Honestly who gives a damn other than nosy self righteous idiots? So what if someone wants to get a prostitute for a night.. Its not abuse, its legal in many countries and the women are often paid very well..
Oxfam sex debacle
- Thread starter Usher
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Honestly who gives a damn other than nosy self righteous idiots? So what if someone wants to get a prostitute for a night.. Its not abuse, its legal in many countries and the women are often paid very well..
It just gets worse.
Oxfam's disgraced Haiti official left earlier post over 'sex parties'
https://www.theguardian.com/global-...official-liberia-post-roland-van-hauwermeiren
Oxfam's disgraced Haiti official left earlier post over 'sex parties'
https://www.theguardian.com/global-...official-liberia-post-roland-van-hauwermeiren
I don't have a problem at all with Oxfam, or any other worker, using prostitutes. But it has to be legal in the country, on their own time, with their own money, they have to be two consenting adults, and it has to be without any coercian (such as aid for sex). I've heard there are allegations of underage sex but I don't think I've seen any evidence of that yet (no doubt it has happened though, just as it happens in many walks of life). But I believe prostitution in Haiti is illegal(?) and if that's the case then the workers should have been disciplined, suspended, brought home, sacked, etc.
But if on their own time, with their own money, with a consenting adult in a country where it is legal, then I really don't see what the problem is.
Like many such PR disasters this seems to be a case of the alleged cover up after the event being the real 'gotcha'.
But if on their own time, with their own money, with a consenting adult in a country where it is legal, then I really don't see what the problem is.
Like many such PR disasters this seems to be a case of the alleged cover up after the event being the real 'gotcha'.
Soldato
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If it were the UK or any other western country that POV may wash with some but we are talking about a country that was already poor and had been devastated by a natural disaster which left countless people ruined and desperate. An aid worker is there is help and support these people to get their life's back in some sort of order by paying a local women for sex IMO that is taking advantage of someones situation for your own wants and given you have come to that country under the banner of something that meant to represent someone that's noble and good it leaves a bitter taste in the month.
Permabanned
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Prostitution is most definitely illegal in Haiti, as is sex between people of less than 18 years of age, so their alleged acts probably span at least two serious offences. Elderly people often leave their life savings to such as Oxfam, I am sure most don't expect their staff to be having illegal acts with prostitutes whilst the charity is funding their supposed work... It stinks, and needs addressing at the highest level both in Haiti and wherever these supposed workers hail from. Which so far appears to be NOT the UK.
Soldato
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Well it seems we've had the 'me too' campaign, Grid Girls and Darts Walk on Girls removed, another week and now it's charities in the spotlight. Wonder what/who will be the next target?
Can someone tell me why sex is always propogandised by the media as evil/horrendous? From what I was taught in school, sex is part of life just like pooping and breathing. Nowadays we seem to be teaching everyone that it's extremely dangerous, and now they are attacking consensual sex is the most painful and dangerous thing which could possibly happen to a human being.
Have any of these Haitian women even complained? Or now is the media just allowed to think for everyone?
Have any of these Haitian women even complained? Or now is the media just allowed to think for everyone?
Associate
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It's exploitation plain and simple. The rich preying upon the poor. To suggest that these Haitian women are doing this of their own free will is ludicrous. They have no other options, they're starving and live in one of the most deprived countries on earth.
Charity workers exploiting the poor. Way to go!
Charity workers exploiting the poor. Way to go!
But women prostitute themselves all the time, even more so in rich countries, because more men can afford more prostitutes!
Are you saying that just because Haitian women are poorer than London women, that they are not allowed to capitalise from sex?
What about a city of London worker getting some extra from a prostitute (male or female), what's that? Despite the fantasies of some people, I don't think many go into sex work because it's their "thing" (exceptions exist of course).
It's called the oldest profession, rightly or wrongly, because men quite like sex.
If the guy put the hooker on expenses then yes, you have a scandal. Otherwise it's just a man doing what men have done since the beginning of currency.
Is it right? No. Is anyone actually shocked? I genuinely hope not!
Well if you've got an infinite money supply then go ahead.. but without that then there is a choice re: who you give your money to - the other poster brought up people in this country with respect to Oxfam: "Spend the money here on the needy in this country." was the quote when frankly some of the people they help are in far greater need of assistance than pretty much anyone who is classed as 'poor' here, including those in absolute poverty.
