales, the overall company can afford to do Y which will vastly benefit the company.

Sales Manager sees the two salesmen competing for the same lead that will net the company maybe 15% of the revenue target, and, seeing that one of them has a clear 'in', orders the other to back off in order to protect the sale and to allow him to concentrate on bringing in some smaller but just as important revenue.

If the 2nd salesman in that scenario was me, I'd do what I was told because I'm capable of seeing the bigger picture. I might not be happy about it and I might look for another job but I wouldn't risk sinking the deal for both of us and ruin the company's chances at doing Y, harming the long term future of all the company employees.

I'm guessing you'd be the **** that tried to steal the deal and risk the whole lot?

Months = laps.
Year = race

Cavallino · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:55

Omg is this lying/cheating debate still going on?
We've gone from F1 to salesmen in a company?

Kenai · 24 Mar 2013 at 21:56

Neo4 said:
Which is as i have said, what you have heard. you dont have the telemetry of either car so it is all what you have heard, that is all i am saying.

Well we might as well not bother with F1 threads ever again then if 'first hand telemetry directly from the cars' is to be considered the standard level of proof.