Russian SU-24 - Shot Down by Turkey

Over Clocker · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:47

BREAKING: US military spokesman Colonel Steve Warren has confirmed that Turkey warned the Russian pilots repeatedly before the jet was shot down, but failed to get a response.
"We were able to hear everything that was going on, these (communications) were on open channels," he said.

BREAKING: A US military spokesman says the plane was shot down "at the border" but could not confirm whether it was on the Turkish or Syrian side.

Cyanide · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:47

Given that almost every time we arm a group of rebels it comes back to bite us a few years later have we considered maybe NOT providing weapons to people?

Shocky-FM · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:48

adolf hamster said:
Isnt that against one of the conventions to shoot them as they drop? I thought it was

Edit yep;
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attacks_on_parachutists

Something tells me they don't care about the rules of war.

dowie · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:49

Cyanide said:
Given that almost every time we arm a group of rebels it comes back to bite us a few years later have we considered maybe NOT providing weapons to people?

we haven't provided weapons in this instance

Uther · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:50

Cyanide said:
Given that almost every time we arm a group of rebels it comes back to bite us a few years later have we considered maybe NOT providing weapons to people?

Yeah but, arms industry / profit / etc...

Cyanide · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:51

dowie said:
we haven't provided weapons in this instance

I know, but there's a lot of talk of "lets arm x so they can help us defeat y!"

Seriously... it NEVER goes well.

"andy" · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:58

Cyanide said:
I know, but there's a lot of talk of "lets arm x so they can help us defeat y!"

Seriously... it NEVER goes well.

someone with more knowledge than us probably thinks its working out ok...

Above&Beyond · 24 Nov 2015 at 15:59

Cyanide said:
Given that almost every time we arm a group of rebels it comes back to bite us a few years later have we considered maybe NOT providing weapons to people?

It'd be a lot worse for us if we sent our own army in. You need boots on the ground to take back territory.

neoboy · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:05

Same as contractors, general public doesn't really care how many of them die, out of sight out of mind.

ColdAsIce · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:05

Cyanide said:
Given that almost every time we arm a group of rebels it comes back to bite us a few years later have we considered maybe NOT providing weapons to people?

+1 ^_^

Cyanide · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:06

"andy" said:
someone with more knowledge than us probably thinks its working out ok...

Or someone with shares in an arms company

Above&Beyond said:
It'd be a lot worse for us if we sent our own army in. You need boots on the ground to take back territory.

So don't send our army in? Groups like IS want to draw us in, get a war going and use "Westerners have invaded our lands!" to drum up more support. They use our intervention in their affairs as justification for their attacks on us.

I know I'm sounding like a leftie nut-job, but nothing else has worked so far. Everything we do in the Middle East makes things worse. Why not just say "you know what, *** it, we shouldn't be involved here. We've ****** up enough already, sort yourselves out"

If we're not there and not doing anything then they can't use that as justification for their terrorism. And if they keep it up and make up another excuse... nuke them.

Curio · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:06

Somewhere on another site (when the Russian missions started) I pulled a prediction out of my behind. I said Turkey would shoot down a Russian jet on Nov 18th, and they would claim it was over their airspace while Russia would say it wasn't. I was only a few days out!

That's how utterly predictable this incident was. I'm sure Russia and Turkey also knew this was bound to happen, so it will be interesting to see what was on their "to do" lists for when this day inevitably arrived.

McBain · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:06

Here we go.

Twirlywoos · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:08

3,165 civilian deaths and injuries in the year up to August caused by airstrikes in Syria. Don't hear about that do you in the media? You don't speak up against death of innocent people in the ME.

El Capitano · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:09

Russia has been routinely violating the air space of other countries for a while now and Turkey ran out of patience. It's also a pretty safe bet that when two accounts differ, it's the Russian one that's lying.

Above&Beyond · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:11

Cyanide said:
Or someone with shares in an arms company

So don't send our army in? Groups like IS want to draw us in, get a war going and use "Westerners have invaded our lands!" to drum up more support. They use our intervention in their affairs as justification for their attacks on us.

I know I'm sounding like a leftie nut-job, but nothing else has worked so far. Everything we do in the Middle East makes things worse. Why not just say "you know what, *** it, we shouldn't be involved here. We've ****** up enough already, sort yourselves out"

If we're not there and not doing anything then they can't use that as justification for their terrorism. And if they keep it up and make up another excuse... nuke them.

Because IS will use that failed state as a base to train fighters to attack us. They don't believe in leave us alone and we'll leave you alone. You look at the best, or least worst option and that's what you go with if you don't send your own men and women in.

Nuking them isn't an option, unless we get our money's worth from Trident before it's replaced. (a joke btw)

Armageus · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:20

I've requested this thread be merged with another thread on the subject, if you could continue any discussion in the other thread please -> http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18704103

George Hincapie · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:25

It'll be like Top Gun all over again:

"You can be my wing man any time"

"BS. You can be mine"

In Turkish/Russian. Obviously.

Harlequin · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:27

putin blowing hot and cold again - MH17 wasn't that long ago....

and neither was the crimea invasion nor the ongoing mess in Ukraine.

can putin afford yet another front to this war?? turkey wont stop if the bombs fall on Ankara and they will enact article 5, on the grounds that overflights and attacking of the Turkmen is an act of war against NATO

George Hincapie · 24 Nov 2015 at 16:28

Russian aircraft enter British airspace all the time and we don't shoot them down. ****in' uppity Turks.