If you want to do something useful/efficient with your donations in terms of making the world a better place the finite amount of money you have available to donate on some poor people here, given all the basics they have available already, is a hugely inefficient way of donating your money. Buying some Mosquito nets for people in Africa has a massively disproportionate benefit.
Well if/when that happens then fine but at the moment it is absolute nonsense... there are people in the world today who don't even have access to running world, people for whom a mosquito net can be a simple and cost effective tool to prevent the spread of a deadly disease. You've pointed out, for a second time, that some middle class people exist in India - so ****ing what?
If everyone in the world had the same standard of living of the poor here free education, clean water, free access to healthcare at the point of use, social security, accommodation and even if/when they **** everything up in spite of that emergency accommodation, food banks, emergency loans, soup kitchens etc..etc.. then that would be great, yay globalisation! I'd not see the need to donate to any of them. But that isn't the case at the moment, you can tell me again that some middle class people exist in India, it doesn't change the fact that there are people without even access to clean water in the world and they need help far more than any dole scrounger over here.
Also no I'm not a BTL landlord, I'm not sure where that came from or what relevance it has - perhaps try to stick to the arguments... instead of throwing in irrelevant stuff like asking whether I'm a landlord, or telling me again about those Indian middle class people.
I know someone who told me they used to work in a swiss brothel.
they said its mostly eastern europeans who do it because it obviously pays much better in switzerland.
but some swiss people still do it even though their education system is much better than ours, and pretty much everyone has a job or apprenticeship(if they leave education early) lined up for them when they leave education.
seems swiss brothels are called "kontakt bars" the city where my partner has an apartment has at least a dozen of them and it's not even a big city
basically a night club type place with women who you can pay for their services.
some even have whirlpools, saunas etc apparently
not everyone who becomes a prostitute does it because it's the only choice available to them to earn money.
they work 2-3 days a week, take 2 weeks off.
seems an easy living
although I read an article in the local paper about people nipping across the border to germany because its cheaper
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There are large amounts of wealth in India and in Africa, which their respective governments could use to help their own poor. They have other priorities, however. From space programmes to fleets of Bentleys.
You prefer not to consider the poor in this country (whom you have decided deserve everything they get...) Feel free to give your money to whomever, but ask yourself why you should subsidise the Indian/African elite by solving their poverty problems for them? Whilst they hoard their countries wealth like the elite in this country horde our country's wealth...
Also about those Malaria nets... there is evidence that many of these are not being used for their intended purposes, and are actually causing health issues...
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...s-for-fishing-endangering-humans-and-wildlife
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...harities_stand_up_to_rational_evaluation.html
Why does it matter where the most needy people on the planet are? I really don't see why you're taking this nationalist approach to charity giving... there are plenty of people who don't give money... fact is there are people without even clean drinking water and you've decided to tell me, for the third time now, that some people in India have money. Only Indians should give money to poor Indians now? Only Africans should help africans?
I'm not sure why you're sharing that second link? I'm talking about effective altruism here!
If you bothered to look a bit deeper, such as checking out that give well organisation mentioned in the second link (an organisation I've linked to a few times on these forums) rather than cherry pick a guardian article about some fish then you'd find this:
https://www.givewell.org/charities/top-charities
an organisation that is dedicated to critically evaluating how to efficiently spend money on charities
Soldato
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Our government think that international aid money being spent in African branches of Rolls Royce is all good, but some guy pumping a hooker is too much? 
The media really need to stop thinking on my behalf, because I seriously couldn't care less what grown adults want to do with their penis.
The media really need to stop thinking on my behalf, because I seriously couldn't care less what grown adults want to do with their penis.
Associate
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Yes. The difference is that Western women have many more opportunities with their lives. In Haiti it is a choice of prostitution or starvation. In the west it's usually a high class escort or a drug addict fuelling their addiction. Either way these women had choices available to them that the Haitians did not.
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Apples and oranges here. A London Escort, or even a drugged up skank, IS NOT comparable to a Haitian woman. One of them has made significant lifestyle choices to end up in "the oldest profession". The other is trying to avoid starvation. By using a prostitute in Haiti these aid workers, who should know better,are perpetuating the problem.
The fact that you and MANY others on this forum cannot see this is alarming. To think that some members (not aimed at you) have even gone out and called me "racist" whilst defending the actions of these Oxfam workers is downright laughable.