They'll have to flog those 6900s for £500 each if they want to shift them, otherwise they'll just have to hold onto them and appreciate the dust accumulation on the boxes. Makes zero sense to buy one at anywhere near their current pricing on there.
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NVIDIA 4000 Series
- Thread starter MrClippy
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They'll have to flog those 6900s for £500 each if they want to shift them, otherwise they'll just have to hold onto them and appreciate the dust accumulation on the boxes. Makes zero sense to buy one at anywhere near their current pricing on there.
Caporegime
Less even, the 7800 XT starts at £480.
Get a 5090 and make a thread asking if 24GB is enough
Just kidding mods, you know it's funny though
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Caporegime
The 6900 XT is 103% at 1440P according to TPU, they are essentially the same.
If you take overclocking in to account the 6900 XT can't get anywhere near it, the 7800 XT is in reality a faster card, and newer.
Its a bloody good card.
IMO the winner out of this whole generation from both sides.
If you take overclocking in to account the 6900 XT can't get anywhere near it, the 7800 XT is in reality a faster card, and newer.
Its a bloody good card.
IMO the winner out of this whole generation from both sides.
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Highly doubtful, unless consumers will press them with class action and similar.
Gigabyte RTX 4090/RTX 4080 revision reinforces PCB to avoid cracks - KitGuru
One of the most surprising things with Nvidia's latest generation of gaming graphics cards was the swww.kitguru.net
Hmm, I wonder if they'll make this right across warranty claims they voided sending the card back with an arrow sticker pointing to the crack in the pcb, typically near the pcie connector.
That was quickly removed just after release, they kept to reflections only after that, less rays in general, better denoiser and big optimisations in their engine where NVIDIA helped them a lot. Effect was over 50% more FPS on average with RT. Generally speaking, caustic effects with transparent objects are a total killer for RT performance, which is why you don't really see that in games almost at all. Which sucks, as that is one of the most impressive RT effects (together with GI).
BF V has already been heavily optimised in one of the patches, with NVIDIA involvement into it. Optimisations here (aside number of rays) were mostly in the engine itself, in a way how it prepares raster part before applying RT and then how RT rays are being submitted to accelerators etc. After that patch they were done, as that was all the optimisations they could do on 2000 series GPUs, as far as I recall what devs said about it. It didn't change how RT itself is calculated, but how engine does everything around it. Modern engines aren't different in that regard, as what can be accelerated did not change since that time. New hardware might change it, we'll see what next series brings.
That's because the GI is the thing that is IMHO giving the biggest visual upgrade. And it's relatively not that hard to do with current hardware.
What we see in terms of RT reflections in games so far is still very simplified, missing quite a few elements of what actually makes reflections real. Things of that kind are the subsurface scattering, caustics etc., constant animation of reflective surface (that's why you don't see real waves usually, just flat puddles, or not moving glass etc.) - all of that is very computationally intensive, with many rays needed, and current hardware just isn't good enough (even 4090 with all AI helpers). There's a reason that 3D rendering software takes many seconds to minutes to render 1 frame on 4090 with actually including all the effects - same hardware, same acceleration, but that is as close to physics as they could do, whereas in games you get very simplified version of RT/PT, missing many physical elements and a miniscule number of rays in comparison.That was quickly removed just after release, they kept to reflections only after that, less rays in general, better denoiser and big optimisations in their engine where NVIDIA helped them a lot. Effect was over 50% more FPS on average with RT. Generally speaking, caustic effects with transparent objects are a total killer for RT performance, which is why you don't really see that in games almost at all. Which sucks, as that is one of the most impressive RT effects (together with GI).
BF V has already been heavily optimised in one of the patches, with NVIDIA involvement into it. Optimisations here (aside number of rays) were mostly in the engine itself, in a way how it prepares raster part before applying RT and then how RT rays are being submitted to accelerators etc. After that patch they were done, as that was all the optimisations they could do on 2000 series GPUs, as far as I recall what devs said about it. It didn't change how RT itself is calculated, but how engine does everything around it. Modern engines aren't different in that regard, as what can be accelerated did not change since that time. New hardware might change it, we'll see what next series brings.
That's because the GI is the thing that is IMHO giving the biggest visual upgrade. And it's relatively not that hard to do with current hardware.
The best thing for me with RT reflections isn't so much the reflections themselves looking better but more just not having visual artifacts anymore e.g.
Just immersion breaking as hell seeing that.
Fully agreed here, not seeing in CP2077 for example SSR vanishing when moving camera and other oddities was great. Now, I always found it weird that much older games had proper reflections - looking fine, not artefacting, not having SSR issues with camera movement etc. It felt like a big downgrade when games started to use SSR instead of the old cube mapped etc. ones. However, remembering these old one still feels like RT is just bringing back what I already seen back then - though I realise that old tech is way worse and likely wouldn't look good in new games at all. SSR was more of a stop-gap and it shows.
