******Official Star Citizen / Squadron 42 Thread******

mid_gen said:
It's all instanced now? I thought back when the ED vs SC midslinging was going on the big plus for SC was that it's a single coherent collection of systems with meaningful player impact on the shared world? Not like ED where everyone plays in a siloed sandbox separate from the rest of the players...?

How does that work with the plots of land they're selling? Do you own the land in all instances?
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I never heard of it not being instanced, alse I distinctly remember that players will have only the slightest impact on economy.
Meaningful impact would be dependant on hand made in-universe arcs which were dependant on the reputations of players in game, more WoW dlc style.

I would assume that anyone who came to your plot of land would enter into your instance as a result, and people in your 'friends lists'/faction/corp more likely to be in your general instances.

It's been a long time since I closely followed the Dev, but that's the situation as I last heard
 
mid_gen said:
I would be interested to hear about what design mitigations they are putting in place to balance the game experience in the context of the hundreds of millions of dollars worth of in-game assets that have been purchased to date.

This is my primary concern with the game...the elephant in the room that they are pretty much stuck with, as they can't row back on things that have already been sold.

It would be nice to hear some actual constructive feedback to these concerns. As someone that doesn't follow the game closely any more it doesn't appear as if this is being addressed.

It would be great if they can offer a 'backer' free online experience for normal day 1 purchasers to choose to start on a level playing field if they wish. Unlikely to happen though as it would be taken as a dilution of the assets that have already been purchased.
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"Backers" are going to have to pay for those ships in-game somehow, insurance will cost money in-game, fuel, crew costs etc. Just having the ship is only one part of it. Every one of those ships will also start to age and deteriorate the instant the game goes live, it's all a money drain.

There isn't going to be massive fleets flying about blowing everyone up day one, they are purposely making the game mechanics work against that sort of behaviour as with purposeful ramming etc. Heck ammo costs money too, ain't nobody got time to blow cash like that on day one.

If you geniunely think that backers have a huge advantage day one to everyone else then don't bother buying it at release. Bottom line is that those with TIME to play the game will be ahead of those who have bought stock ships within a few weeks at best in most cases and those who have bought capital ships.. well they probably won't even be able to afford to use them or have people crew them anyway without dozens of players chipping money, resources or their own time directly to run the ship. This isn't a game where one whale can "win" it, it needs team work to make any real progress even in the broken *** game we have at the moment.
 
MissChief said:
So what happens if they materially change something someone has bought and paid for after the fact? Someone ponies up £1k for some capital ship with x turbolasers, 10 all player crew and even ships that can fly out of it controlled by other pilots then when the game launches they have half as many weapons, no dockable, player controlled ships and now only seats 4 players? That's contract breaking right there. Or even worse they then decide that such a ship is vastly overpowered and nerf (sorry, balance) it. Does that then mean anyone that paid for the original gets as refund? In full or part? How much? It's a total minefield.
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You haven't bought ANYTHING if you put money into Star Citizen other than vague promises and shows of development with an opportunity of taking part in testing. You have not bought digital space ships, if you real the terms and conditions those ships are gifted to you, you don't actually pay for them though and at no point were they considered refundable - the company did issue refunds for a couple of years but there was dubious legal basis for them having to do so. That's now stopped as it was done predominately to cover themselves from very early backers (like myself and many other OCUKers) who had backed during Kickstarter etc where T&Cs would mean they could claim a refund. However after a period we had to accept new T&Cs which essentially bin those earlier ones.

Current T&C on purchases are:
You are making a crowdfunding pledge, not a purchase!
Star Citizen is funded through a community crowdfunding effort. Your “Pledge Funds” for in-game items such as ships or weapons will be spent on the ongoing development of the game.

Welcome to open development!
Star Citizen’s Alpha releases include work-in-progress and features that have bugs which will be improved in future updates [See Roadmap]. Your pledge will grant you continued access to this process. We encourage community feedback but the decisions must ultimately rest with the developer.

All pledges are final!
For these reasons, you cannot get your Pledge Funds back even if a particular in-game item takes longer to become available, contains bugs, or undergoes design changes. By placing your order, you acknowledge that you have read, understood and accepted the above and our further Terms of Service, in particular, section Pledges.

Anyway basically if they change the ships - tough. If they remove an item - tough. It hasn't stopped people backing because ultimately the quiet majority of backers want this game to be made because they haven't seen anything really push PC gaming for a while particularly in this genre. I say that as a kickstarter backer of Elite: Dangerous too btw.

TL;DR you aren't buying digital space ships you are buying a fart in the wind and a promise from someone on the other side of the world.. but it's your money, so do what you want.
 
Raumarik said:
"Backers" are going to have to pay for those ships in-game somehow, insurance will cost money in-game, fuel, crew costs etc. Just having the ship is only one part of it. Every one of those ships will also start to age and deteriorate the instant the game goes live, it's all a money drain.

