Porsche 996 Turbo - Any buying tips and what do people know about these?

Gibbo said:
I want 500BHP

Why? You just can't use that sort of power on the roads and you've got to be a damn good driver to use it on track

The reason I got rid of the MR2 turbo was cos it was too powerful to get the best out of it. There are too many speed cameras around, too many other drivers and weather in the UK isn't the best. The Elise is perfect for me, it's quick enough (4.9 0-60/13.0 0-100) but the handling is so good that you can enjoy even a trip to the shops for a pint of milk. It costs pennies to run which leaves me plenty of money for my mortgage and plenty of holidays per year, both of which are far more important than any car (to me anyway)

Sure the Mustang allows you to wave your willy around with figures like 500BHP, 20" alloys etc. but personally I think you can have much more fun with much less power.
 
eidolon said:

I am also wondering why you seem so obssessed with precise BHP /Torque figures than the actual cars themselves and how they drive. Is it just for bragging rights or have you a fetish of some sort? Well while the moneys rolling in I suppose its not too bad. ;)
 
eidolon said:
Why? You just can't use that sort of power on the roads and you've got to be a damn good driver to use it on track.

I disagree to an extent. Just because you have that sort of power it doesn't mean that if you aren't using it all the time then you shouldn't have it and can't use it. I find many places every day where I get to stretch fluffy's legs without putting anyone in danger at all (No I am not saying that I keep within the speed limits absolutely everywhere of course). Having owned a modified MR2 Turbo I can see why you would say that, it was the funkiest handling car I ever had and I got rid after 6 months before I killed myself.

Rayb, not sure if you have had a really powerful car before so excuse what I am about to say but I find that for most people I know that run big power cars, myself included, you never really want to downgrade bhp etc, you normally always want faster. I am very confident that the Porker will be faster than the mustang, despite having a slightly lower bhp figure and 4wd drivetrain. Every single car I have bought has been a power upgrade over the previous car.
 
rayb74 said:
I am also wondering why you seem so obssessed with precise BHP /Torque figures than the actual cars themselves and how they drive. Is it just for bragging rights or have you a fetish of some sort? Well while the moneys rolling in I suppose its not too bad. ;)

He's an overclocker isn't he? ;)

I'm with Eidelon, I want a car you can use 100% without worrying traction issues.
 
eidolon said:
Why? You just can't use that sort of power on the roads and you've got to be a damn good driver to use it on track

The reason I got rid of the MR2 turbo was cos it was too powerful to get the best out of it. There are too many speed cameras around, too many other drivers and weather in the UK isn't the best. The Elise is perfect for me, it's quick enough (4.9 0-60/13.0 0-100) but the handling is so good that you can enjoy even a trip to the shops for a pint of milk. It costs pennies to run which leaves me plenty of money for my mortgage and plenty of holidays per year, both of which are far more important than any car (to me anyway)

Sure the Mustang allows you to wave your willy around with figures like 500BHP, 20" alloys etc. but personally I think you can have much more fun with much less power.

Hi there

Maybe it does come from my past of been an overclocker and I've carried this obsession over to cars. All my life I've always been one to learn, investigate and get my hands dirty when it comes to cars, computers and other technology.
To me I get great pleasure from fitting a bolt-on mod or overclocking a computer and then been able to see/feel the difference from it.

Why do you say you just can't use the power though? When its dry and warm the Mustang is fine then, I can thoroughly enjoy the head snappin acceleration. The joy from holding on light mad, having to adjust the throttle, correct it on the steering or just drive it smoothly is very rewarding but when its dry and warm on reasonable roads I can easily extract the power and the experience is just menacing. :D
Also running cost of the Mustang are very low. Servicing is just oil changes which I do myself every 3000 miles, thats £50 a time. The owners book says every 6000, but I always change oil on all my cars every 3000 miles.
Insurance is pennies, £600 fully comp with mods declared. Tyres are expensive but the fronts last around 18,000 miles and the rears around 12,000 miles if I stick to the Pirelli as they are a good all round tyre so not a hugely soft compound and therefor better lasting. Only expense is fuel but I consider 15MPG reasonable for a car with 500BHP and extracting 25MPG on the motorway is easy. If I wished I could keep the Mustang and still have circa £1000 per month for a mortgage with enough money spare for 2-3 holidays per years but at the moment I choose not to get my own house and instead I do a combination of saving a large percentage of that money, going on holidays, buying all sorts of other stuff and just generally buying anything I like the look off.

