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NVIDIA 4000 Series

Joxeon said:
Demand isn't growing though and was reported that GPU sales are at there lowest point for 20 years, Nvidia's gaming revenue is less than half of what it was a couple of years ago and thats with most the cards costing over double the MSRP from the previous gen when you look at the die sizes used. take a 4080 for example with an MSRP of $1200 while using a smaller die than a 3060ti and 16gb VRAM now costing less than 8gb did in 2021, Nvidia would have sold a 3060ti die and VRAM to board partners for less than $400 but you can bet that board partners are now paying significantly more for the 4080 die and VRAM, probably closer to $900.
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different die, different prices and dev time, and whatever else so a comparison like that wont be accurate by a long shot
as die sizes goes down price goes up a lot
 
NZXT30 said:
Steam has 171m monthly active users and 35m concurrent users on a Sunday. The console numbers you quote are insignificant. MS has managed to sell 25m Xbox series consoles total while Steam has 35m+ PC gamers online at the same time on a Sunday. Truly pathetic numbers for consoles while gaming keeps on growing. Add to that huge pc games that are not on steam like League of legends, Valorant, Fortnite, WOW etc and you end up with an enormous userbase.

Some RTX cards went to miners temporarily but ended up to gamers hands through the second hand market, hence the dip on new GPU sales volume which is now picking back up. I saw the latest numbers yesterday and PS5 is selling 10% more than PS4 while Xbox series 10% less than Xbox one. Total stagnation for the console market while Steam will break another record this holiday season.

Expecting cheaper GPUs while demand is only growing is completely delusional. Every kid watches their favourite TwitchTV streamer and their PC gaming rig and that's all they want eventually. Nobody wants cheap garbage anymore and we see that with phones, tablets, TVs etc.

I'm very active on a huge TV and home cinema forum and all I see is people connecting their gaming rigs to TVs. Nobody wants to spend their hard earned on an OLED or mini led and connect it to a PS5 that will drop to 720p in latest games.
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But how many of those steam users are using actual current Gen hardware comparable with current Gen consoles?
 
RBImGuy said:
different die, different prices and dev time, and whatever else so a comparison like that wont be accurate by a long shot
as die sizes goes down price goes up a lot
Click to expand...

Smaller die size and more on a wafer.. So prices should not be going up as much as Nvidia is selling them for, get real a die costs nothing in comparison to the product price. Yes I agree node shrinks cost more but even if it was 3x more for just the die that doesn't add up to double the price as we see with the 4080 that is actually on a lot smaller die than the 3080/ti/3090/ti and even smaller than a 3060ti but the product x80 range has doubled in one generation ? Even the 4090 is on a smaller die than the 3090/ti and has even more disabled cores than the 3090 that had 2% disabled only compared to the 3090ti.

That doubling in price has never happened before and is just Nvidia taking the micky, imagine any other hardware manufacturer doing that or semiconductor using company that makes any product, like TVs,washing machines, car parts, etc, who would buy a car at double the price of previous year because of a few chips cost 2x,3x more that cost a few pennies to manufacture or even advanced chips that cost a $100+.. Nvidia's chips do not even cost $100 even on the 4090 to buy from TSMC. I'm sure they are like half that price not looked into it recently but that is the reality they are not the main cost of the graphics card there is pcbs, components, cooling, manufacturing, packaging and costs to export them. None of these things have doubled too.
 
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cola said:
But how many of those steam users are using actual current Gen hardware comparable with current Gen consoles?
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I've always said the number of people who actually have decent GPUs in that number is quite small.
To get a similar experience to the PS5, you need a 3070ti at least, and that GPU costs more then the PS5.
And when you get to this tier is GPUs, it's not that many, the devs know this.
 
cola said:
But how many of those steam users are using actual current Gen hardware comparable with current Gen consoles?
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You can do that calculation yourself. All it takes is a bit of effort to add all the % from the Ps5 and above GPUs from the steam hardware survey and extrapolate that from the 171m active userbase.

I'll save you the effort and tell you it's higher than the total ps5 sales. Bare in mind that's monthly active PC gamers on Steam alone versus total Ps5 hardware sales which includes PS5s not used or even broken.
 
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RBImGuy said:
different die, different prices and dev time, and whatever else so a comparison like that wont be accurate by a long shot
as die sizes goes down price goes up a lot
Click to expand...
All we know from Nvidia's financials is that they are still making nearly 3b a quarter off gaming despite selling the lowest volume for 20 years so cost savings have been found somewhere in the chain.
 
