Matrix Reloaded - Discuss *[WARNING SPOILER]*

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My only complaint about the film is how on earth could the cars keep up with Trinity on the bike she should have left them for dead
 
Originally posted by Tommy D

Why did the machines spare him? I thought he broke free of the Matrix and the other Agents? Wouldn't that make the machines want to kill him, sorry for my stupidity :)
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no he is above them he has evolved and is no longer an agent but a higher level of program. he doesn't need an earpiece probably because he knows everything that is going on automatically as opposed to having to be communicated it, has the ability to duplicate and the ability to teleport into whoever he wants within the matrix.

he is acting more independently off the agents but this is the freedom he is talking about, when neo destroyed him in the sfirst one he freed him fomr a number of the limitations of being an agent he is now far superior.
 
Its not like they put every single miniscule detail in the movie. Smith survived because he was meant to survive. It was fate. Destiny.

The Centinals knew it was smith and that he had planned to destroy those within zion
 
Everyone linked to and inside zion dies at the end of every loop. the 23 people he chooses will already be from inside the matrix, therefore they have no knowledge of the past, he teaches them how to hack it etc etc how to survive the machines, he dies, tells them he will return, then the loop begins again. [/B]
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that is exactly it
every other has choose this choice
except neo
now where does it go

= confusion and waiting till its answered
the cliff hanger is.. that e didnt choose to free the new ones, and for some reason he is outside but still the one? able to stop machines.. so...ahrhghghghgghgh whats real amd i real who am i?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????/
 
Great film. There is a lot of symbolism throughout the film - the film is deeper than just an action/special effect fest. ;)

I was thinking there is a matrix within another matrix, a system within a system if you will.

I was also thinking about the matrix in terms of the bible - Neo being the Jesus character - resurrecting trinity from the dead (Lazarus) and having the choice to save all of mankind. "The one" even becomes resurrected (Ascension/second coming).

The machines also talk about some of the early matrices (matrices is the plural of matrix by the way, please don't use matrixes!) being perfect with no evil. This is like the garden of eden in the bible, where everything was just rosy. But something went wrong (the humans couldn't accept the perfect reality), as did in the bible (Eve eating the forbidden fruit) and because of that, there was evil in the world.

I believe, Agent Smith has a massive part to play in the next film. He has a grudge against Neo, but he is also kind of a rogue program in the system, as is the french guy (whom is supposedly a very dangerous/powerful program himself). In the end, i believe the downfall of the machines will be themselves.

There is a lot of reference throughout the film to "free will" and "choice", and "fate" - this also has religious backgrounds, with regards to God giving us free will in the world, whether it be for good or evil, we have a choice.
 
hmm, I don't like the idea of a Matrix within a Matrix, thats just poo. Too many people have guessed it would be that which makes me think its less likely to be that.

I like the idea that by trying to take Neo in this film SMith has given Neo powers outside of the Matrix, in the same way that Neo gave Smith powers within the Matrix at the end of the first movie. If you understand what I mean.

Also the way I see it Neo isn't the One any more but is more like the Half and the other Half is Smith, hence the reason on the trailer for the third movie Neo has to beat Smith.
 
Double Nested Matrix?

Bit freaky also just back caught the 9 oclock showing and all the way throw i was gearing towards a double nested loop, a matrix within a matrix, its the only way to make sense and is hinted at heavily throughout the film:
the only way the matrix worked was to give humans hope ie the presence of a zion, because they would have hop freedom.
the ability to choose was a prerequisite ie red pill blue pill, am i the one am i not, save morpheous, not save morpheus, save trinity not save trinity, choose the real world stay within the matrix littered with choices.
if zion is destroyed id assume it hard to rebuild, ie the tunnel would already exist straight to it like the m1
the matrix is constantly rebuilt inline with the previous neos, the matrix is simply restarted, within the matrix therefore the only way "the fake real world can kept being destroyed, and and rebuilt with no previous knowledge.
also would explain neo taking his powers from the inner matrix to the outer matrix ie stopping the spuddies right at the end
also easy way to explain bringing himself back from the dead along with trinity because he is still really in the matrix when he snuff it in the ship etc

plus the film is very geeky sentinals - db, matrix - 2 dimensional array, oracle - relational db, why not a double nested matrix or multi dimensional array?
 
About the love thing - the architect KNEW Neo was going to save trinity, he even says that he knows what Neo is going to do. They have factored in his love in their equations. ;)

The matrix within the matrix is never confirmed, just hinted at. However just because it is obvious, doesn't mean that it's not going to be a plot development.

How about this for an ending in the third film - during the last 10 seconds of the film, Neo wakes up in front of his computer screen, at home.
 
Originally posted by daz
The matrix within the matrix is never confirmed, just hinted at. However just because it is obvious, doesn't mean that it's not going to be a plot development.

How about this for an ending in the third film - during the last 10 seconds of the film, Neo wakes up in front of his computer screen, at home.
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I really do hope that its not a Matrix within a Matrix, cause then it gets overly complicated and stupid tbh. And I think its a part of good story telling to make people think one thing then to surprise them with something they didn't think possible, or had never considered.

If they end of third film like that I for one would be so annoyed! The "oh and it was all a dream endings" to movies are terrible.
 
There are 23 council members right? :)

Also, what about the spoon?

There is no spoon in the real world... but there is in the matrix, and in zion. Therefore zion is part of the matrix?
 
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The Architect - ...........Thus, the answer was stumbled upon by another, an intuitive program, initially created to investigate certain aspects of the human psyche. If I am the father of the matrix, she would undoubtedly be its mother.

Neo - The Oracle.

The Architect - Please. As I was saying, she stumbled upon a solution whereby nearly 99.9% of all test subjects accepted the program, as long as they were given a choice, even if they were only aware of the choice at a near unconscious level. While this answer functioned, it was obviously fundamentally flawed, thus creating the otherwise contradictory systemic anomaly, that if left unchecked might threaten the system itself. Ergo, those that refused the program, while a minority, if unchecked, would constitute an escalating probability of disaster.
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Is this reference to the second matrix within the matrix? 99.9% of the people accept the first matrix, but for the other 0.1%, the second matrix is there as a backup...?
 
I think the main problem with the matrix within a matrix problem is that if its posible for people to get out of the first matrix why can't they get out of the second one?

the second system wouldn't have a 100% success rate in keeping people in it, otherwise the second matrix system would be used instead of the first. so we have to assume that this second system is fundementally falwed and has at most 99.9% success rate and therefore someone would have broken out of that before now. and when they broke out of that one maybe there would be another matrix so make people think they are out of that one, it would be just one big loop.

The Wachowski(sp?) Brothers are clever people this matrix within matrix system seems too easy.
 
^^^

Wow.........quite frankly

Definitely take the time out to read that, its mind-blowing stuff, for me its just increased the films depth by a huge factor..

Cant wait for Revolutions!

Can maybe see Morpheus playing an interesting part, he has just been told that the Prophecy (ie the word by which he has lived his life by) is wrong, what effect will that have on him??

Id love to see a form of Redemption as well, maybe morpheus will turn on Zion (Revolution...), followed by redemption by Neo?

Bring it on!!
 
Originally posted by Vipernet
My only complaint about the film is how on earth could the cars keep up with Trinity on the bike she should have left them for dead
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lol, same here, no way a copcar can go as fast as a ducati 998, even if it wasn't an R.

oh well :p
 
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