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No one knows what the 5090 will bring or when but bear in mind that a large part of the bump from the 3090 to the 4090 was due to a huge reduction in process size from 8nm to 5nm which facilitated a 2.7x increase in transistors and a 50% increase in boost clocks on a slightly smaller die.
That won't be repeated with the 5090.
Soldato
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You do have waves in CB77, including those generated by player movement or bullets. It's normally on the large body of water around the city or some large areas where is water (the park for instance).
Ah yes, that's correct, same with Witcher 3 with RT. Though, in W3 turning on RT changes completely waving of water and makes it much calmer and in both cases reflections are very simple - as in, they completely ignore any depth and other properties of water and just treat it as fully reflective mirror. Which is not how light works in reality with water at all. Also, in CP2077 water doesn't intereact with player, as I just double checked - shooting at it, moving in it etc. changes nothing in waving and RT, which is most likely another simplification to cut down on computation and not kill FPS completely.
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Soldato
Also remember that DX12 is still broken to this very day in BFV. It stutters like mad.
So the RT effects are moot as you cant run the game with DX12 anyway. (and it be a enjoyable experience)
So the RT effects are moot as you cant run the game with DX12 anyway. (and it be a enjoyable experience)
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They do have the option to increase chip size / use more of the chip. The 4090 uses less of the full chip than any 80ti / 90 cards have done before while the 4080 was only using the equivalent to 53% CUDA of a full 102 which is lower than the 70 class usually has so plenty of performance on the table if Nvidia wants to go that way.
The 5090 would have to go bigger to see noticeable improvements (not necessarily bigger chip), but more cores and cache, but if the 3nm process doesnt provide that then it would be a bigger chip.
Everything else from the 5080 down has way more headroom to play with, because as mentioned by Joxeon, the 4080 and down are all huge cut downs from the best 5nm chips, so shrinking down to 3nm gives even more headroom.
I think its very plausible for a 5090 to maybe only be 30% faster than the 4090 and then for the 5080 and down to be 50% faster than their predecessor and even more energy efficient
Everything else from the 5080 down has way more headroom to play with, because as mentioned by Joxeon, the 4080 and down are all huge cut downs from the best 5nm chips, so shrinking down to 3nm gives even more headroom.
I think its very plausible for a 5090 to maybe only be 30% faster than the 4090 and then for the 5080 and down to be 50% faster than their predecessor and even more energy efficient
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Depends on where you are, there are a number of areas where the water reacts to you:
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Physics especially water based physics in games have been lacking for a long time regardless of RT, very few games now offer good destruction and even simple things (well not simple given the amount of work required with raster for this) like shooting out lights have become very rare.
I agree you cannot know how good the 5090 will be but there will be improvements, whether small or large.
If you are going to spend £1500 to £2000 on a Graphics card at this time, and there is no urgency, then might as well wait as to get a card that will at least be the best for 1-2 years rather than a few months.
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Soldato
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Like @Nexus18 said, you do get the water reacting to your player movements and bullets, but it's rather limited - not necessarily something due to RT/PT, just that CDPR doesn't bother too much with it. After all, it was pants at launch. More advanced effects were in the path tracing version of Minecraft covered by DF (which is ironic when you think about it). Sadly, no game has been build up yet entirely based on something like path tracing and just have a dumbed down raster version which doesn't really matter... But... we had open world highly destructive words like Red Faction Guerrila and yet, two consoles gen later and a **** town of TF later, we're still acting like its 2000 when it comes to physics...
Anyway, just like with a good raster implementation, so does RT/PT requires one. Is far from perfect, like you've said, we can't generate just yet a lot of rays, but we can do all sorts of work arounds - similar to raster trickery. For stuff like reflections it should be paramount and present in every single game at this point by default.
It's interesting to now see in some games where the raster version of effects look just downright awful too especially for reflections e.g. darktide, returnal, suicide squad, star wars jedi survivor just to name a few... Problem we have is then people say that raster is being gimped to make rt look good e.g. look at DL 2 when it came out
Poor devs had to go and sink in time and money to improve the raster effects due to the backlash. This is where the devs for avatar and spiderman 2 have done it right, whilst still in the grand scheme of things, pretty light compared to aw 2 and cp 2077 and metro ee, they have RT regardless of what setting you use so no raster support, that way, problem solved.
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I'd take a 4070 if they drop the price.
Seems to be no chance of that though, a competitor still has £400 3060ti and a £600 one, still no price drop after all this time. Apparently content to just sit and let them collect dust. I suspect same will happen to the 4070
.As for they were bought at a higher price so they can't drop, pretty sure I remember gibbo saying something along the lines of market is volatile, have to take the good with the bad, make money when you can etc, when everyone was bending over the consumers for gpus with every excuse under the sun & someone pointed out the record profits being made.
So they had their good times, now it's the bad and they can drop the prices
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