Pentagon releases UFO footage

[Lysander]

I think you give the worlds governments too much credit. They can't even co-ordinate during a global pandemic.

Group ideocy is something else.

Well, to be human is to be part of group idiocy. I'm sure, if these things are ET, they know just what kind of a species we are - hostile. That's why they're very good at keeping out of things and just monitoring us. They probably don't even need defenses with maneouverability and tracking systems like they have.

The thing is that we are in a vital part of our history. We walked on another planet the Moon fifty years ago, we aim to have a hotel space station constructed in the next ten years [Voyager], we keep sending probes and radio signals out into the rest of the galaxy and we're probably about 100 years away or less from starting a colony on Mars. We are basically close to infecting the rest of the Solar System like some kind of disease. If I were part of an alien species, and I knew what kind of people we were, I would keep an eye on us at this point too.

If they were actually hostile, we would almost certainly not even know they were until it was too late considering what these uaps are seen to be capable of.

To be honest, their lack of hostility is one of the best arguments I've seen for their not being human.

 

[MookJong]

The Pentagon report will be a "logical disclosure" in my opinion. We know it will say the majority of the 120 unexplained UAPTF cases could not be put down to US black technology. But more importantly I think it will also state it's highly unlikely to be a foreign nations technology either.

They will overtly imply the objects are not man made, but without point blank saying it.

This will allow the scientific community to be brought in to study again without the ridiclue and stigma previously preventing them working on this in the open.

 

[mrk]

We walked on another planet fifty years ago

Moon! Not planet!

Mars will be the only planet humans will have walked on and that kicks into gear as of next year I believe from what Musk has said. The dwarf planet Ceres orbits between Jupiter and Mars so maybe one day we will land on that too.

 

[Lysander]

The Pentagon report will be a "logical disclosure" in my opinion. We know it will say the majority of the 120 unexplained UAPTF cases could not be put down to US black technology. But more importantly I think it will also state it's highly unlikely to be a foreign nations technology either.

They will overtly imply the objects are not man made, but without point blank saying it.

This will allow the scientific community to be brought in to study again without the ridiclue and stigma previously preventing them working on this in the open.

I think you're probably on the money. Or close to it. I think the problem is that the older guard - a lot of Baby Boomers - probably can't handle the idea of alien technology and will reject it out the gate. Too much of a product of early sci-fi books and films, media cynicism, it will be very hard for them to accept it and take it seriously.

Gen X is like an air lock generation - a lot of people from Gen X probably can handle the idea but not without some degree of discomfort. I think from then on, for Gen Y+, definitely Gen Z+, it's an exciting time ahead. I think this report will be like complex carbs, a slow release, whereby they say, "yes there is some serious tech out there, but we don't know what it is". This will pave the way for a load of articles, speculation and thinking whereby the world gets slowly into the idea that "derp, OK, maybe aliens can exist" and media outlets actually start to put up serious articles about aliens rather than ones peppered with childish images of greys and flying saucers [I'm looking at you, BBC]. But, as @Maximum Triceratops says, the way this very thread has gone shows that the thinking about such things has moved on a lot in the last decade.

Then, in about 20-30 years or so, we'll get the actual reveal.

Moon! Not planet!

Sorry, I lazily called the Moon a planet. I only just read that a moon is not a planet. Thanks for that.

 

[keyser]

The Pentagon report will be a "logical disclosure" in my opinion. We know it will say the majority of the 120 unexplained UAPTF cases could not be put down to US black technology. But more importantly I think it will also state it's highly unlikely to be a foreign nations technology either.

They will overtly imply the objects are not man made, but without point blank saying it.

This will allow the scientific community to be brought in to study again without the ridiclue and stigma previously preventing them working on this in the open.

Sure, except regardless of what the Pentagon say they could just be lying and building and test flying these things in top secret and simply don't want China/Russia to know anything about them. The pilots filming these things aren't in the loop due it the tech being so secret, so the Pentagon just have to play dumb and release the footage while saying "we dont know what these are" when in fact they totally do, coz they built em

OR it's the Prime Directive

 

[Lysander]

Sure, except regardless of what the Pentagon say they could just be lying and building and test flying these things in top secret and simply don't want China/Russia to know anything about them. The pilots filming these things aren't in the loop due it the tech being so secret, so the Pentagon just have to play dumb and release the footage while saying "we dont know what these are" when in fact they totally do, coz they built em

This kind of thinking is called 'denial'. You are trying to come up with any reason to say these things are man-made, when it is looking more likely that they are not.

 

[keyser]

This kind of thinking is called 'denial'. You are trying to come up with any reason to say these things are man-made, when it is looking more likely that they are not.

Well yeah, the flip side seems to be your way of thinking called 'blind acceptance'. You are trying to come up with any reason to say these things are alien-made, when it is looking more likely that they are not. Neither side has enough data so it becomes a matter of opinion.

