***Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice***

[strumpusplunket]

Ha yeah, I am definitely leaving the upper castle for a bit.

I did a little bit of exploring after I posted. I did also find some very aggresive monkeys and some tough looking spear dude at the top of some steps, but I didn't feel up to approaching him before bed last night. Not quite sure which direction I should be heading.

I think I only have the boss in the other area left - clear "boss room" vibes coming off where I got up to anyway. Wondering if I can get any more seeds or beads before facing whichever boss is next...

 

[Amatsubu]

I personally did Hirata and then the castle boss after that as I didn't check the other paths.

I think you can do it like that and it's a good order IMO, with the castle boss out of the way you can fully explore the other areas and it won't bug you that you left a boss alive.

You don't need a lot of upgrades to kill him, just understanding of the combat mechanics and some pattern recognition. It's a very fun fight.

 

[strumpusplunket]

In this and in the Souls games I always get a bit nervous before first encountering a new boss and like to explore as much as I can beforehand

I like how Sekiro has mini-bosses as well that keep you on your toes and also give important rewards in between the main bosses (killed the big spear dude eventually with much panicking and dying before I got him).

I have been trying to get my "controlled" aggression on point. I realised the other night I had over-compensated for my Dark Souls-ingrained hang back/dodge around and nip in and out passive style and become too manically attack-oriented. It feels a tricky balance to strike but I am getting there slowly. I think.

Will have to mentally steel myself for Lady Butterfly one night this week.

 

[M1k3H]

Surprising went from struggling on the mini boss at Ashina Outskirts (after Ogre) , to defeating Ashina Genichiro on my second go.

Realised that you have to be very aggressive and time your deflects as best as you can to build posture damage. Will head down the serpent idol next I think.

 

[Amatsubu]

I have been trying to get my "controlled" aggression on point. I realised the other night I had over-compensated for my Dark Souls-ingrained hang back/dodge around and nip in and out passive style and become too manically attack-oriented. It feels a tricky balance to strike but I am getting there slowly. I think.

Will have to mentally steel myself for Lady Butterfly one night this week.

Yeah, it is a bit of a departure but it'll feel amazing when it clicks. I'll use a quote from the game to sum up what you have to do, don't worry it won't spoil anything plot-wise: "Hesitation is defeat".

That's basically it. Don't let your opponent catch a breath, stay on them and attack, then respond to their attacks with deflects and interrupts, stagger them if you know you can. Get into that rhythm, read the patterns and don't let them regain their posture.

This is the entire controlled aggression thingy, a similar concept Bloodborne uses bit there you can't block at all and have to, for example, have the balls to roll through enemy attacks towards them or to the sides, you don't just back away all the time. Same here, if you're afraid to attack, you'll lose. If you attack too recklessly and don't respond to patterns, you'll lose.

Not lying, this and Bloodborne were some of the most thrilling and satisfying combat experiences I've ever had in a game.

 

[strumpusplunket]

So, after all that dread and putting it off to explore other places, I went into Lady B's boss room last night, and... first time. Only had to use one gourd.

One the one hand I was really pleased to find it so easy, but on the other, well, I am concerned I didn't put into practice any of the Sekiro-specific mechanics. I don't think I deflected her once. I just fell into a Sister Friede groove with her almost immediately and just dodged around her back, got three hits in and stayed on her doing that. She barely did anything. I did basically the same with the drunkard outside, actually. Dogdge around and hugged his back and he was too slow to turn to counter it.

But these are just DS boss tactics. Obvoiusly I don't have instincts nailed for the attack/deflect pattern yet. The fast attacks still freak me out and I instinctively want to dodge. I doubt I am going to be able to get away with that on the next boss.

Surprising went from struggling on the mini boss at Ashina Outskirts (after Ogre) , to defeating Ashina Genichiro on my second go.

Realised that you have to be very aggressive and time your deflects as best as you can to build posture damage. Will head down the serpent idol next I think.

Yeah, I really struggled with that General, too.

I am near Genchiro (I think), but there is a guy in a room near the idol giving off definite "blue-robed samurai but a mini-boss version" vibes and as the normal blue samurai mobs kick my ass so much I really don't wanna go in to fight him!

