Well a day of work but it is more the awkwardness of having to reject if a low pay offer is (more than likely) is made
Salary not being revealed
- Thread starter aspiring
- Start date
Know your worth, it's not awkward to reject the low offer. Use it as interview experience and thank them but firmly and politely reject the offer. If they were open about the salary then it would have avoided both parties spending time unecessarily.
I don't understand how that's awkward at all, you don't even need to reject them, just counter with your figure instead and let them decide if they want to pay it.
I wouldn't say that was a reason to feel awkward. Failure to be tempted to go through an interview for a unknown offer, yes decline to proceed. But once you have a offer and it failing to live up to expectations and rejecting it, that is empowering.
From the other side, giving salary ranges is problematic for the employee because it will limit options and hides the fact that the salary is negotiable and dependent on the candidate.
2 recent hires were given salaries outside our original banding. In the first case we just couldn't find anyone at a suitable experience level that would be worth the 150-190k USD, but there were dome lore junior engineers that had a lot of potential so one got a much lower offer and will making fast progression as they prove their abilities and gain experience. The exact opposite happened more recently where we had a budget capped at 140k but there was only 1 strong candidate and they had a counter offer but we quickly upped our offer to 180k. If we told the candidate the max salary was 140k they might not have even interviewed .
But then any candidate demanding explicit salary information at the strat of the interview process would likely be rejected anyway as that is simply not the kind of person we would on our team
2 recent hires were given salaries outside our original banding. In the first case we just couldn't find anyone at a suitable experience level that would be worth the 150-190k USD, but there were dome lore junior engineers that had a lot of potential so one got a much lower offer and will making fast progression as they prove their abilities and gain experience. The exact opposite happened more recently where we had a budget capped at 140k but there was only 1 strong candidate and they had a counter offer but we quickly upped our offer to 180k. If we told the candidate the max salary was 140k they might not have even interviewed .
But then any candidate demanding explicit salary information at the strat of the interview process would likely be rejected anyway as that is simply not the kind of person we would on our team
Associate
- Joined
- 20 Jun 2023
- Posts
- 677
- Location
- uk
Being old and miserable I'd be more interested in how long I get off.
it is not transparent to be ambigious from outset though
That's on the employer to do their planning and actually have a clear picture of what they need the budget they have available.
Are you strictly looking to fill out a specific position? Do you have the potential to fit in different candidates if you do come across good candidates above or below the level you're hiring for? If so, simply saying this is the salary range for the role we are hiring for, but can be flexible on the role for exceptional candidates.....ta da.... Everyone's happy. Not really hard is it?
I don't start any interview process until I know the salary range. I'd be concerned at any candidates that don't ask about salary early doors because it's the most important part of the contract between employer and employee. Getting the salary right at a level that works for both parties is the foundation of the relationship.
It's like the world of business is oblivious to the capitalist environment they live within. Whether they put on a act or not, all the candidates applying are motivated by money, it's now just a question of, do you want someone who continues to plays games or gets straight to business?
no, not really. Money is important but time is more important and how you spend the majority of your time is obviously a big factor. If someone only cares about the paycheck then they will likely move jobs as soon as they can get a better offer. Someone who takes pride in their work, is passionate about what they do, strives to achieve their best, wants to actively progress the team, shares the vision etc are far more important.
I'll wager D.P. works for some billy big ******** fin/tech/engineering firm that pretends the world of employment is about personal fulfilment and the warm glow that comes from working at such a fabulous company....
Been there, got that T-shirt.
The reality in these firms is that they are actually full of grasping, ambitious types that would step on their own grandmother to get a promotion and payrise.
I could get a good 10-20k a year better if I shopped around in my industry, and double/triple my salary if I switched industry....so money isn't my primary motivator....but I do have a baseline. I established this in my first conversation with the recruiter for my current job. If you can't agree a ballpark figure up front, particularly when you're committing to 4-5 rounds of interviews, it's a waste of everyone's time, and a sign of a poorly managed business.
Last edited:
Not at all. It is completely impossible to know what kind of candidates will apply before the position is opened. You might hope to recruit at a certain grade but if there is no one suitable at that level then compromising on grade is by far the best option. Budgets are usually restricted by time and are allocated to a specific quater, and time to hire is usually very important e
g. to start on a new project or replace someone who left. The actual salary is almost always negotiable so is just not that important from the employer perspective .
Someone applying for a job should have their own salary requirements and have done their homework to know what to expect from the position and company and they also shouldn't mind starting tje interview process before finding out the salary.
Of course anyone can ask for a salary rane but expect some broad range with a canned anser about being commiserate with experience and flexible..
The whole salary thing becomes even more complex if you work with a fully globalised team. When we open a position the person could be hired anywhere from Bangalore to Boston, Shanghai to san Francisco. The salary will be adjusted to local living costs so the most useful is just to state the job grade
Thanks for proving my point. I am in the same situation, i could get paid far more if i changed employers but i like my job , employer, team, flexibility
But basing potential salary of current salary does not make sense as separate jobs?
Only if you think of a salary as the fair amount of pay for a job. But that's not how companies (mostly) set salaries: salaries are set at the value which allows them to recruit the candidate and kept at a level where staff don't actively leave because of low pay. Companies base their offers on previous salaries because they believe (correctly) that most people are going to be happy with a salary that is higher than their current salary and unhappy with a salary that is lower.
And this is what this all boils down to.....it is a good idea to make sure the employee salary requirements are in line with employer's expectations before either side wastes huge amounts of time on a hiring process that isn't going anywhere?
By asking the recruiter, a representative of the company, what the expectations are for the position at that company? Seems sensible.
Seems like a good idea, it's like you're disagreeing with me in general but every point you make indicates you are in agreement.
Maybe you'd get paid more if you read whole sentences and didn't cut the important part off my quote
Yes I'm flexible on salary, but there is a baseline that needs to be met and I'm not wasting my time going through days of interviews if the company isn't going to meet that requirement.
Failure to do that on the part of either the employee or employee is indicative of ****-poor management and planning.
I kind of get what you mean from your previous post. Yes if someone comes straight in asking what the salary is, it does look like that's all they care about or gives a bad impression. However it seems nowadays the newer generation aren't into sinking time into an interview without knowing what the salary is, so I also don't blame them if the salary isn't revealed and they ask, or they completely skip it. I definitely don't bother, it seems like a waste of my time.
At our company the salary (the range) is on the job advert so it's straight up and open. We do get lots of candidates with that, most recently 45 for a single post which gets whittled down to 2-3 due to applications not meeting the experience or knowledge. I don't think making a candidate play the "interview game" makes them more of a team player and someone enthusiastic about their job and work. You only really find that out when they actually start and is one of the things that is really difficult to capture for an interview process. We also get people who can pass the interview and that's what they're good at, but in the job they need more support than is expected in their role.
But previous salary is for a specific job. New salary is for a totally new and different role.
If a bin man became a doctor you can't give uplift from starting bin man wage as the doctor role is different level of responsibility
I'm not saying your view is unreasonable; I'm saying it's not how many companies are setting salaries. It's not about the role, it's about what they need to pay to get the candidate.
Public sector and some larger companies, of course, have at least semi-rigid payscales; as do those with strong unions.
Why would they not be the kind of person you want?