The deadline for confirming your engine for next season passed a few weeks ago. They said at that time Honda. If they want to change I believe, although I haven't seen it confirmed anywhere, they need agreement of all the teams. Which is far from guaranteed.
McLaren Honda
- Thread starter andicole0
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Even with independant analysis I heard that the McLaren chassis is right up there with the best.
Obviously the Merc engine would have to be retrofitted so all in may be worse than the Williams but by all accounts the car itself is pretty good
Mercedes are using the '17 motor , and I guess this is what Williams will be using next year when Merc use the '18.
Whats stopping McLaren "buying" the '16 Merc motor that Williams is currently using , changing something minor, and badging it as Honda (obviously with Merc say so) hahahaha
Im not expecting a (serious) answer, but I wouldnt be surprised if this was possible somehow (or re-branding it as anything else - ilmor? or something?)
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Man of Honour
Well if Alonso can get a car with 150-200hp down or whatever it is into the points, pretty sure he'd be doing well with level playing field.
Soldato
Is it really 150-200bhp down?
I don't believe it is, at least not at peak power. From what I've read and heard, Honda's Peak Power output is only 50-70HP down on Mercedes but they have issues with length of deployment from their MGU-H connected to the turbocharger. Basically they run out of the extra boost given by the MGU-H on long straights. Mercedes and Ferrari can deploy the boost for longer giving them more power more often. Also with the latest upgrade from Mercedes they can run in higher power modes for longer, making the difference more extreme.
All Mercedes teams are using the 2017 engine, but the custom engines may be a step behind the development of the factory engines. In Canada they received an upgrade that Mercedes themselves have been running for some races now. I'd expect the next Mercedes engines that Hamilton and Bottas use to be upgraded units.
I've heard around 90bhp. But it's not economical. Got a bit of a drinking habit, so they're having to run a lower power setting and carry the maximum fuel where the other teams are underfuelling. When Alonso failed in canada my first thoughts were that he'd run out of fuel as it's a thirsty circuit.[/QUOTE]
Caporegime
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There is nothing between the customer and works team Merc engines. Merc got the updated engines in Spain, the other teams waited, as in every Merc team's second engine was the upgraded engine. IF the customers kicked up a stink them Merc would have delayed their upgraded engine to Canada and given them to everyone. The customer teams likely did have them available for Monaco but no one wanted to waste a new engine in Monaco. Fact is for the customer teams Merc testing the engine ahead of time and finding any marginal issue with a new engine before the other teams is better for them and is precisely why they are happy with doing it this way. Rosberg got a new engine in Monza iirc, was it last year or 2015 now, honestly can't remember. Either way it had an issue and he had to run an old engine, the customer teams are fairly desperate to not have screw ups so they don't have to pay for extra engines(the 16mil covers the cost of the 4 engines, more costs more).
Customer teams are behind Merc because Merc have three times the budget of Williams/FI. Considering they aren't remotely competitive with Merc they lose nothing but gain some safety margin/testing when Merc use an engine a race earlier than them.
Customer teams are behind Merc because Merc have three times the budget of Williams/FI. Considering they aren't remotely competitive with Merc they lose nothing but gain some safety margin/testing when Merc use an engine a race earlier than them.
I gather its this as well plus poor fuel economy.
Don't forget reliability, essentially everything is **** ice, hybrid and reliability.
Finally McLaren Honda are no more. Going to use Renault for the next three years up to the next engine rule change.
Next rumour will be what happens in 2021? Their own engine? Porsche? Cosworth?
http://en.f1i.com/news/279487-mclaren-honda-call-quits.html?utm_source=Web Notifications&utm_campaign=Web Push
Andi.
Next rumour will be what happens in 2021? Their own engine? Porsche? Cosworth?
http://en.f1i.com/news/279487-mclaren-honda-call-quits.html?utm_source=Web Notifications&utm_campaign=Web Push
Andi.
Soldato
Not a fan of the deal, just 2 years ago Red Bull were trying to ditch Renault for exactly the same reasons and they still have reliability issues now, with aero dominance the RB chassis should be at the top of the list but it still falls behind Ferrari and Mercedes. If they're going to mull about the midfield I'd rather they did it with Honda than Renault. Wouldn't mind losing Alonso either if it meant promoting another young driver waiting in the wing.
Someone has to be last for someone to be first.
Someone has to be last for someone to be first.
Soldato
Disappointed. Wanted Honda to come good. 
Soldato
Glad McLaren finally did it. They reputedly paid nothing for those engines and should still feel ripped off.
Disappointed. Wanted Honda to come good.
And when they do, and I'm sure they will, McLaren will be £100M down on budget, still be stuck with a customer Renault engine, stuck with Alonso pulling £20m+ from their already decreased budget and struggling to develop the car. All for short term gain and to keep Alonso happy.
He should have been told STFU or GTFO.
Bets are on that they do in 2018Disappointed. Wanted Honda to come good.
TR beating RB and Renault LoL.Andi.
Soldato
Now that wouldn't surprise me given Alonso's luck 
Soldato
It's not just to keep Alonso happy - it's damaging McLaren as a brand too. Losing Alonso and staying with Honda wouldn't change that so long as Honda don't improve in the near future, and who genuinely thinks that they will? It's possible of course, and it's little risk for Red Bull (commercially and because they've dumped them on their B-team for now) but it is a big risk for McLaren (a company trying to sell supercars and without a B-team test bed).And when they do, and I'm sure they will, McLaren will be £100M down on budget, still be stuck with a customer Renault engine, stuck with Alonso pulling £20m+ from their already decreased budget and struggling to develop the car. All for short term gain and to keep Alonso happy.
He should have been told STFU or GTFO.
Renault are hardly top of the class, hence Red Bull willingly dipping their toes in the water, but Red Bull are able to fight for the odd podium and have 6 wins in the turbo era - McLaren's best result with Honda was a 5th (a rain-affected race on a slow circuit where pretty much everyone but Alonso ****** up, and they still finished 24 seconds behind the nearest (and damaged) Red Bull).
I firmly believe Honda will come good and McLaren should take some of the responsibility for this debacle with their insistence on the 'size zero' when Honda first joined which meant the engine design and layout was fundamentally flawed and had a very low maximum potential. They signed up for ten years and they should honour that. If Honda come good, and I'm sure they will, Red Bull get the works engine deal they want, McLaren still can't win anything as a customer team and are majorly down on budget. This could potentially be a disaster and they could end up like Williams and Toro Rosso. A good car at the start of the season but unable to keep up with the development the big teams can due to budget.
Soldato
I find it more damaging that McLaren would want to lose $100m in Honda support just to keep Alonso (and pay his bill) and drive around with the 3rd worst engine instead of the 4th (and pay their bill). Alonso still won't be winning races so he's lying about his reasons to stay.
Once the current batch of junior drivers are through we'll probably see Honda take over TR and return as a constructor. I get the feeling that's why they wanted the Sauber deal but Longbow probably wouldn't see a return on their investment running with Honda engines, but even if they got half the deal McLaren had that's still nearly half their yearly budget.
Once the current batch of junior drivers are through we'll probably see Honda take over TR and return as a constructor. I get the feeling that's why they wanted the Sauber deal but Longbow probably wouldn't see a return on their investment running with Honda engines, but even if they got half the deal McLaren had that's still nearly half their yearly budget.