 

[Borsch]

Sister Friede

Just the name makes me shudder Beaten her (and the Dark Souls 3 game in general) twice, but yeah, talk about conniptions...

I don't think I deflected her once. I just fell into a Sister Friede groove with her almost immediately and just dodged around her back, got three hits in and stayed on her doing that.

Wow, never thought trying to dodge against Lady B, will try that strategy as well. Sidestep is really powerful in Sekiro, I'm doing another playthrough atm without mikiri counters, using sidesteps against all perilous thrust attacks - so far so good.

 

[strumpusplunket]

Just the name makes me shudder Beaten her (and the Dark Souls 3 game in general) twice, but yeah, talk about conniptions...

I feel your pain. 20 deaths to her here. Finally getting her down was one of my major gaming landmarks!

Wow, never thought trying to dodge against Lady B, will try that strategy as well. Sidestep is really powerful in Sekiro, I'm doing another playthrough atm without mikiri counters, using sidesteps against all perilous thrust attacks - so far so good.

Tbh, I didn't think about it all. I guess it was all muscle memory. Once she lunged at me, before I knew it I'd dodged around and attacked. And, well it worked. So I kept it up. Seems like she deflects the third strike, but as she shapes to attack you can be back behind and hitting her again before she finishes the animation. I lost half a health bar trying to fight the grey spirits, but otherwise she really didn't do anything fancy at all.

Good to know sidestep/dodge is still a somewhat viable strategy since I don't seem to be very good at all with the execution of mikiris yet. With the trainer I can go on a run of getting 10 mikiris off in a row and then go on a run of just doing a backstep instead for 10 times in a row. I really can't see what I'm doing differently to cause this. Tried watching the blade flash and movement and timing the press the same, but yeah, 60% of the time it works every time...

 

[Amatsubu]

I just attacked her, parried and sometimes dodged stuff, it's way more efficient and makes you prepared for later.

Dodging/sidestepping all the time in this game will make it very tedious and rather unfun later on because it'll get progressively less effective, especially with some of the bosses who might be close to Orphan of Kos difficulty (and he's actually considered harder than Friede by many).

Mikiri timing is very lenient but thrusts have different wind-up depending on enemy so you have to adjust your timing somewhat. It's still very forgiving but thrusts can actually be dodged effectively, unlike the majority of attacks in the game that are designed to be dealt with head on.

 

[Borsch]

some of the bosses who might be close to Orphan of Kos difficulty (and he's actually considered harder than Friede by many)

I've not played Bloodborne, but Friede was the hardest and the most cheating boss I have come across. She has beautiful art and animation, some of the best music in Dark Souls 3, but her teleporting, range spam and unblockables in the later phase are almost not fun. I love all of Sekiro bosses, they are all steeped in samurai ethics and never sink to her low levels

 

[strumpusplunket]

For me with Friede the bit that felt really unfair was how bugged out the camera could get in phase two because giant chair daddy was too huge. It was the easiest phase, but so annoying to die or even just to lose estus because you couldn't see what was happening (with Dark Flame still to come...)

Anyway... I killed the blue robed mini-boss! It took five straight tries before I got his parry timings down, but he goes down very quickly once you get a couple of deflects off. But boy is he fast! Are there actual bosses that fast still to come?

One thing that is now bugging me - I play using an UW 3440x1440 monitor. I noticed tonight when I loaded in that there are black bars at the sides like I had with DS3.

Now, I can't decide if it was like this the whole time (seems I should have noticed) and I was too engrossed in the game to notice, or if some settings have gone awry somewhere. Now I've seen the bars I can't unsee them and it's annoying me. Any other UW users confirm if the game works at UW res without bars? Or do I need to look for a fix?

 

[Amatsubu]

I've not played Bloodborne, but Friede was the hardest and the most cheating boss I have come across. She has beautiful art and animation, some of the best music in Dark Souls 3, but her teleporting, range spam and unblockables in the later phase are almost not fun. I love all of Sekiro bosses, they are all steeped in samurai ethics and never sink to her low levels

Well, I didn't finish DS3 because I couldn't get into after BB and Sekiro but from what I know Friede is basically a BB boss that landed in DS. Of course difficulty is a matter of opinion but there's a reason Orphan of Kos is widely regarded as the hardest Soulsborne boss, I legit beat Sword Saint in 8 tries without prosthetics or sugars but Orphan took me 30 And I didn't think SS was a pushover at all, I felt pretty on the edge and maybe lucked out the first playthrough.

