NVIDIA 4000 Series

[g67575]

Don't we already know that the next gen is codename "Blackwell"?

In which case calling it "Ada Lovelace-Next" suggests fake guesswork to me.

Not necessarily. Nvidia's previous roadmaps just put 'Next' on things, I don't think the naming is important. Some people like to follow every alleged leak, I do not.

Just like Ada Lovelace is a development of Ampere, e.g. 'Ampere Next'.

Add to this, that Nvidia has made no announcements of a new GPU series this year.

In my opinion, launching more RTX 4000 series GPUs doesn't indicate a move towards preparing to release a new generation.

In contrast, AMD has been clear in advance that RDNA4 is scheduled for the 2nd half of 2024.

 

[Vertigo]

In my opinion, launching more RTX 4000 series GPUs doesn't indicate a move towards preparing to release a new generation.

They released the 3090Ti in Jan 2022 and then the 40-series only 8 months later.

 

[g67575]

They released the 3090Ti in Jan 2022 and then the 40-series only 8 months later.

Thats just an argument for the next gen not releasing until many months after the 4090 TI (e.g. top tier die GPU) being released.

At the moment, Nvidia is putting the best AD102 GPU dies into professional cards like this, maybe the yields haven't been good enough thus far, for a wider consumer release:

NVIDIA L40 Specs

NVIDIA AD102, 2490 MHz, 18176 Cores, 568 TMUs, 192 ROPs, 49152 MB GDDR6, 2250 MHz, 384 bit

www.techpowerup.com

TPU estimates around 9% higher performance for this spec, vs the RTX 4090.

I imagine with a moderate increase in GPU clock, they'd get a bit more out of it than that.

Plenty of money to be made from £2,000 desktop GPUs

 

[Joxeon]

Add to this, that Nvidia has made no announcements of a new GPU series this year.

Nvidia will not announce new GPUs till weeks before release, if they come out now and announce next gen GPUs coming later this year it would absolutely crush sales of their current stuff.

 

[g67575]

Nvidia will not announce new GPUs till weeks before release, if they come out now and announce next gen GPUs coming later this year it would absolutely crush sales of their current stuff.

Neither have they confirmed plans for a 2025 release, but it's certainly coming by then. They won't confirm any delays, no company ever does unless forced to.

Last time we saw Super GPUs released (RTX 2000 series), the following generation did not launch until the next year (2020).

The purpose of the new Super GPUs is to keep up competition with AMD's offering, which it will do for most, if not all of 2024.

 

[Vertigo]

Thats just an argument for the next gen not releasing until many months after the 4090 TI (e.g. top tier die GPU) being released.

At the moment, Nvidia is putting the best AD102 GPU dies into professional cards like this, maybe the yields haven't been good enough thus far, for a wider consumer release:

NVIDIA L40 Specs

NVIDIA AD102, 2490 MHz, 18176 Cores, 568 TMUs, 192 ROPs, 49152 MB GDDR6, 2250 MHz, 384 bit

www.techpowerup.com

TPU estimates around 9% higher performance for this spec, vs the RTX 4090.

I imagine with a moderate increase in GPU clock, they'd get a bit more out of it than that.

Plenty of money to be made from £2,000 desktop GPUs

My point was that the release of new products in a given architecture is no indication of how long until the next architecture is released.
Just as they released the 3090Ti only 8 months before 40-series was launched, there could just as easily only be 8 months after the 40-series SUPERs before 50-series arrives.

As for the 4090Ti specifically, I think it's a toss-up whether this ever appears. A while ago I'd have said it was almost a certainty but now, with the best AD102 chips being hoovered up for the dedicated AI cards, the already rising prices and limited availability of the 4090 and just the backlash the 3090Ti got, they may think better of it.

 

[g67575]

Maybe there will be a token launch of the RTX 4090 TI in the 2nd half of 2024, to try to keep up with AMD's flagship.

 

[Vertigo]

Maybe there will be a token launch of the RTX 4090 TI in the 2nd half of 2024, to try to keep up with AMD's flagship.

I have zero confidence in AMD's ability to compete right now. Their last few generations have been woefully inadequate, barely competing with NVidia in basic rasterisation and lagging seriously behind in RT and other features.

It's actually AMD I blame for the current GPU pricing than NVidia. NVidia have a responsiibility to their shareholders to maximise profits and decent competition is the only thing that will bring prices down.

