Please turn off the TV
- Thread starter LabR@t
- Start date
You've seen the ones on council schemes, right? Most of them, not all show their disdain for their children very openly and teenagers.
Whilst I disagree about needing more children (rapid depopulation won't be good, and blaming population rather than lifestyle factors plays into the Bad Excuses for inaction on climate), I do agree on the dog-whistle. And there's been plenty of it in the thread.
Caporegime
- Joined
- 22 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 28,291
- Location
- Boston, Lincolnshire
Dementia is at the extreme edge of old age health. I think your misunderstanding extreme with uncommon which I did not say in my previous posts. Never the less there are 13,660,832 people over 60 and of those 676,000 have Dementia. That is 4.9% of that cohort so it is still uncommon in old people. No where am I disregarding the pain and hardship it causes but the vast majority of old people do not suffer with this and my previous sweeping statements were aimed at the vast majority.
I don't think you even bothered to read my replies either because I understand the need for care with Dementia sufferers but I was more aiming at people who stick their parents in homes when there is really nothing wrong with them bar taking up a little of their time in day to day things that is a struggle for them.
Last edited:
If our dumb selfless selfish politicians never ran our country's services down to the bone to save money for themselves, this would never have been a topic for so many people across the country.
Invest in the country and its services and you've sorted out most of the country's issues. You then wouldn't have a population issue.
Permabanned
- Joined
- 28 Nov 2003
- Posts
- 10,695
- Location
- Shropshire
If we working class people forgo a lifestyle beyond the means of a sole breadwinner, and had wives who were housewives and not full time workers, then a more equitable situation would arise, like it was in the fifties and early sixties. The housewife would look after elderly parents, and house bound children. The elderly parents wouldn't have to sell their homes and worldly goods to pay for their "care" in some dump, and their children would inherit a home and material possessions. There would be no need of expensive and potentially detrimental child minders.
As it is now they invent reasons why it's "impossible" to look after their ageing parents, or their children, to live a life that in reality is above their means as a conventional, cohesive family unit, then moan about earlier generations having it easy whilst they watch their inheritance go to some out of the UK based "care home" company, and the parents to children housing chain is broken.
My wife gave me the ultimatum that if my late mother were to come here for her final years she'd be gone. She came home one day to find her in the spare room and the keys on the table. Like all those in the USA who said they'd be gone if Trump were to be elected, my wife and the keys remained...
In reality they ended up rubbing along fine, and I can go to my grave knowing I gave back a little of the huge amount of love my late mother gave.
When her GP visited my late mother here he said quietly to me that she might be showing early signs of dementia. Still having the ears of a bat she rose up, went up to him, and said "There's nothing wrong with my faculties, it's not me stood here with soup stains down their tie, filthy shoes and garlic derived halitosis. You can't even write a correct prescription out, the last one had a potentially harmful, incorrect dosage on it. Dementia indeed, tidy yourself up".
As it is now they invent reasons why it's "impossible" to look after their ageing parents, or their children, to live a life that in reality is above their means as a conventional, cohesive family unit, then moan about earlier generations having it easy whilst they watch their inheritance go to some out of the UK based "care home" company, and the parents to children housing chain is broken.
My wife gave me the ultimatum that if my late mother were to come here for her final years she'd be gone. She came home one day to find her in the spare room and the keys on the table. Like all those in the USA who said they'd be gone if Trump were to be elected, my wife and the keys remained...
In reality they ended up rubbing along fine, and I can go to my grave knowing I gave back a little of the huge amount of love my late mother gave.
When her GP visited my late mother here he said quietly to me that she might be showing early signs of dementia. Still having the ears of a bat she rose up, went up to him, and said "There's nothing wrong with my faculties, it's not me stood here with soup stains down their tie, filthy shoes and garlic derived halitosis. You can't even write a correct prescription out, the last one had a potentially harmful, incorrect dosage on it. Dementia indeed, tidy yourself up".
Last edited:
Even if the marbles are there, the level of care can be large. My brother in law's father is hitting the point he needs a lot of help (several falls, already in a bungalow), there is no way my brother in law can provide that help without giving up work, and there is no room for his dad to move into his house even if it was suitable for someone who now needs everything on one floor.
