NVIDIA 4000 Series

[Subzero85]

I love my PC gaming, but nvidia went from like £699 to £1100 in one generation, im going to have to stick with my 2080 a while yet, no way in this market can i justify that kind of money for a graphics card, i find it hard enough to part with £700 - £800 for a card

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Thanks for the articles and links, I will have a full read of them.
Seems that RT gives better lighting and shadows, as well as the reflections?
I know I am being flippant, but when you see most ray tracing comparisons it does highlight the reflections. Look at Port Royal, it's full of shiny surfaces.

The before/after versions of the games are interesting on that link you gave.
I'd rather have the 'before' version (no ray tracing) of the game at a reasonable price and framerate, rather than the (to me) marginally better visuals of the 'after' version of the game.
I tried Control in RT on a 3080, and the significant loss of framerate was far more noticeable to me than the slightly better visuals.

Because the shiny surfaces and latex clothing is something obvious. So they try and over emphasis that set of effects. But it doesn't look realistic.

It was the same with PhysX. If you look at some games,they seemingly removed a lot of normal physics effects out of the game(you could see them in other games),then made it run poorly on CPUs(x87 instructions),and then made OTT physics effects when you switched it on.

 

[Nexus18]

RT is a lot like HDR. You don’t realise what you are missing until you see it in action on proper hardware. Then gaming without it is pretty much unusable. You see the flaws in rasterisation easily and are less impressed. Personally there is absolutely no way I can go back to traditional raster now that I have seen RT and HDR on an OLED monitor.

I've said the same many times now. It's extremely obvious with reflections, no matter how good a games reflections may be i.e. rdr 2 reflections, you can't help but notice the reflections distorting, disappearing (sometimes even entirely), weird halo outlines and so on, it is rather immersion breaking imo e.g. look at this from bf 1, around the solider:



In motion, it is even more jarring.

Thing is, people always just think oh "shiny reflections", "fancy lighting" but as per 4a enhanced comment, one of the best things to come from RT will be allowing for dynamic environments i.e. better destruction on maps, it's why so few games have this now and why BF games have progressively got worse for destruction elements since bc 2 as it just requires so much time and effort.

WhilstRay Tracing might have a place in some genres, it doesnt mean forcing it (and by forcing it - nvidia funding the developement) of any game that might use it - RTS games using Ray Tracing? Why??

Not sure riftbreaker is really a "RTS" game? But it is a top down one, it's one of my favourite RT games and amd sponsored too, seeing the way the shadows interacts with the environment when a meteor goes past or the fire monster walking through the map or how the shadows look when your torch interacts with objects is pretty immersive.

This is an old trick used for so many years in PC gaming. Advertise some effects you have,make sure the base game lacks in certain ways and the effects look over emphasised.

Reviewers will just compare like for like,instead of questioning whether the effects actually are any good on their own.

Problem with that is the time required to get good results from raster methods though.... Sure developer could get results probably to look somewhat close to RT implementation but then why would they spend all that time when they could do it far quicker and get better results on the whole? No matter what, with raster methods you will always get issues with light bleeding through walls, reflections looking weird if you're not facing at the correct angle and so on, this is just an inherent issue with raster methods.

Thanks for the articles and links, I will have a full read of them.
Seems that RT gives better lighting and shadows, as well as the reflections?
I know I am being flippant, but when you see most ray tracing comparisons it does highlight the reflections. Look at Port Royal, it's full of shiny surfaces.

The before/after versions of the games are interesting on that link you gave.
I'd rather have the 'before' version (no ray tracing) of the game at a reasonable price and framerate, rather than the (to me) marginally better visuals of the 'after' version of the game.
I tried Control in RT on a 3080, and the significant loss of framerate was far more noticeable to me than the slightly better visuals.

Reflections are always the easiest win/to show differences, it's the lighting and shadows, which are far more important imo, having said that, reflections can be very good too if the environment/game world is made to show it off e.g. doom eternal when you get to the all metal base or cp 2077 full of glass parts, metal surfaces too.

As for the metro ee comparisons, the metro ee i.e. the RT only version runs better than the RT + raster original version (same for amd hardware too) but that is because RT was 100% the focus and not a hybrid method like we have seen with every other game.

 

[Joxeon]

If I buy a 4080 I'm not sure I'll admit to it in any forum list, It'll be a dirty secret.

 

[Sargatanas2511]

Cyberpunk 2077 had rubbish looking Sea with RT off. But suddenly it looked better with RT on. It was obviously done on purpose to make the difference look much bigger than it should. Reminds me of the PhysX on and off comparisons,a bit like dodgy Dave at Curry's trying to sell you that £100 HDMI cable,by using that totally not fiddled with set of TVs!

Cyberpunk came out with no RT at all, I played it then and can't say I was particularly over or underwhelmed by the sea. I never spent much time staring at it though.

I just don't see the visual fidelity worth the massive FPS hits and need to use IQ lessening effects to offset it.

 

[RavenXXX2]

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Cyberpunk came out with no RT at all, I played it then and can't say I was particularly over or underwhelmed by the sea. I never spent much time staring at it though.

I just don't see the visual fidelity worth the massive FPS hits and need to use IQ lessening effects to offset it.

Because,it wasn't that well done,especially the ripple effects. But when you switched RT on,it got much better. The only problem there were older games which did the rasterised effects much better.

