Red Bull issue, F1 rules in general?

Wayn0r said:
Do you think Webber would have reacted as he did, if he felt it was down to a fair race and not JUST ignoring team orders?
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As I said at the time, I think Webbers biggest frustration was with losing to Vettel, rather than the specifics of how he got caught.

Imagine if Vettel had been placed on Webbers gearbox due to a Safety Car, and they had then fought in the same way and Webber lost out. He would have been equally as annoyed at the situation, but for a different reason.
 
Kimi said:
There is no doubt that as soon as Webber saw him coming, he would have turned that engine up to max
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I agree. No idea when this exact moment was, but from that point on Webber quite clearly wasn't going to let Vettel past, and we got a great race, but one that Webber ultimately lost.
 
Skeeter said:
It has been confirmed that Webber was not told to turn his engine down.
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That's not correct.

The safety car scenario is irrelevant because that's not what happened. I imagine if that happened both drivers would then be working the cars harder to create a gap to 3rd and 4th and so on. Both cars would have been cooler and saved fuel in a safety car period, rather than one car running leaner and slower than the other and the faster car mugging an old lady :D
 
Webber was only about three quarters of a second slower than Vettel who was using the extra KERS and on a charge, so I'm not sure where the cold tyres argument came from?

Vettel actually pulled away from Webber at almost the speed he caught him. Mark wasn't taking it that easy.
 
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Mr Men said:
Still not racing when Webber had been in cruise mode which drops tyre temps and pressures.
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yeah the race was effectively ended by the team when they told webber to start preserving tyres and fuel, with caution over tyre wear red bull didn't want to risk having to pit again and lose position to the Mercedes, perhaps they were over cautious but understandable. we've seen f1 cars are very sensitive to temperatures etc and those circumstances were altered for mark by the team, the team also wanted vettel to do the same but of course he did not, that's not racing in the normal sense, as the circumstances were altered off track.

I think also being against vettels behaviour does not mean you endorse team orders, whether team orders are wrong or right they were in place and whether you follow them or not when your being paid to do so is a somewhat different matter.

I thought what button says here puts it pretty well.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/106634
 
Bottom line is that Horner has been undermined by both Vettel and Marko. As well as all out war with his 'teamate' , should be an interesting and uncomfortable GP for RB ;)
 
Well at least F1 seems to be self regulating to an extent. Don't want team orders? Just get the drivers to ignore them and the teams will stop using them anyway.

No team orders and races that end at the chequered flag rather than after the last pit stop, sounds like a good deal to me.
 
I think the only thing worse than the team orders is when it's always the same few who benefit.

People say they want it to be more of a level playing field but it will likely never be the case.
 
Skeeter said:
Ferrari have run a (very successful) team based on this concept for ages.

And anyway, the team order that was given was for the benefit of Webber.
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I'm not denying it works, far from it, if you can find a decent, willing number 2 I would imagine it's a fantastic setup.
One thing to say about Ferrari is their openness about having a favoured driver... But that's irrelevant.

Like many I'm not a fan of the team orders but they exist and will exist whether allowed by the rules or not. I meant more that it takes away from the racing we'd like to see and anything that does that be it the tyre rules, aero rules, engines or team orders isn't great. For me I'd much rather feel a driver won on merit/talent than being assisted, no matter how small it may be, but that's unlikely to ever be the case.
 
Guerrilla said:
I'm not denying it works, far from it, if you can find a decent, willing number 2 I would imagine it's a fantastic setup.
One thing to say about Ferrari is their openness about having a favoured driver... But that's irrelevant.

Like many I'm not a fan of the team orders but they exist and will exist whether allowed by the rules or not. I meant more that it takes away from the racing we'd like to see and anything that does that be it the tyre rules, aero rules, engines or team orders isn't great. For me I'd much rather feel a driver won on merit/talent than being assisted, no matter how small it may be, but that's unlikely to ever be the case.
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You see that's because you look at the drivers, i follow constructors so don't really care about team orders
 
My opinion on team orders is:
They shouldn't have any. End of. Racing is racing. Every man/women for them-self.
On the RedBull matter. If Webber would have overtaken Seb, what would have happened to Webber? I'm sure there would have been some sort of sanction by RedBull in some way.
 
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