People forget our housing stock by and large is very unfriendly and I'll suited for the elderly and/disabled, as we build for maximum profit so usually little room to move around (try moving a wheelchair in Almost any UK hallway), and often tiny bathrooms.
People forget our housing stock by and large is very unfriendly and I'll suited for the elderly and/disabled, as we build for maximum profit so usually little room to move around (try moving a wheelchair in Almost any UK hallway), and often tiny bathrooms.
I can't even start to tell you how stupid your first paragraph is, as I'm on my phone, but those spectacles you are wearing must be close to heat vision they're that tinted.If we working class people forgo a lifestyle beyond the means of a sole breadwinner, and had wives who were housewives and not full time workers, then a more equitable situation would arise, like it was in the fifties and early sixties. The housewife would look after elderly parents, and house bound children. The elderly parents wouldn't have to sell their homes and worldly goods to pay for their "care" in some dump, and their children would inherit a home and material possessions. There would be no need of expensive and potentially detrimental child minders.
As it is now they invent reasons why it's "impossible" to look after their ageing parents, or their children, to live a life that in reality is above their means as a conventional, cohesive family unit, then moan about earlier generations having it easy whilst they watch their inheritance go to some out of the UK based "care home" company, and the parents to children housing chain is broken.
My wife gave me the ultimatum that if my late mother were to come here for her final years she'd be gone. She came home one day to find her in the spare room and the keys on the table. Like all those in the USA who said they'd be gone if Trump were to be elected, my wife and the keys remained...
In reality they ended up rubbing along fine, and I can go to my grave knowing I gave back a little of the huge amount of love my late mother gave.
When her GP visited my late mother here he said quietly to me that she might be showing early signs of dementia. Still having the ears of a bat she rose up, went up to him, and said "There's nothing wrong with my faculties, it's not me stood here with soup stains down their tie, filthy shoes and garlic derived halitosis. You can't even write a correct prescription out, the last one had a potentially harmful, incorrect dosage on it. Dementia indeed, tidy yourself up".
And Christ I'm surprised she didn't leave you after that stunt
Last edited:
Yes that is definitely something that has a lot of relevance with the current situation also. A large swath of people simply cannot afford to give up their job in order to care for an elderly relative.
It's long gone since the days Chris describes above, where there was a single "wage earner" in a household and the other partner was essentially "Childcare + Elderly Care + Housework" which enabled such families to look after their parents into old age.
The issue of our housing being unsuitable is certainly another problem also and came to light with my father a few times when he had paramedics out, or had to go into hospital.
Even though it's a bungalow and the hallway's are actually pretty wide, there is still a porch that is a tight little 90degree turn and a large step outside that which made it difficult to get him out of the property in a carry-chair.
Last edited:
Almost makes you think "Why would their kids want to look after them in their old age, when they were treated with such disdain and disregard by their parents during their childhood?
Many parents these days seem to have a mentality of "ok you're 16 / 18, now **** off and go get your own place" but then expect their kids to play the dutiful carer once they themselves are in old age.
This is something that has definitely and drastically changed since the days of the 50s/60s that Chris described above, where often the children were still living at home into their 20's (sometimes 30's) before getting married and moving into their own home.
In the past couple of years I’ve been reconsidering my choice regarding kids/no kids. I think at 39 it’s probably a bit late and my wife is still adamant she doesn’t want kids.
Young adults living with parents has been increasing as a % for at least the past 25 years, per the ONS.
My suspicion is that, with people marrying and starting families much younger, the 1960s would have seen a lot fewer still.
Certainly, data from the US bears that out
For First Time in Modern Era, Living With Parents Edges Out Other Living Arrangements for 18- to 34-Year-Olds
For the first time since 1880, Americans ages 18 to 34 are more likely to be living with their parent(s) than in a household shared with a spouse or partner.
www.pewresearch.org
Young adults living with parents has been increasing as a % for at least the past 25 years, per the ONS.
My suspicion is that, with people marrying and starting families much younger, the 1960s would have seen a lot fewer still.
Certainly, data from the US bears that out
But I can't readily find equivalent UK data.For First Time in Modern Era, Living With Parents Edges Out Other Living Arrangements for 18- to 34-Year-Olds
For the first time since 1880, Americans ages 18 to 34 are more likely to be living with their parent(s) than in a household shared with a spouse or partner.