BTW,there are some hidden Easter Eggs in the sea. If Meredith Stout gets into trouble in your playthrough you might want to check part of the sea.

 

[Nexus18]

Wasn't just the sea









But agree, I played first time on my vega 56 and didn't particularly think to myself, "cdpr have downgraded these reflections!"

Speaking of RT reflections, one of my favourite titles was a good showcase for it, deliver us the moon:

Spoiler

 

[XeNoNF50]

Next round of GPU's will likely cost 3K so...

They'd have a very hard time selling that. Games need to get MUCH MUCH more demanding for anyone to actually care to have anything more powerful than a 4090.

The 4090 is either performing higher than 4k 120fps display limit or CPU limited to under 120fps in most games. The games where you are actually GPU limited at 4k within the parameters of 4k at 120hz is literally just a handful of games. Cyberpunk psycho with ray tracing max probably being the most demanding ATM by quite a long way and everyone's played that game already!

 

[Jay-G25]

Does someone from overclockers want to defend the fact that they have the ASUS 4090 Tuf OC at £550 above MSRP? TBF ASUS themselves are selling their own card at £380 over their own MSRP, which is kind of funny.

People are clearly buying them at that price which is why they are priced as they are , all out off stock again for the TUF at £2250 few Zotac and Palit in stock though which are a bit cheaper but by all accounts selling well still according to the stock thread. I imagine all the 4080 will sell out tomorrow aswell even though for the price better off going for a 4090 but hay ho it is what it is

 

[Rup]

Appears that Asus are now selling directly in the UK. Well above MSRP but less than usual retailers!

 

[rumple9]

They'd have a very hard time selling that. Games need to get MUCH MUCH more demanding for anyone to actually care to have anything more powerful than a 4090.

The 4090 is either performing higher than 4k 120fps display limit or CPU limited to under 120fps in most games. The games where you are actually GPU limited at 4k within the parameters of 4k at 120hz is literally just a handful of games. Cyberpunk psycho with ray tracing max probably being the most demanding ATM by quite a long way and everyone's played that game already!

Unreal 5 engine games aren't out yet. Also Direct Storage 1.1 which will put further pressure on GPU's - all within the next 12 months

 

[Boxfreshchris]

I find RT to be similar to the whole 'self build PC' scene in general. Certain people take satisfaction in setting up a PC, constantly tweaking etc, some people want to turn it on and play. RT is similar. At first it's nice to load a game like CP, look around and think "wow, this looks good", but ultimately it's the gameplay that determines if a game is good or not, the graphics are just the icing.

Anyway, nVidia seem to be following their usual pattern. Brilliant, overpriced, brilliant, overpriced, etc etc

 

[RavenXXX2]

People are clearly buying them at that price which is why they are priced as they are , all out off stock again for the TUF at £2250 few Zotac and Palit in stock though which are a bit cheaper but by all accounts selling well still according to the stock thread. I imagine all the 4080 will sell out tomorrow aswell even though for the price better off going for a 4090 but hay ho it is what it is

Other place has the tuff and loads more in stock, don't use ocuk as the barometer for GPU sales.

 

[Jay-G25]

Other place has the tuff and loads more in stock, don't use ocuk as the barometer for GPU sales.

The place that sells the FE just have a Palit card in stock and seem to have sold through there zotac stock although as you say I can find the Tuf in stock online still . I mentioned about OCUK Tuf because the guy I quoted mentioned the high price but the fact they are sold out again means people are buying them at this price from OCUK and gibbo has mentioned they are shifting 40-50 Zotacs each day

 

[RavenXXX2]

Look, the 4080 aint going to sell well at all, 4090 sales will dry up, the prices are not sustainable. And Nvidia will be fine with that until they clear the ampere back catalogue. IMO Nvidia are going to be in for a nasty shock at their next earnings call with gaming revenue.

 

[XeNoNF50]

Look, the 4080 aint going to sell well at all, 4090 sales will dry up, the prices are not sustainable. And Nvidia will be fine with that until they clear the ampere back catalogue. IMO Nvidia are going to be in for a nasty shock at their next earnings call with gaming revenue.

Ampere back catalogue is horribly priced. 3080 and below and 6800xt and below is basically launch day of 2 years ago priced and the overpriced cards of the gen (3080 12gb+ and 6950xt) are not discounted enough to be worthwhile, except that 1 6900xt OCUK selling at £650.

 

[Rup]

4080 prices are on the nvidia site. Suprim/Asus etc pretty much same as 4090 FE!!

 

[Jay-G25]

Look, the 4080 aint going to sell well at all, 4090 sales will dry up, the prices are not sustainable. And Nvidia will be fine with that until they clear the ampere back catalogue. IMO Nvidia are going to be in for a nasty shock at their next earnings call with gaming revenue.

I'm not defending it just saying it as I see it for what it's worth I think the 4080 is a terrible proposition but do I think it will sell well ... 100% weather I agree with it or not.

 

[RavenXXX2]

Ampere back catalogue is horribly priced. 3080 and below and 6800xt and below is basically launch day of 2 years ago priced and the overpriced cards of the gen (3080 12gb+ and 6950xt) are not discounted enough to be worthwhile, except that 1 6900xt OCUK selling at £650.

Well that's why ada is priced the way it is, to sit above ampere in price as to not cannibalize them. They are not shifting very many IMO.