Caporegime
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Do they need plot armor when we already know Obi-wan, Leia and Darth Vader survive?
Obi Wan Kenobi (Disney+)
- Thread starter something daft already!!
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Do they need plot armor when we already know Obi-wan, Leia and Darth Vader survive?
Personally don't think it was a good idea to have the fight between Obi and Vader - having him hunting him added some decent tension but facing off feels misplaced and like it was done for the wrong reasons (production wise).
If it wasn't for the moments of lazy writing it would be quite good IMO.
If it wasn't for the moments of lazy writing it would be quite good IMO.
I am (obviously) talking about lazy-ass writing that does not make a good attempt to have key characters make rational decisions and create believable (in the context of the setting) situations for their escape and survival. Creating believable situations involves effort and it is much harder to write and set up and direct, which is why it is increasingly rare in shows like this.
If you do not yet know the context of these kind of "convenient plot armour" discussions by now, considering how prevalent it is in so many lazy and poorly written shows in the last couple of decades, then I am surprised, because it's hardly a new discussion (though no less disappointing).
Yes it really took what should have been a dramatic and slow-burning confrontation and sucked all of the tension out of it by putting it too early in the show. It should have been a longer build up with more emotion and it just turned into an eye-rolling moment where Vader and all of his stormtroopers cannot apparently chase a slow and lumbering robot carrying a limp body over the next sand dune. Sigh.
Also just what is going on with Vaders chest lights... they are so glaringly bright with so much red and green he looks like a walking traffic light. It's just distractingly bad costume design vs the muted one of the original which I cannot understand why they did not keep.
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Soldato
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The problem some of these shows and the sequel trilogy suffer is the more backstory that already exists the more careful you have to be to get it right. Disney don't seem to have shown the care and attention needed to do this. The Mandalorian gets a free pass because it's largely exploring new areas with new characters and only brings in legacy charcters like Bo-Katan, Ashoka, Luke and Bobba Fett as waypoints in it's own plot.
The lack of single guiding mind is glaringly obvious, the director gets to decide the plot and the universe must bend to accept it. When what is needed is a storytelling master craftsman who can thread their story neatly through what already exists.
It just feels wrong to have a mini Leia running around with Ben, it feels wrong that Vader and Ben would meet before A New Hope. Obi Wan feels weak and stupid which doesn't work but weak and wise would have.
The lack of single guiding mind is glaringly obvious, the director gets to decide the plot and the universe must bend to accept it. When what is needed is a storytelling master craftsman who can thread their story neatly through what already exists.
It just feels wrong to have a mini Leia running around with Ben, it feels wrong that Vader and Ben would meet before A New Hope. Obi Wan feels weak and stupid which doesn't work but weak and wise would have.
Yes absolutely this and you explained it succinctly and concisely with regards to respecting history and lore to make things consistent and believable. The "rule of cool" is applied by many writers to shoehorn in things like "Leia with sassy adult personality" etc and they just trust (or hope) that the majority of viewers will neither care nor notice, or if they do then not in enough numbers to make a big deal about it. Also you are right that the denigration of major characters by writing them as people with very low common sense and poor judgement, especially when those characters are in reality amongst the most wise and/or powerful of all humans in the universe, is not appropriate or credible. Yes, even the best of men make mistakes, but not all the time with trivial things.
Commissario
Well I'm a die hard Star Wars fan and so far I've been quite disappointed. The Book of Boba Fett was trash, but so far this has been at dumpster truck level!
Caporegime
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Technically no, as all that is said in Star Wars is:
Then, later:
So they never implicitly state where the last meeting was, and it's implied that Vader lost the battle.
It works if that was Episode III, but it also can work for them battling after the episode III fight.
I suppose, it feels wrong though.
It just makes less sense, time scales of 8 years v 18. 'that's a name I've not heard in a long time' well 8 years as an old man isn't realisticly that long, and the same with the above. It just ruins that concept of a long time passing.
It feels cheap.
Associate
Yep, this has been going on since the new trilogy movies. Rather than have someone who has overall control of the story to tie everything together and ensure the story arcs are done well, we had directors doing their own thing and adding things because "hey, it's cool" then suddenly going oh **** how are we going to tie all the loose ends together and have a coherent story....Whoops, better just make some **** up. At least George Lucas had that going for him.
I wonder if this should not fall at the feet of the person at the top of the tree, Kathleen Kennedy, she probably needs to go. This does seem to be a reoccurring theme with Disney though, just bash out content for your new streaming service, ticking a few of the "right boxes" and see what sticks.
Let's see how the next few episodes go but I am not holding any hope that it will get better.
Permabanned
The internet kind of ruins shows these days, back in the day we didnt used to dissect Knight Rider to this degree. 
Man of Honour
I get what you're saying but this theoretical fight is now real, and Vader is in absolutely no way a learner in their encounter. They dropped the ball because they wanted to make it sooo eeeeepic.
You could argue that vader is a learner in the dark side of the force, or a learner in regards to him being a Sith. Even Palpy says there's things that the Sith teach about the force they the jedi never would.
We don't really get a time frame on this either just that it's been years since they last met, is that 10-20 years or more? And how long does it take to learn enough about the dark side to become a "master" vs the light side as said above its implied there's more to learn about the dark side so it would take longer before you're considered a master.
Man of Honour
But this is missing the point if the intent of his words in ANH. He says "when I left you I was but the learner but now I am the master", as in, you were the master of our last encounter and that this encounter will be different. This new completely mental scene completely ruins the later fight, that is unless Obi Wan somehow decides to un**** himself pronto and there's some smack down later in the series. I'm really just not interested tbh, Disney have utterly bungled this franchise.
It's almost guaranteed thats going to happen, this little skirmish between the 2 won't be a one off.
Man of Honour
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Hopefully after some training by Qui Gon. It’s hard to image how we’ll be in a position that fits with ANH within 3 episodes, unless there is some kind of time jump.
Soldato
[TeamAmerica] We're gonna to need a Montage!!! [/TeamAmerica]
I agree, I think there's a need for an "Obi-Wan is down/depressed, Qui-Gon comes to him and builds him back up, Obi-Wan then fights once more and kicks ass" type storyline but I'm not sure if we'll get that. Maybe just Qui-Gon appearing would be enough without the need for a training montage, who knows?
Commissario
Awaits a guest appearance from Master Yoda. 
Soldato
Wouldn’t shock me one bit, when they get desperate they always start chucking the most loved parts of the old films at it because that makes it all better.Awaits a guest appearance from Master Yoda.
Ok….I’ll fess up, I’d love to see Yoda but that’s not the point…hold on wait, that is the point isn’t it?
I think I had a point but I seem to have lost my way here. I’ll just sit back and enjoy the rest of the series…can I haz some millennium falcon too please?