If I was obsessed with willy waving then I'd have gone for the smaller 3.40 pulley, a more agressive tune and been gunning for 600BHP which is safe on these engines but I knew that would make it very hard to control on the roads, so I went for less power and a more conservative tune. Also the 20" wheels are part of manufacturers specification. I would actually preferre something smaller and lighter with less skinnier tyres to help more with traction and handling. This is something I still may yet change on the car as the combination of heavy 20" wheels with skinny tyres does not aid traction at all.

You are right it does not require huge BHP to have fun, an Elise, Integra are great examples of that but all cars bring different types of fun and it depends on what you want. As I have now experience a 500BHP car however I don't particular want my next car to be slower. If its same then thats great, if its quicker than my god but what a Porsche will bring is better handling and improved ability to use its power irrelevant of road condition due to 4WD and traction control systems. If I bought a slower car yes it still may be fun but I can see myself thinking that everytime I put my foot down I would be missing the Mustangs torque and power.
 
Anyone remember that Top Gear Episode when they had the V8 Vantage vs a 911 vs an M6? They did a point to point run on the Isle of Man and the 911 beat all of them. A good example of why so much bhp is unnecessary if the car isnt able to put it all down onto the road.
 
panthro said:
Anyone remember that Top Gear Episode when they had the V8 Vantage vs a 911 vs an M6? They did a point to point run on the Isle of Man and the 911 beat all of them. A good example of why so much bhp is unnecessary if the car isnt able to put it all down onto the road.

Yes I do but was it not raining when they did the test? That gives the 911 a huge advantage but is also why I want one. :D

The Mustang can put the power down but only in good conditions on equally good roads. If coming out of a bend with cambers and applying the throttle on the exit can still push the rear-end out due to the live axle, but its great fun at times. :D
 
Guys (that don't obviously realise this somehow), one of the major point of 4WD is that you get away with putting more power/traction down on the road with the right setup ;). I have been driving 4WD for 6 years now and will never go back to 2wd by choice.
 
Gibbo said:
Maybe it does come from my past of been an overclocker and I've carried this obsession over to cars.

I'm a reformed overclocker myself which is why I used to like turbocharged cars. Turning up the boost is the same as changing the multiplier/FSB, free power.

Gibbo said:
Why do you say you just can't use the power though? When its dry and warm the Mustang is fine then, I can thoroughly enjoy the head snappin acceleration.


In my opinion it's just too fast for the roads. Coming down a sliproad I bet you've only got 5 seconds of fun before you're got a serious chance of losing your licence. On a twisty road I bet you don't even get to use 50% of your power.
Gibbo said:
As I have now experience a 500BHP car however I don't particular want my next car to be slower.

I thought the same but I don't regret the Elise purchase in the slightest. I get infinitely more enjoyment of using 90% of the Elise's power rather than 60% of the MR2's. Merlin went from a Scoob to a Teg, Drexel went from an RX7 to a Teg and I bet there'll be a thread about how much fun it is soon.
200-250BHP is about perfect for the roads, it's still quick enough to see off most things but still controllable.
 
Gibbo said:
Yes I do but was it not raining when they did the test? That gives the 911 a huge advantage but is also why I want one. :D

The Mustang can put the power down but only in good conditions on equally good roads. If coming out of a bend with cambers and applying the throttle on the exit can still push the rear-end out due to the live axle, but its great fun at times. :D

Yes it was raining however I thought it was a standard C2 that was reviewed so RWD olny, and it was still faster than the Aston and the M6 and that was the 2WD version. :eek:
 
eidolon said:
Why? You just can't use that sort of power on the roads and you've got to be a damn good driver to use it on track
Not true. I use 507BHP quite regularly on the roads.

eidolon said:
Sure the Mustang allows you to wave your willy around with figures like 500BHP, 20" alloys etc. but personally I think you can have much more fun with much less power.
That's because you have much less power.
 
Spie said:
Not true. I use 507BHP quite regularly on the roads.


That's because you have much less power.