Raelgun said:
I've always said the number of people who actually have decent GPUs in that number is quite small.
To get a similar experience to the PS5, you need a 3070ti at least, and that GPU costs more then the PS5.
And when you get to this tier is GPUs, it's not that many, the devs know this.
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Is that true though? I saw DF's video on Alan Wake 2 where a 3080 was running 2x the framerate of the PS5 at the same/similar settings.
 
Joxeon said:
All we know from Nvidia's financials is that they are still making nearly 3b a quarter off gaming despite selling the lowest volume for 20 years so cost savings have been found somewhere in the chain.
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Historically the newer replacement 70 series would perform on par<> with the previous gens top dog.

The 4070 didn't match the previous 90 and performs lower than a 3080@4K unless it runs over 10Gb.

Quite a chunk of the 40 series cost saving came via shrinking everything apart from the vram and went all Jackanory about the extra cache, while moving performance to software in some games.

Skyrocketing the price clearly shows how insane current profit margin is achievable by selling much much less product.
 
NZXT30 said:
You can do that calculation yourself. All it takes is a bit of effort to add all the % from the Ps5 and above GPUs from the steam hardware survey and extrapolate that from the 171m active userbase.

I'll save you the effort and tell you it's higher than the total ps5 sales. Bare in mind that's monthly active PC gamers on Steam alone versus total Ps5 hardware sales which includes PS5s not used or even broken.
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NZXT30 said:
You can do that calculation yourself. All it takes is a bit of effort to add all the % from the Ps5 and above GPUs from the steam hardware survey and extrapolate that from the 171m active userbase.

I'll save you the effort and tell you it's higher than the total ps5 sales. Bare in mind that's monthly active PC gamers on Steam alone versus total Ps5 hardware sales which includes PS5s not used or even broken.
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Nah I'm way too lazy to do the calculations myself, please tell me what the numbers for Xbox/PS5 and switch sales together look like then compared to active steam users or maybe for a laugh you could include everyone playing any console ever anywhere in the world right now, since we're including people with 15 year old laptops just because they logged into steam this week
 
cola said:
Nah I'm way too lazy to do the calculations myself, please tell me what the numbers for Xbox/PS5 and switch sales together look like then compared to active steam users or maybe for a laugh you could include everyone playing any console ever anywhere in the world right now, since we're including people with 15 year old laptops just because they logged into steam this week
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Combing Xbox PS5 and Switch is very silly btw. Each one of those three is an independent and isolated platform and they are also the fiercest competitors. Good thing you can play games from all three platforms on PC ;)

PSN has an active monthly active userbase of 107m (they even count mobile phone devices along with all the playstations). League of Legends alone has an active monthly userbase of 180m, add to that some 170m Steam users(Valve counts you as an active user if you played at least one game in 30 days). There is really no comparison.

Even after combining all three consoles PC gaming userbase in total is bigger. The only thing bigger than PC gaming is mobile phone gaming.

If you want cheaper GPUs by all means move to garbage consoles, help bring down the demand a bit.
 
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NZXT30 said:
Combing Xbox PS5 and Switch is very silly btw. Each one of those three is an independent and isolated platform and they are also the fiercest competitors. Good thing you can play games from all three platforms on PC ;)

PSN has an active monthly active userbase of 107m (they even count mobile phone devices along with all the playstations). League of Legends alone has an active monthly userbase of 180m, add to that some 170m Steam users(Valve counts you as an active user if you played at least one game in 30 days). There is really no comparison.

Even after combining all three consoles PC gaming userbase in total is bigger. The only thing bigger than PC gaming is mobile phone gaming.

If you want cheaper GPUs by all means move to garbage consoles, help bring down the demand a bit.
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Me personally I've been playing GameCube and super Nintendo games the last couple weeks, where is that in your figures? Bit silly to start count individual games as well surely as they might be the same people using steam as well so they suddenly count as different people? It seems the figures are only silly when it doesn't suit your argument I think.
 
Raelgun said:
I've always said the number of people who actually have decent GPUs in that number is quite small.
To get a similar experience to the PS5, you need a 3070ti at least, and that GPU costs more then the PS5.
And when you get to this tier is GPUs, it's not that many, the devs know this.
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My BIL brought his ps5 round a while ago and was visibly gutted by how much better my 3070 pc looked and ran compared.
 
Handbrake 1.7 is now out and supports the AV1 encoders for both AMD and Nvidia. I tested it against the previous Nightly build and the encode speed is actually faster:

TGgbIUJ.png


1.7 release on left, nightly on right.

In order on the queue list:
1: AV1 (NVEnc)
2: H265 (NVEnc)
3: H264 (NVEnc)
 
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