There isn't going to be massive fleets flying about blowing everyone up day one, they are purposely making the game mechanics work against that sort of behaviour as with purposeful ramming etc. Heck ammo costs money too, ain't nobody got time to blow cash like that on day one.

If you geniunely think that backers have a huge advantage day one to everyone else then don't bother buying it at release. Bottom line is that those with TIME to play the game will be ahead of those who have bought stock ships within a few weeks at best in most cases and those who have bought capital ships.. well they probably won't even be able to afford to use them or have people crew them anyway without dozens of players chipping money, resources or their own time directly to run the ship. This isn't a game where one whale can "win" it, it needs team work to make any real progress even in the broken *** game we have at the moment.
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So all this stuff costs in game currency to maintain...a decent levelling mechanic. But last I heard players will be able to buy in game currency with cash so making a nonsense of that as a mitigator for whales.

It's not all their fault, game monetisation has evolved since it started...and the market has decided that cosmetic only transactions are a viable and acceptable model for funding a game, whereas the buying of in game items with real tangible gameplay impacts has become increasingly less palatable. No easy way for them to row back from it now.

I am an early ED backer, SC backer and Eve launch player. I'm still hopeful that SC can be a successful mashup of these titles. Proper ship piloting. Multi crew. Persistent, single, coherent world. Properly multiplayer. A game where you can start off in your little ship and make a name for yourself as part of a shared universe (or little slice of one).

I don't want it to end up full of mechanics to deal with the whale problem, making life as a non-cash-paying player a pain in the backside.

I just wish they'd have some kind of plan to rid themselves of the real money aspect.
 
1) You can only spent a certain amount of real life money over a period of time.
2) There will be around 90% NPC and 10% players.
3) The system will react dynamically to players actions: so players with lots of money who'll start trouble, will have the NPCs and possible other players against them and I don't see a reason why the game can't have some powerful lawful force to bring order.
4) Losing a big ship will be a big deal. Not all ships are available at all ship dealers and will take time for them to be build and delivered, with each part of that process potential affected by in game events - so possible longer delays.
5) Cost to operate and properly use good ships will most likely keep most of the players on their best behavior.
6) Like in real life, there are those who have and those who have not.
7) What's so different to have some people have more stuff from the beginning compared to when you join the game half or one year later and even in the absence of real-money-into-in-game-stuff mechanics there are already those who have an advantage over you?
 
Calin Banc said:
1) You can only spent a certain amount of real life money over a period of time.
2) There will be around 90% NPC and 10% players.
3) The system will react dynamically to players actions: so players with lots of money who'll start trouble, will have the NPCs and possible other players against them and I don't see a reason why the game can't have some powerful lawful force to bring order.
4) Losing a big ship will be a big deal. Not all ships are available at all ship dealers and will take time for them to be build and delivered, with each part of that process potential affected by in game events - so possible longer delays.
5) Cost to operate and properly use good ships will most likely keep most of the players on their best behavior.
6) Like in real life, there are those who have and those who have not.
7) What's so different to have some people have more stuff from the beginning compared to when you join the game half or one year later and even in the absence of real-money-into-in-game-stuff mechanics there are already those who have an advantage over you?
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umm You may be right
 
jonneymendoza said:
sort of ? maybe but if you are against the way they get money from people, then how can u support the game overal?
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'A fool and his money are easily parted'
If people want to by shiney mystery boxes, that's their choice.

I Kickstarted a game, like literally everything I've kickstartered it's late haha
I'm cool with waiting, I have little time for games these days and it'll just be something I dip into with friends to **** about with them and chat
 
GiraffePencils said:
That's a bit 'us vs them' isn't it :p

You can still be for SC and against money grabbing tactics
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This is me, I'm all for SC, love the original concept and still do and it's one of only 2 games I've ever backed. I'll be playing the final released version for sure.
However since I dropped my cash the scope creep and business practices have left a sour taste in my mouth, the sheer amount being asked for in ship prices and the fact that some functions have been locked behind ship purchases to essentially beta test their shell of a demo I find distasteful.

I'm pretty much avoiding playing currently because there basically isn't anything to do and I dont want to be utterly sick of the game before it releases, I install now and again for an hour or 2 here and there and probably will with 3.3 but my fear is that by the time this releases most of the community will have moved on.

Some of the scope creep stuff also leaves me wondering whether or not the final product is something I will enjoy, stuff like filing an insurance claim for a lost ship....thats real life stuff and its boring. I play games get away from reality not have it copied into a different environment.
 
jonneymendoza said:
are u for or against this game?
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very much for it but I don't agree with some of the tactics used by CIG over the years. this includes claiming lifetime insurance isn't a big deal then when the grey market is going mad over it suddenly LTI becomes a marketing ploy officially... it's more complicated than that but basically I think the marketing had been pretty sketchy at times. All of my org know how I feel about that side but I'm a fan of the game and Chris and Erin Roberts
 
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