 

[MookJong]

Sure, except regardless of what the Pentagon say they could just be lying and building and test flying these things in top secret and simply don't want China/Russia to know anything about them. The pilots filming these things aren't in the loop due it the tech being so secret, so the Pentagon just have to play dumb and release the footage while saying "we dont know what these are" when in fact they totally do, coz they built em

OR it's the Prime Directive

The problem with this is that the report is to congress, to state they are not US technology when they are is to lie to congress and would be a criminal offence.

To purposely do this would also imply a conspiracy at the highest levels of the Pentagon. Don't forget Obama was already briefed that these were not US technology. So a criminal offence would have already been commited.

Instead all they had to do was debrief the pilots who saw these things and get them to sign an NDA. Then they wouldn't have ended up having to setup UAP taskforces or have pilots making 60 Minutes appearances. These craft would have actually just stayed secret and this OcUK thread wouldn't even exist.

If you need to peddle a conspiracy theory to debunk the UAP report you have to wonder if you are on the right side of the fence.

 

[Lysander]

You are trying to come up with any reason to say these things are alien-made

No, and that's the second time you've tried to misrepresent me in this thread. I've already said, and shown, that I am open to multiple possibilities.

when it is looking more likely that they are not.

Why, pray tell? Even the Pentagon has not ruled out the possibility that they might be alien. Do you know better than they do?

Neither side has enough data so it becomes a matter of opinion.

No, it becomes a matter of intellect.

 

[gpuerrilla]

Well yeah, the flip side seems to be your way of thinking called 'blind acceptance'. You are trying to come up with any reason to say these things are alien-made, when it is looking more likely that they are not. Neither side has enough data so it becomes a matter of opinion.

Agree. Seems if you take on a devils advocate approach either side are there to gun you down when your just asking sensible questions.

The reposts are very woolly like they are super intelligent and can time travel or cover galaxies in small time frames - yet cant block basic human technology or use cloaking devices to stay hidden... just asking the obvious but then people turn all salty.

 

[Maximum Triceratops]

It also makes you wonder why they spent a trillion dollars on the F35 if they have technology like this?

 

[gpuerrilla]

There will be more questions than answers. I am open to it all and is good light reading when your off task.

 

[Lysander]

There will be more questions than answers. I am open to it all and is good light reading when your off task.

Well, that's all good. I think that's the best attitude at this point.

 

[mrk]

yet cant block basic human technology or use cloaking devices to stay hidden.

But they can that's the thing! Granted in the Fravor/Nimitz incident the tictac simply just radar jams but in other incidents those other features are exhibited. So whatever these things seem to do is calculated in some way or there's a reason behind it which we don't understand yet. It's equally logical to say that the physics in our universe apply some limitations on what they can do whilst here as well, we simply don't know. Just casting these things off as inept just because they didn't cloak or hide themselves better in a handful of recorded incidents seems a bit unfair and open to the same scrutitny you are giving to those apparently salty at what you are saying surely

 

[Felon]

I think the problem with "being open to it all" is that when it comes to things such as flying saucers, both the burden of proof and the implication of it being real are highly profound. If you're not careful to apply a healthy dose of skepticism and cast doubt, you can end up ignoring, or throwing perfectly benign, correct or more reasonable explanations out of the window, in favour of silliness.

Take the example of the gofast video. When the pentagon released it, everybody was up in arms "proof of secret alien and/or government technology" or whatever. Yet nobody really took the time to look at the video properly, all the data to pretty much identify it is right there. Or pretty much rule out anything extraordinary or otherworldly.

The moment you do, and you actually look at the data from the aircraft targeting pod (speeds, altitudes, velocities, distances, angles) it's clear that it's just a damn bird, it really is - yet the moment you suggest this is actually the best explanation (because it clearly is) you're labelled as nuts, however when saying it's secret alien / government tech, is apparently a sound and rational conclusion.

 

[mrk]

The gofast video is one good example yep. The incident the world seems to be focusing on though is the David Fravor one whereby US navy multiple fighter pilots engaged with the UAP and Fravor himself tailed it and his colleague in a jet behind him both had eyes on it so this one in particular goes way beyond just a tracking cam video and the same UAP is detected not by multiple navy war ships as well as crew seeing them for weeks before this incident. There simply is no reasonable explanation for that thing going from 80,000 feet to sea level in a split second unless we consider that Fravor and all his pilot colleagues, warship crews and systems were all a fabrication which is simply impossible at this stage!

So what we have left really are two impossible scenarios. It is either true or it isn't. As Arthur C Clarke put it, we are either alone or we are not, and both are equally terrifying.

 

[Felon]

There simply is no reasonable explanation for that thing going from 80,000 feet to sea level in a split second unless we consider that Fravor and all his pilot colleagues, warship crews and systems were all a fabrication which is simply impossible at this stage!

Yeah that would be the case if there was any actual evidence of it, but unfortunately there isn't - David Fravor and Alex Dietrich's words, nothing else. AFAIK - nobody has come forward and provided anything else over this apparent tictac encounter.

