salary prospects

The contract market (specifically IT/Finance) at the moment is soaring.

Reasons?

No-one is quite sure if this is an actual recovery or not. If it isn't, the last thing companies want is another batch of redundancy payouts. So, certainly in 6 or so companies I have contacts in, there's a freeze on employing permanent staff, and contractors are brought in on a 3 month rolling contract.

Tip: don't go contracting for me, I'll make you edit xml files all day.

:)
 
You have been an engineer for over a decade which is where my thinking came from.
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Yes, and the entry salary for S/W engineer is 16k (19k for a grad). So I'm 12k on top of that. I didn't start as a software engineer - I worked my way up from help desk on 9k when a S/W engineer starting salary was 12k.

There are different levels of S/W engineers though. I'm centered around live support, which is traditionally quite poor salary wise - but it's stable and regular and you have a job as long as the system is running - the system I'm on is contracted to 2019 - the system I used to work on has already been going for 18yrs and has just been extended to 2025!.

I could be a S/W in something like scratch building Java/Siebel apps (which I have training for) but then I'd have to do long hours, lots of traveling to and from customer sites etc and that would probably net 40k - but that's not what I want.
 
amigafan2003 said:
I don't want to move house - I don't want to commute further - I don't want to work extra hours or overtime - I like the benefits 13yrs working in the same company have bougt me (42 days holiday a year, extended flexi time, respect from peers etc).
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This is invaluable. I get nothing like 42 days holiday (25), to put it into context.

As far as the legalities are concerned, I've spent 8 years with the company (a year in reality) and have never 'changed' company other than through acquisition (twice) since I graduated.

Life is a balance, between professional and personal lives, but taking into account inflation, I'm not sure I could cope with 1K p.a raises :(. Having said that, I've had nothing for the past 18 months :D
 
This is invaluable. I get nothing like 42 days holiday (25), to put it into context.
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Do they make you take bank holidays as part of your annual leave entitlement?
 
A non grad engineer position? How can you be an engineer without qualifications

Are you sure you are not a technician?
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If you have good A-levels and give a good interview, they put you on a modern apprentice program. If you're already in the company, they send you on a six week course on your chosen language/cots package (I've done Cobol, Java, HTML/XML, Centauri BSM and Siebel CRM) and then it's all on the job "top ups" - you don't get squat on paper though as they don't want you to leave and go to a diff company.

I'm sure I'm not a technician. Technicians don't hard code fixes from scratch :-) (Besides, My job code is AMS Software Engineer).

I was a little surprised at those numbers myself
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Remember - I'm still on Image terms and conditions - i.e. civil service pay bands. Those on standard terms are still only a few grand above me though, but they lose leave entitlement, flexi leave, reduced compensation if made redundant, lose the civ pension etc.
 
amigafan2003 said:
Remember - I'm still on Image terms and conditions - i.e. civil service pay bands. Those on standard terms are still only a few grand above me though, but they lose leave entitlement, flexi leave, reduced compensation if made redundant, lose the civ pension etc.
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In that case, it sounds like you've done pretty well :)
 
[TW]Fox;14885385 said:
A non grad engineer position? How can you be an engineer without qualifications :confused:

Are you sure you are not a technician?
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He said "I'm centered around live support" which is definitely not an engineering position.

An engineer *designs* something from scratch. He is in more of a maintenance role.

It's like... nobody calls the guys that paint the Golden Gate Bridge "engineers". They're just maintaining an existing design.

In the industry we call them "code monkeys" :p
 
It's like... nobody calls the guys that paint the Golden Gate Bridge "engineers". They're just maintaining an existing design.
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If half the bridge fell down - who analyses why it fell down and designs the new part to fix it? That's right - the engineers. In your example, I agree the engineer wouldn't then fit that part - but that's the way we work. Our systems are very bespoke - even though they are Siebel based - and getting someone without the specific application knowledge to design a fix just isn't going to work - regardless of how good an "engineer" they are.

That's what we do on AMS - we analyse problems, design solutions and implement them - with support from the teams that look after the actual platform (i.e. the AIX boxes, networks etc). The only thing we don't do is full business test - that goes to a dedicated team and most of it is done by the customer themselves.

We even develop full releases - all the way from requirements gathering to implementation weekends.

So yes, whilst we didn't design this system from scratch, it certainly doesn't negate the fact we ARE engineers. We're just different from what you expect in your little pigeon hole. Having said that - we are all capable of developing a system from scratch, if we needed to.

Now an architect is a different matter - we have none of those and it blows my mind every time we go to a meeting with one!
 
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So literally 30 minutes ago, my manager said "Rich, can I have a quick word with you please" in quite a serious tone, so I followed her into her office and thought she was going to fire me or something!

She then proceeds to say:

"The MD has decided that the companies finances are healthy enough to reinstate annual pay rises, and because you have been working so hard for us I want to put you forward for a pay rise, effective next month. We have been interviewing similar roles to yourself and the going market rate at the moment is high 40s, so I want to put your pay from 40k up to 50k!"

My jaw literally hit the floor! I had to try and take the news as matter of factly as possible to stop myself saying something stupid!

Anyways, I saw this thread and thought I'd post this funny little story so that everyone would know that if you work hard you do actually get rewarded! I'm 28 by the way.
 
NathanE said:
He said "I'm centered around live support" which is definitely not an engineering position.

An engineer *designs* something from scratch. He is in more of a maintenance role.
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This far closer to my understanding and I guess explains the salary - a geniune engineer with 13 years engineering experience would be foolish to work for that amount.
 
This far closer to my understanding and I guess explains the salary - a geniune engineer with 13 years engineering experience would be foolish to work for that amount.
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If I went to NathanE's definition of an engineer though (which is correct -i t's just not as black and white as that) then I'd have to work longer/harder/travel further etc. I'd say I've made the smart choice by sticking where I am.
 
Volcs said:
Most major grad schemes offer £30K+ as a starting salary.
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You have got to be kidding me. On average the current starting rate is in the early 20K area within the software industry. It also depends on area, level of specialisation and how good you are.

I started on £16.8K. I stayed in the same company for 12 years with double digit increases (apart from the few years of pay freezes).

New permanent roles I'm looking at vary from £45-85K, realistic expectation in the 50-60K area.
 
[TW]Fox;14885091 said:
You also need to be proficient in making simple things sound as complicated as possible using words and phrases like 'self develop' and having a 'skillset' and utilising 'synergistic implementation methodologies'.
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You've got it :D
 
nero120 said:
So literally 30 minutes ago, my manager said "Rich, can I have a quick word with you please" in quite a serious tone, so I followed her into her office and thought she was going to fire me or something!

She then proceeds to say:

"The MD has decided that the companies finances are healthy enough to reinstate annual pay rises, and because you have been working so hard for us I want to put you forward for a pay rise, effective next month. We have been interviewing similar roles to yourself and the going market rate at the moment is high 40s, so I want to put your pay from 40k up to 50k!"

My jaw literally hit the floor! I had to try and take the news as matter of factly as possible to stop myself saying something stupid!

Anyways, I saw this thread and thought I'd post this funny little story so that everyone would know that if you work hard you do actually get rewarded! I'm 28 by the way.
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Did she then say "only joking, egg face" :)

I had something similar last week as part of our "Winners Scheme". Some vouchers of my choice up to £50. :)
 
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