I feel like Owl might be one of those closer to Orphan of Kos, it's been a while since I played both games and different combat systems as well.

Of course I don't count depth 5 and cursed chalice dungeon bosses in BB because they're too ridiculous to compare to any other soulsborne content, no thanks

Maybe I'll try DS3 again to see what's what.

Also, Sekiro bosses aren't steeped in samurai ethics,

Spoiler

Isshin calls himself Sword Saint but brings a ******* gun and halberd to a sword fight

 

[Borsch]

But boy is he fast! Are there actual bosses that fast still to come?

I can put you at ease, he is the only one and I did warn you haha :

the game mechanics' reaction speed is the same. There will be a samurai mini boss who will shock you with his sword speed, but he has a trick (and a cheese method). And he is the only one stand out speed wise (and his fight lasts 30 seconds. 30 seconds of pure adrenaline, either you die or he dies).

For ultrawide, have a look at this solution: https://www.nexusmods.com/sekiro/mods/240?tab=description Oh, another unrelated tip is to make sure that you play in offline mode (ingame, not steam) as online mode has stupid purple flowers with player messages littering the whole enviro.

Maybe I'll try DS3 again to see what's what.

I really enjoyed Dark Souls 3, having only played Sekiro prior. I did not find DS combat at all satisfying though until I learned that apart from hack'n'slash one not just can, but ought to kick shields, maneuver for backstabs and (in a crappy way) parry. Kicks in particular I had to hack a solution for as with default joypad control scheme they are near impossible to pull off consistently:

Initially I was put off by the overly mobile knights, but apparently that is quite realistic after all lol

Eventually I came to love the DS3 Knight character almost as much as Sekiro himself. Didn't even upgrade his armor to the end of the game.

Also, Sekiro bosses aren't steeped in samurai ethics,

Sengoku period samurai ethics allowed for guns, ganging up on a single enemy and even hitting him while he is on the ground. Teleportation was frowned upon and never used in battle.

Spoiler

However, I do agree that SS stretched it a bit by taking an semiauto glock to a 16th century fight

 

[Amatsubu]

Sengoku period samurai ethics allowed for guns, ganging up on a single enemy and even hitting him while he is on the ground. Teleportation was frowned upon and never used in battle.

Spoiler

However, I do agree that SS stretched it a bit by taking an semiauto glock to a 16th century fight

Spoiler

https://amp.reddit.com/r/Sekiro/comments/grqnyq/the_glock_saint/

Regarding DS3, I actually picked Knight as my char, I might go back and try the game again after I'm done with Hollow Knight.

 

[strumpusplunket]

I can put you at ease, he is the only one and I did warn you haha :

For ultrawide, have a look at this solution: https://www.nexusmods.com/sekiro/mods/240?tab=description Oh, another unrelated tip is to make sure that you play in offline mode (ingame, not steam) as online mode has stupid purple flowers with player messages littering the whole enviro.

I really enjoyed Dark Souls 3, having only played Sekiro prior. I did not find DS combat at all satisfying though until I learned that apart from hack'n'slash one not just can, but ought to kick shields, maneuver for backstabs and (in a crappy way) parry. Kicks in particular I had to hack a solution for as with default joypad control scheme they are near impossible to pull off consistently.
Eventually I came to love the DS3 Knight character almost as much as Sekiro himself. Didn't even upgrade his armor to the end of the game.

Ahh, I have only just put two and two together on that one! I am so glad it was him you were talking about and there's not someone even faster lurking about! Will check out that UW solution too, cheers.

It really is testament to how engrossed I am in the game that I never even noticed the black bars until about 12 hours in!

Good tip on the kick mechanic in DS btw. I could never kick except by accident so I just never used it.

Spoiler

https://amp.reddit.com/r/Sekiro/comments/grqnyq/the_glock_saint/

Regarding DS3, I actually picked Knight as my char, I might go back and try the game again after I'm done with Hollow Knight.