A far more likely and reasonable explanation, is that they're making it up for publicity, attention and cash (people do this every day, all over the world). Unless someone comes forward with any video or other more conclusive evidence of this tactac thing doing anything close to what was claimed, then I'm passing it off as lies.

 

[Lysander]

I think the problem with "being open to it all" is that when it comes to things such as flying saucers, both the burden of proof and the implication of it being real are highly profound. If you're not careful to apply a healthy dose of skepticism and cast doubt, you can end up ignoring, or throwing perfectly benign, correct or more reasonable explanations out of the window, in favour of silliness.

I think part of the problem [I'll say "part of" again in case I get misunderstood] is terminology. Saying "flying saucers" and "UFOs" will just get one labelled in with the nutcase crowd [many of whom probably aren't even nutcases]. I think that that's one of [again, one of] the reasons that this new term - UAP - has come about. Changing words can change perceptions, and calling them something different can make people take them more seriously.

Also I think there's a difference between what is more likely and what is more humanly acceptable.

Yeah that would be the case if there was any actual evidence of it, but unfortunately there isn't - David Fravor and Alex Dietrich's words, nothing else. AFAIK - nobody has come forward and provided anything else over this apparent tictac encounter.

Chad Underwood and Sean Cahill are a couple of others. There's an interview with Underwood about it here:

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/201...o-q-and-a-with-navy-pilot-chad-underwood.html

This part addresses the bird issue:

I want to ask you some questions based on theories that America’s armchair skeptics have put forward — like whether it was birds, or whether it was some sort of thermal weather event. I mean, I’m sure you have had enough flight time that you’ve seen birds.

Yup. Birds normally fly close to the surface of the ground. So, for example, you’re not going to see birds flying at 5,000 feet. You’re going to see them more down at like 2,000 feet and below, like down to the surface. That’s just kind of how birds normally operate. And they’re typically not alone. So you can you can physically see them, in a flock or whatever. You don’t see birds at 5,000 or 10,000 or 20,000 feet. That’s just not how birds operate. So birds are out of the question.

And just so that I anticipate your next question: There are weather balloons that people launch, but this was not a weather balloon — because a balloon, it just ascends and floats from low to high altitude; it doesn’t behave erratically. I mean, it’s just a damn balloon. So that was out of the question.

It wasn’t — to the best of my knowledge — a cruise missile or any other kind of test aircraft that we possibly may have not known about, just because of the way it was behaving. Like I said, it was just very erratic. It would go from like 50 feet off the ground, which when you’re out in the open ocean, you know, off the coast of San Diego, it looked like it was just hovering over the water. But there was no method of propulsion that was keeping it airborne: no wings, no heat, keeping it airborne or aloft.

 

[gpuerrilla]

But they can that's the thing! Granted in the Fravor/Nimitz incident the tictac simply just radar jams but in other incidents those other features are exhibited. So whatever these things seem to do is calculated in some way or there's a reason behind it which we don't understand yet. It's equally logical to say that the physics in our universe apply some limitations on what they can do whilst here as well, we simply don't know. Just casting these things off as inept just because they didn't cloak or hide themselves better in a handful of recorded incidents seems a bit unfair and open to the same scrutitny you are giving to those apparently salty at what you are saying surely

Your posts are good, there are a few pompous others that sling remarks just trying to sound off like they are intelligent when all this does is get nowhere.

I am actually posing an open question as its something that needs to be explained rather than these points as @keyser said perfectly - your (not you in particular) dismissing simple stuff in either ignorance as you want to believe without answering the question! You even conceded that in the incidents quoted 'granted' which is what a few pages I have been debating, I am not talking about things I have not seen. I think you know who the salty ones were.

 

[keyser]

The problem with this is that the report is to congress, to state they are not US technology when they are is to lie to congress and would be a criminal offence.

To purposely do this would also imply a conspiracy at the highest levels of the Pentagon. Don't forget Obama was already briefed that these were not US technology. So a criminal offence would have already been commited.

Instead all they had to do was debrief the pilots who saw these things and get them to sign an NDA. Then they wouldn't have ended up having to setup UAP taskforces or have pilots making 60 Minutes appearances. These craft would have actually just stayed secret and this OcUK thread wouldn't even exist.

If you need to peddle a conspiracy theory to debunk the UAP report you have to wonder if you are on the right side of the fence.

It's not a conspiracy to say The Pentagon's job to over see National Security interests, which includes keeping things secret from the likes of Russia and China. That of course means keeping information out of the public domain.

The Pentagon is the headquarters building of the United States Department of Defense. As a symbol of the U.S. military, the phrase The Pentagon is also often used as a metonym or synecdoche for the Department of Defense and its leadership.

The report isn't total transparency of everything it knows, its the least amount of information it has to put in the report.

The https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_X-37 is an example of a project that they would prefer to keep as secret as possible. Do you think that is the only secret piece of tech the US Military might be working on?