Poll: Poll: UK General Election 2017 - Mk II

Who will you vote for?

  • Total voters
    1,453
  • Poll closed .
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StriderX said:
Can someone explain to me why we have like 10+ different taxes?

Why not just have a flat tax rate on income, remove VAT, remove everything really and to make up the shortfall, a much harsher tax on land/property (dont start, a great deal of economists feel its a good thing)?
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Universal credit is the way forward. Everybody gets say £10k no matter how rich they are and everybody pays the same rate of tax, say 35% or whatever the figure works out to be.
 
h4rm0ny said:
31% of £150,000 is a lot more than 20% of £20,000. In fact, that person earning £150,000 is paying tax equivalent to more than eleven such people. Exactly how many people is such a person supposed to equal in your opinion? Is it a moral failure for a person to put in as much as only eleven other people, in your opinion? Fifteen? I'm curious how many in your view a person is supposed to match, in people units. We'll ignore all those people earning less than £11,500 for purposes of this argument as the £150,000 earner would be putting in an infinite number of times more than them. Please answer in actual terms I've used, btw. You have a person standing in front of you who earns £150,000 p/a. You tell them they should pay ___ number of people's tax because of this. Tell us also how that is fair.
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I think the question is flawed because it assumes that every person should pay the same amount of tax regardless of how much money they have - that's the only way that there can be such a thing as X number of people's tax - and thus can't be answered in those terms without accepting the assumption.

If you're bringing fairness into it, you also have to consider how to fairly distribute money and resources. Is that person being paid £150,000 a year really contributing 7.5 times as much to society as that person being paid £20,000 a year? How do you fairly evaluate such a thing anyway? Then there's the consideration of how much money is actually worth, which varies enormously depending on how much a person has. £X is worth a lot more to someone with an income of £20,000 a year than it is to someone with an income of £150,000 a year. If it fair to ignore that reality for tax purposes? Is it fair to take it into account? If so, by how much?

I think it's a much more complex issue without clear answers.
 
The use of the term "fair" probably needs to be banned when talking about taxation. It is effectively meaningless. Any changes in taxation should be in terms of the purpose of the change, who it will impact and why.

Most people when they say "fair" taxation actually mean "someone other than me paying more".
 
h4rm0ny said:
If Labour loses, I think all can at least agree that there will be nothing more lamentable than the people who complain he lost yet didn't vote and were eligible. IF they turn out, he could win. The polls showing a Tory win are based on expected turn out in the relevant demographics as informed by previous years. For Labour at this point, it hinges on whether the people who say they want it, actually get off their arse or not. I guess if they don't, they didn't want it badly enough.
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Due to our political system, it wouldn't make a huge difference. For example, if everyone under 25 voted Labour would gain maybe a dozen seats. That's it, for the demographic least likely to vote and most likely to support Labour.
 
Angilion said:
Due to our political system, it wouldn't make a huge difference. For example, if everyone under 25 voted Labour would gain maybe a dozen seats. That's it, for the demographic least likely to vote and most likely to support Labour.
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Agreed. Due to our old population.... If 50% of the greys decided to vote and majority of them voted tories..... Then 75% of young people voted and majority voted labour... You would still get a tory landslide.

Hopefully May now going after the old and taking their winter fuel allowance she will finish a lot of them off in time for next election.
 
I have a sneaky suspicion that Turnout in the younger groups (18-34) might be pushed higher in this election, partially due to Brexit and partially because of Corbyn who really seems to have engaged with younger voters more than May has.
Maybe not to the extent that some polls are reporting, but I think we play down the concerns that younger people have over the Tory's and Brexit, especially as some parties have banged on for a year now about the "Grey Vote" stealing the younger people's future by voting for Brexit.
 
Greebo said:
I have never undertsood this attitude. I get this at work. "nah mate, I'm not going to do any overtime this week as it will put me into the top tax band and those extra hours at double time I will get taxed another 8% so it isnt worth it"
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I'm not saying the attitude is right but it's not to dissimilar to setting a tax level in the first place. Soon as someone deems the tax level too high they will go out their way to avoid paying the tax.

Richer people are normally the people who can do this hence why increasing taxes on the rich doesn't necessarily translate into higher tax revenues.

Guess in your example it depends on how much people value their time.
 
I am very very suprised that the majority of our media has come out and warned not to vote labour today ......... /s
but the real question is....

Can Jeremy Corbyn eat a bacon sandwich correctly?



Finding twitter funny.... #lastminutecorbynsmears

Jeremy Corbyn reheats tea in the microwave, and thinks "Snickers" is a far better name than "Marathon". #LastMinuteCorbynSmears


Corbyn buys jam at Waittose and steams the stickers off to pretend he made it

Jeremy Corbyn thinks Phantom Menace is better than Empire Strikes Back #LastMinuteCorbynSmears

Jeremy Corbyn didn't rewind a VHS of 'Kes' before returning it to Blockbuster #LastMinuteCorbynSmears

Jeremy Corbyn once had an unexpected item in the bagging area #lastminutecorbynsmears

Jeremy Corbyn eats After Eights at 7:59 #LastMinuteCorbynSmears

Corbyn doesn't even know what covfefe means. #lastminutecorbynsmears
 
balky12 said:
I'm not saying the attitude is right but it's not to dissimilar to setting a tax level in the first place. Soon as someone deems the tax level too high they will go out their way to avoid paying the tax.
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But for the vast majority under PAYE that's impossible

balky12 said:
Richer people are normally the people who can do this hence why increasing taxes on the rich doesn't necessarily translate into higher tax revenues.
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And at this level it tends not to come from work earnings but investments, share holdings etc

balky12 said:
Guess in your example it depends on how much people value their time.
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Everyone has a declining effecting value of that extra pound, thing is for many the extra earnings are way below their personal level and hence they never reach the point where they would select to not take the option of income.

We annually face a challenge in the business I work, because the people who can earn overtime are well paid (in general) compared to market rate and get an annual bonus that's fixed in relation to salary. Lots and lots of them who will normally work overtime wont that month its paid, they often quote it as the free overtime month.
So they set their expectations to around the level of a normal month, and for that one month the benefit of working overtime for them is less than the benefit of having the time off.
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
We annually face a challenge in the business I work, because the people who can earn overtime are well paid (in general) compared to market rate and get an annual bonus that's fixed in relation to salary. Lots and lots of them who will normally work overtime wont that month its paid, they often quote it as the free overtime month.
So they set their expectations to around the level of a normal month, and for that one month the benefit of working overtime for them is less than the benefit of having the time off.
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Kinda OT but my old company used to randomise the month bonuses got paid to stop this happening. You didn't know when your bonus was being paid until 7 days before pay day.
 
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