Yeah - DS3 knight crew assemble!

Anyway, got a bit of Sekiro playtime today, and blasted through some more mini-bosses and then it was Genchiro time.

Superb fight that one. One of my favourites in all of the From games. Fast, brutal, but also quite clearly fair and with an awesome balletic rhythm. I fell into the tempo quite well, and was only missing a few deflects at the start of combos most of the time. What was getting me was the mid-air hover and gattling bow move (well that and making myself jump the lightning). Got to the third phase on two of my first three attempts but with no estus left at all, and all thanks to being pincushioned by that one move! On my successful attempt I managed to deflect about half of the arrows, which was enough to let me get by without needing so much healing and my fourth run was pretty clean apart from that. I really felt my heart pounding as I saw the third phase posture bar go darker. So desperate not to screw it up at the last!

Absolutely amazing game so far, this. Can't believe I left it so long.

 

[Amatsubu]

Yeah, I knew you'd like the fight and the best thing is there are more great ones to look forward to, no kidding

Geni forces you to start using Sekiro's rhythm and the combat becomes soooo satisfying.

Man, I hope Bloodborne comes to PC, so many brilliant bosses in that game:/

 

[strumpusplunket]

One other thing about the Genchiro fight was that I did quite a few accidental double ichimonjis, as there must have been a fraction of a second when both mouse buttons were pressed as I transitioned from deflect to attack. The thing is, despite being accidental they pretty much all worked out well, and I think I'm right in saying it was a final ichimonji that brought up the third phase deathblow marker.

Found some harder fights already - that Snake Eyes pair can bloody do one! Thank god for Sekiro's indestructrible metal umbrella, or else I'd probably still be fighting them!

Is the umbrella the most OP prosthetic btw? It seems to block absolutely everything but sweeps, you can trutle behind it through big old combos (with super easy deflects if you spend emblems spinning it), and it lets you use projected force after blocking as well. Pretty much the only thing I spend my spirit emblems on except for the odd shuriken when needed. But before I needed to start blocking the Snake Eyes pair I'd really not used it much, which makes me wonder what other useful tools I might be overlooking.

(Very much agree re Bloodborne - the game I want to see come to PC more than any other)

 

[Amatsubu]

I want to replay Bloodborne in 60fps so much, there have been some new leaks apparently but hard to say if trustworthy.

Regarding the umbrella, I have no Idea TBH. I only started fooling around with prosthetics and most skills on later playthroughs, though it would seem the umbrella is pretty powerful against many bosses.

On my first playthrough I only used the axe when necessary and some shurikens and I somewhat regret it as the prosthetics and skills are fun.

 

[strumpusplunket]

So I played through last night and used firecrackers a bit too. They were very helpful against the big ghost monk, actually. Still got hit a lot in that fight, but the brief stuns were enough to get through it okay without dying.

I played up to the point where I don't think there's anywhere else to go other than over to that giant ape I can see wth its back to me near the last Sunken Valley idol.

Of course, I have heard the tortured whispers from other players about the dreaful ape. And it looks so intimidating!

 

[Borsch]

Is the umbrella the most OP prosthetic btw? It seems to block absolutely everything but sweeps, you can trutle behind it through big old combos (with super easy deflects if you spend emblems spinning it), and it lets you use projected force after blocking as well. Pretty much the only thing I spend my spirit emblems on except for the odd shuriken when needed. But before I needed to start blocking the Snake Eyes pair I'd really not used it much, which makes me wonder what other useful tools I might be overlooking.

Umbrella is a legitimate cheese strategy to almost any problem in the game, I think of it as a crutch to help players get through some tough spots where they would otherwise give up. In my case it was the Shichiman warrior on the first playthrough, I could not fathom facing him without my purple umbrella (I was weak ). It can be used to cheese the super fast samurai, the centipede warrior thing and so on. It even cancels Chained Ogre grab attacks I'd say use it in case of desperation, but just know that it is never essential. Snake Eyes's musket can be sidestepped for example . The crow feathers prosthetic is a similarly powerful crutch.

Of course, I have heard the tortured whispers from other players about the dreaful ape. And it looks so intimidating!

At this stage of your progression, the ape should absolutely be intimidated by Sekiro