How much faster do you really think it is than if it had say 300bhp? In real world terms, quite little I'd say. And remember, this is an M5, which has a hell of a lot of computers to get the best out of the power, whereas the mustang, does not.
 
andi said:
How much faster do you really think it is than if it had say 300bhp? In real world terms, quite little I'd say. And remember, this is an M5, which has a hell of a lot of computers to get the best out of the power, whereas the mustang, does not.

Hi there

You are correct as the only thing adjusting the power going to the tarmec in the Mustang is my right foot, when it looses traction, start going sideways etc. I have no computer to bring it under control, again I have to sort it out. This is not necessarily a bad thing it can be great fun but it does mean at times in poor conditions it can make pressing on quickly very demanding of myself. Wheras with say an M5, Porsche, EVO it would be far easier and quicker too in poor conditions.

But Spie makes a very good point, he really does use all 507BHP on the roads and at times even in wet/damp conditions so if a RWD BMW can manage this then I am sure a 4WD Porsche Turbo will manage it even better with upto 600BHP.

I've had an S2000, which was only 240BHP but it was indeed truly great fun and the sound was amazing, but the S2000 is one of the best sounding 4 cylinder engines there is in my oppinion. So in a way you could say I've done the Sports car thing as afterall an S2000 handling abilities are on par with An Elise, maybe not quite as good but certainly not hugely different, just the S2000 in my view has a huge advantage with its engine.

So what I want is Mustang power and reliability but a car that can put that power down on UK roads with our weather with the ability for great tuning potential should I want even more power. I feel the Porsche 996 Turbo will do this very well. Plus now they are becoming great second hand buys. A 4yr car that was 100k new can now be for 40k. Thats 15k per year depreciation wheras that depreciation will start to slow in approx 6-12 months when I make my purchase. Afterall I doubt 996 Turbos will drop below 30k for a few years yet, but in 6-12 months I'd suspect cheap examples to be around 35k with some fantastic examples in the 40-45k region. :)
 
andi said:
How much faster do you really think it is than if it had say 300bhp? In real world terms, quite little I'd say. And remember, this is an M5, which has a hell of a lot of computers to get the best out of the power, whereas the mustang, does not.

Well thats easy with the M5, you can drive it in the 400BHP mode or choose to drive it in the full 507BHP mode.

I can tell you the difference is quite astonishing even on our roads, so in real world terms I'd say the difference is quite a lot.

If you were referring to two cars that were both RWD with no computers to stop it from falling off the road then yes I'd agree the difference between a 300BHP and 500BHP on some B-Roads would be smaller, but as soon a stretch came along the 500BHP car would just dissapear.

However the real world difference between say a 4WD or RWD car with computers to keep it on the road then the 500BHP will certainly be a lot quicker even on our roads.
 
andi said:
How much faster do you really think it is than if it had say 300bhp? In real world terms, quite little I'd say. And remember, this is an M5, which has a hell of a lot of computers to get the best out of the power, whereas the mustang, does not.

For my example at least, having owned a 290bhp wrx, a 350bhp sti and my current baby the difference between the first one and the current one is night and day. The difference between the second and current one was noticeable too as the first sti had a big turbo that you waited for and then all hell broke loose at 5.5k onwards due to exhaust configuration bumping the peak power way up the band. Fluffy has a hybrid turbo giving far better midrange punch and fairly little trail off of power higher up. Power implemented correctly is what it's all about. Bring gearing etc in to the equation and you have all sorts of option for power delivery too obviously.
 
Spie said:
Not true. I use 507BHP quite regularly on the roads.

If you use it for more than say 10 seconds you're in serious danger of losing your licence, that was the point I was making, not that somehow impossible to get that amount of power down to the ground (although it's gonna be a damn sight harder to get the power down in the Mustang than it is in the M5 with all your gadgetry)

Spie said:
That's because you have much less power.

When I was looking to purchase a car I was very, very tempted to get a 5l TVR because there's not much around that can accelerate like one. Then I went out in an VX and an Elise and realised that whilst it's fun being pushed into your seat when you plant your right foot, it's much more fun being able to corner quicker than Physics should allow you to hence why I bought the 111R (which is hardly slow by anyones standards anyway)
The Elise allows me to make very quick progress, carrying a hell of a lot of speed round corners. Naturally the Mustang would leave me on the straights, but I don't think it would have a chance when the road was anything but straight. (as seen on Top Gear and the Jeremy Clarkson DVD)
 
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