It's definitely on the rise again, however I would argue that the reasons are very different.
Most people these days are finding themselves having to remain at home longer because they simply cannot afford to move out and live alone.
Another issue is that while in the 50's/60's it was possible to afford a mortgage for your new house with your new wife on a single salary and as such the wife was able to remain at home and act as home keeper, childcare etc.. That is simply not the case for the majority of people these days.
If they want to afford a house, they have to have both partners working, which then incurs all the issues with childcare and so forth.
That is something that has fundamentally changed between the 50's/60's and now.
The House price -to- salary ratio is massively increased and makes it impossible for most people to find themselves in a similar situation as the 50's/60's.
My Aunt struggled with that for a long time with Cancer. She never lost her mind, far from it but with the decades of Cancer getting treated and coming back, it lead to her leg being amputated early last decade. It was something she suffered since a teenager. Wasn't until her 50's or 60's she was bound to crutches. She was then bound to a wheelchair mostly after the amputation and a chair lift had to be installed to get upstairs in the house. The stairs were so small that even the wheel chair couldn't be lifted up by someone that is fit. So you know the type of stairs where you're only say 3/4 of your foot is on the stairs. The chair lift itself almost took up the area getting up and down the stairs trying to walk past it. Same for the bathroom being so small.
Sadly the Cancer claimed her earlier in the year.
Sometimes it's frightening seeing wheelchairs once they're inside the house, or the motorised ones. That's when you realise the lack of space for manoeuvring. Outside, people don't seem to appreciate the difficulties the same. Since there is so much space and no obstacles.
Carpets are another. It pushes the carpet causing difficulties moving. It got to the point for her it was laminated flooring that was installed. The majority of the house was redone for wheelchair ease of use. Even the joins from room to room getting rid of the lips that used to be there from carpet to carpet.
I couldn't respond to that post. Just wow.
Soldato
- Joined
- 18 Jul 2021
- Posts
- 4,590
- Location
- Land of Gin (I wish)
You never hear of a work shy couple who struggle to conceive.
Fertility and stupidity.
There’s a woman, guessing 29-31, where I live. She had two children taken away from her due to neglect and inability to control them. She’s now pregnant. Why on earth wasn’t she sterilised? The cost of sterilising her is far cheaper than the costs of legal action and the child taken into care.
The two children had different fathers. Both left her as she’s a control freak. The unborn baby’s father has left her too.
Sterilisation is required for anyone charged with child neglect or murder. There’s no human rights about it. They messed up a child. So stop the opportunity for having more
Interesting way to read it. Of course that isn't what I'm saying, I just personally don't want to get in to a debate about it. You guys can discuss all you want
I appreciate what you mean.
The issue with discussing this topic is that the population's opinion is still heavily weighted to having kids with arguments of
"It's the normal natural thing to want"
"If you don't want kids then what's the point of you being here"
"Humans naturally want to continue the species"
and all other manner of emotively charged language which, even if unintentional, can make the childless person feel like a failure or may make some of society think there is something wrong/weird/creepy with them for not wanting/having kids.
That form of arguing is using emotions as a crutch to support an otherwise weak POV and is quite sad really.
It results in a poor environment for constructive conversation as one or more parties get defensive.
The truth is some people don't want kids, some people have kids that really shouldn't and some people want kids but can't either through infertility or being unfortunate enough to not be in a relationship.
People's choices shouldn't be judged especially if you have no idea on the circumstances.
Last edited:
The biology for women hasn't changed much even with medicine.
That upper limit to the clock is still there.
But the reasonable time to start a family (financial stability, many would say own your own home) has gone up massively.
Now you're left with well under a decade of time to have kids.
Also. You have huge debt in that time. You may want to have a life, work on career etc etc.
The time grows shorter.
There isn't time to have more than 2 kids and be financially stable for an ever increasing number of couples.
Everything in life is now later. But biology is still the same.
That upper limit to the clock is still there.
But the reasonable time to start a family (financial stability, many would say own your own home) has gone up massively.
Now you're left with well under a decade of time to have kids.
Also. You have huge debt in that time. You may want to have a life, work on career etc etc.
The time grows shorter.
There isn't time to have more than 2 kids and be financially stable for an ever increasing number of couples.
Everything in life is now later. But biology is still the same.