 

[g67575]

It's actually AMD I blame for the current GPU pricing than NVidia. NVidia have a responsiibility to their shareholders to maximise profits and decent competition is the only thing that will bring prices down.

It's not even the main part of AMD's business, they have always been a CPU company. That's still true, Ryzen CPUs have allowed them to compete effectively with companies like Intel again...

GPUs (after acquiring ATI) were initially just an additional area where the company could make money...

 

[Amraam]

Yup I'll be jumping on the 4080 Super FE IF I can actually get one of the 10 cards available at launch and the £950 price isn't suddenly £1050 etc.

 

[g67575]

Yup I'll be jumping on the 4080 Super FE IF I can actually get one of the 10 cards available at launch and the £950 price isn't suddenly £1050 etc.

It makes the RTX 4090 seem like crap value. Especially if sold at £900.

Everything but the (overpriced) RTX 4090 FE costs >£1,700

A similar thing happened with the RTX 3080 TI and RTX 3090.

 

[Vertigo]

Yup I'll be jumping on the 4080 Super FE IF I can actually get one of the 10 cards available at launch and the £950 price isn't suddenly £1050 etc.

To be fair, NVidia have always stuck to their original pricing with the FE cards, with the exception of some slight fluctuation in 4090 pricing since launch.

It's availability that's always been the issue.

 

[decto]

Nvidia pulls another marketing masterclass

Price the 4080 close to the 4090 so everyone buys 4090

When you're running out of suckers, drop the 4080 price to just under £1k and everyone rejoices at the new bargain 80 series cards

 

[rare]

Their last few generations have been woefully inadequate, barely competing with NVidia in basic rasterisation

That isn’t true? Their rasterisation performance is broadly very competitive.

 

[g67575]

That isn’t true? Their rasterisation performance is broadly very competitive.

it's just because some people only compare to the £1,579 RTX 4090.

But AMD is not too far behind with RDNA3.

It will be interesting to see what Intel can offer with their 2nd gen Battlemage GPUs, coming in 2H 2024.

I think it's fair to say that the first gen was pretty 'mid'.

AMD may have to up their game with RDNA4 if Battlemage is decent, and becomes the 'value' option for gamers.

The TDP is apparently 'just' 225w for Battlemage (same as the previous gen), so think it is likely not to be quite as fast as cards like the RX 7900 XT.

 

[t2na]

That isn’t true? Their rasterisation performance is broadly very competitive.

Yeah, I was gonna say - raster performance on AMD cards is the one element that they do compete very well with Nvidia.

It's features like DLSS, Reflex, RT etc. where AMD are behind.

 

[Sargatanas2511]

I have zero confidence in AMD's ability to compete right now. Their last few generations have been woefully inadequate, barely competing with NVidia in basic rasterisation and lagging seriously behind in RT and other features.

It's actually AMD I blame for the current GPU pricing than NVidia. NVidia have a responsiibility to their shareholders to maximise profits and decent competition is the only thing that will bring prices down.

I mean for raster the 7900XTX is cheaper than the 4080 and has been for a year and yet a few percent faster, while offering slightly better than 3090 RT performance. Yes the RT performance is worse than Nvidia but is it really as horrible as you make it sound?

Nvidia have the better software suite though for sure.

 

[random_matt]

I mean for raster the 7900XTX is cheaper than the 4080 and has been for a year and yet a few percent faster, while offering slightly better than 3090 RT performance. Yes the RT performance is worse than Nvidia but is it really as horrible as you make it sound?

Nvidia have the better software suite though for sure.

I find NVIDIA's interface horribly outdated.

 

[Joxeon]

The purpose of the new Super GPUs is to keep up competition with AMD's offering, which it will do for most, if not all of 2024.

Thats not why we are getting the supers since Nvidia don't care about AMD at all and don't even use AMDs cards as a comparison. The reason why we are getting the supers is because the vanilla cards wasn't selling well at their price points not because people were flocking to buy AMD instead.

Its people like myself who had the cash waiting and would have bought a 4080 had it been priced better to begin with, I didn't buy AMD either because their offerings were almost as poorly priced, I will not be buying the super either as we are now over half way through the cycle now and I'm not willing to pay £950 for an 103 when last time I got a GA102 for £649. If there is enough people like myself about then we may see the 5080 drop back down to around £800 again.

 

[Sargatanas2511]

I find NVIDIA's interface horribly outdated.

Interface yes, I noticed that when I changed too. The software offerings like Reflex, DLDSR, DLSS and such are overall better than AMD's offerings though.