Meanwhile in Hong Kong....

It's going to get messy, but the more pushy China gets the more HK will resent them.

If people try to flee the city the Chinese will stop them and they'll basically be prisoners like North Koreans are. They won't allow a worker/skill drain.
 
Apparently there are protestors outside our hotel building.

Might go outside and check it out...
 
Protestors gathering in TST.

IMG-20190803-191226.jpg



Can hear them walking down Nathan Road and loads coming from Hung Hom now.
 
Salisbury Road has been blocked off but an ambulance and a car drove down and protestors moved out of the way and removed barricades before they were even close to them.

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Supposed to be leaving today, although not until late tonight.

Could be an interesting day.
 
Azza said:
protestors moved out of the way and removed barricades before they were even close to them
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The level of organisation and strategy involved is quite something, though it has to be for what they are up against.

Meddling-Monk said:
Exactly what I talked about already; Giving yourself a way out.

They had the lawmakers attention; they had already stalled the progress of it (extradition to China) getting into actual Law. They should have pressed for more assurances and other protections written in as much as possible instead that target many and protect many. Then, when and if China does press down on Hong Kong, even after the 50 years they promised, any direct changes to something like that which impacts many people of HK (which likely would happen as it doesn't favour China) could allow the people of HK a way out by seeking Asylum as their laws and protections are being erased (a large group is being affected; one of the criteria for Asylum). Something they can't do right now as it'll be all seen as a domestic issue instead because they chose to make the news by acting out as hoodlums instead.

:: edit ::

They need to stick to the goal: Change the Law. Not change the country.
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This isn't about winning battles though - they either win the "war" or ultimately it is all for nothing, law changes or otherwise, and short of fundamentally changing China I can't see how they can win. There seems to be some understanding of this behind those protesting but I still can't see how they can prevail.
 
Meddling-Monk said:
Exactly what I talked about already; Giving yourself a way out.

They had the lawmakers attention; they had already stalled the progress of it (extradition to China) getting into actual Law. They should have pressed for more assurances and other protections written in as much as possible instead that target many and protect many. Then, when and if China does press down on Hong Kong, even after the 50 years they promised, any direct changes to something like that which impacts many people of HK (which likely would happen as it doesn't favour China) could allow the people of HK a way out by seeking Asylum as their laws and protections are being erased (a large group is being affected; one of the criteria for Asylum). Something they can't do right now as it'll be all seen as a domestic issue instead because they chose to make the news by acting out as hoodlums instead.

:: edit ::

They need to stick to the goal: Change the Law. Not change the country.
Click to expand...

China are using digital surveillance to spy on and lock up Uighur Muslims in detainment camps after just snatching them up off the streets, they're breaching probably every human rights law there is in the mainland. On top of that they're bringing in what can be best described as digital totalitarianism with their social credit system. The only reason nothing is being done (besides Trump's sanctions) is because nobody has the power to make them do anything.

China don't have much respect for the law unless it's some international climate agreement whereby they can continue to pollute as much as they want while the rest of the world have to stifle their economies trying to meet targets.
 
I suspect the protest has gone so far as to guarantee faster what it aimed to prevent. Maybe the smarter ones are packing their bags to migrate already.

The last time they feared mainland culture incursion, just before the handover, there were media tales about Hong Kongers proposing to buy a chunk of Northern Australia as a resettlement territory.

To clarify "smarter" - I mean those that cant be bothered to change their lifestyle for the sake of an overly-worried intrusive irrelevance.
 
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Beijing is looking mighty **** at the moment, God Emperor Xi can't have that.

I suspect many people are about to be disappeared and god knows what will happen if a recession hits soon (which is very likely).
 
I found it a bit odd that at one time we was getting live streamed coverage on both BBC News and Sky News. What is the point?

It feels like we're watching in slow motion car crash that to some degree we have contributed to.
 
Bowdon, I suspect that car crash began at the latest when they adopted Confucianism - 2000yrs or so ago. Ie. 'dont criticise your parents' which became "you have no right to criticise your parents", and by extension "no right to criticise any authority". So an ex-mainland wife explained it to me years ago.

For that reason, versus Henry 8 (who rightly ended the hegemony of the specious authority of the dark ages), I believe the Chinese have no stomach for debate, constructive dissent, democracy. It, the root of the current reactionism, didnt ' start' with Tiananmen square.

Frankly, I suspect the 'weight' of their system history prohibits their sociopolitical adaptability - no matter who the current captain of their ship is.

Plus,we cant take their avowed Communism seriously. Even Mao didnt believe in it - "communism is not the solution. It is the hammer with which we defeat the enemy".
 
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What's the saying? 'better an hour in Piccadilly than a year in the Orient'! Business is always important.
 
mmj_uk said:
China are using digital surveillance to spy on and lock up Uighur Muslims in detainment camps after just snatching them up off the streets, they're breaching probably every human rights law there is in the mainland. On top of that they're bringing in what can be best described as digital totalitarianism with their social credit system. The only reason nothing is being done (besides Trump's sanctions) is because nobody has the power to make them do anything.
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Exactly. Why fight something you can do nothing about?

China don't have much respect for the law unless it's some international climate agreement whereby they can continue to pollute as much as they want while the rest of the world have to stifle their economies trying to meet targets.
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China doesn't care about specific laws that doesn't suit itself, doesn't mean other countries won't. And those added protection laws aren't to protect yourself as a HKer, but to give yourself a way out if it goes all to pot. But "Nnnoooooooo-o-o-o-o-o......", mobster mentality has taken over the people there instead of thinking with their heads.
 
What happens in 2047 when the Basic Law expires? Will HK become totally Chinese then and lose its dollar, drive on the right, etc.
 
It ceases to exist, the issue being that probably means capital flight among other issues, i guess China has a plan nonetheless that it isn't sharing on how to keep it pretty.

The protesters are ironically hastening it, but then it's not really as if they have choice, it's wait 27 years and leave, leave now or attempt to defend itself, because Beijing is coming.
 
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