poor guinea pigs
having a mix of refundable and non-refundable cans and bottles being available makes this whole program even more annoying
Shoppers 'to be charged 20p on plastic bottles & Metal Cans under return scheme
- Thread starter chaparral
- Start date
having a mix of refundable and non-refundable cans and bottles being available makes this whole program even more annoying
Soldato
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Online retailers are according to the scheme legislation only responsible for collecting items they have specifically sold. The vans holding deliveries cannot be easily used for collection so that will almost certainly require different vans and processes and it is likely that collection service companies will start up to do this.
It must be stressed to all of you pointing out the difficulties that the law may have been passed but the exact way that the retailers will operate the legislation is not yet fixed. There is an appointed "scheme administrator" who will be working with the retailers over what exactly will be required of them.
Given that has only just recently happened, and the large amount of questions that remain, you can bet that it won't launch on the planned date of July 2022.
It must be stressed to all of you pointing out the difficulties that the law may have been passed but the exact way that the retailers will operate the legislation is not yet fixed. There is an appointed "scheme administrator" who will be working with the retailers over what exactly will be required of them.
Given that has only just recently happened, and the large amount of questions that remain, you can bet that it won't launch on the planned date of July 2022.
Got used to this in Germany, it works great. Just chuck your cans/bottles into the machine at the supermarket and get a voucher to refund at the till.
Added bonus - you *never* have bottles or cans as litter, anywhere.
It works well mind because the recycling points are everywhere. I can't imagine this country managing to set up that sort of infrastructure.
Added bonus - you *never* have bottles or cans as litter, anywhere.
It works well mind because the recycling points are everywhere. I can't imagine this country managing to set up that sort of infrastructure.
Do you have to clean them first?
I actually put ours through the dishwasher and remove the label. But never know if you have to!
Do you have to clean them first?
I actually put ours through the dishwasher and remove the label. But never know if you have to!
I usually swill em out, you don't have to though.
People usually buy beers in crates at supermarkets. When you're done with em you just bring the crate back and slide the whole crate of empties into the machine and you're done.
Darwinism in action.
I haven't been to the super market where the majority of my shopping comes from in about 5/6 years! the council sends a convenient van fortnightly to take my can's and bottles for recycling, I just don't see how this legislation has been thought through by anyone involved
Indeed, if the expectation is people go to a covid infested supermarket especially when they dont normally go there, its very ill thought through, unless of course as I said earlier it is intended to be difficult and act as a stealth tax.
I doubt you could phrase it as a stealth tax, the retailer will need to ‘pocket’ all those 20p from non-returned items to pay for all the labour and infrastructure needed to run the scheme. They also need to to store and dispose of the returned items which isn’t free. I’d say they would be well out of pocket running this unless they moved to reusable bottles which are returned through the supply chain.
Because it actually works in other countries that use it? Even if it means people have to make occasional trips to the shop, it's surely still worthwhile if it increases the return rates of bottles and cans? Just for comparison sake:
https://www.recyclenow.com/what-to-... estimated that an,way into the recycling bin.
So that's what about 55%?
https://www.palpa.fi/beverage-container-recycling/deposit-refund-system/
And it isn't just Finland either, as I've seen people from Germany and Sweden saying similar things in this thread. Sure it's a little more inconvenient but if it produces results who cares?
The systems you compare to have been well established since before the internet grocery shopping revolution which isn't anything like as established in Germany as it is in the UK, introducing a scheme now that suits a retail experience that is dying makes no sense to me. I and increasingly thousands like me will be forced to make regular additional unnecessary polluting trips to a super market to do something I have done from the comfort of my own home for a couple of decades, how is this progress?
How many of those successful European implementations have been in circumstances where they replace or compete with an existing kerbside recycling scheme rather than going from no coordinated recycling scheme to a deposit scheme?
If 45% of our plastic bottles aren't getting recycled because people can't be arsed to use 2 bins that are already at their own house, 20p per bottle isn't going to change behaviour on a significant level.
As @redeye put it:
It's not even the money that motivates him to do it, it's the sense of social responsibility that exists there that doesn't exist here, seemingly.
If 45% of our plastic bottles aren't getting recycled because people can't be arsed to use 2 bins that are already at their own house, 20p per bottle isn't going to change behaviour on a significant level.
As @redeye put it:
I really don't give a monkeys if I spend 4 EUR more a month on plastic bottles or glasses if I don't take them back and trash them. But I try to be a good Germanand do my bit, since everyone else does.
It's not even the money that motivates him to do it, it's the sense of social responsibility that exists there that doesn't exist here, seemingly.
If you go to one of the public drop off bins with a bottle that has Pfand (i.e that is part of the deposit scheme and can be returned to a supermarket / shop), and someone sees you putting the wrong bottle in (on purpose or not) they will tell you. Not in a rude way, but if you do something wrong here someone will tell you.
If there are rules Germans generally obide by them, in fact they love rules (even if they don't make them easy to find, there is a rule for literally everything and paperwork for everything). But yes there is a sense of social responsibility here.
I get the point about existing curb-side collections in the UK. But if it starts to force the manufacturers away from single use bottles, then great. And for glass bottles- wine bottles don't have the deposit scheme so they go in the big bins (or some people get curb-side collections here), it's mainly the beer bottles that do have the deposit. And if you didn't know how much beer Germans drink, it's a LOT.
It seems to me like the traditional high street is dying but the chains such as Tesco etc are going to be around for a very long time yet. Granted, the UK has better home delivery services than Finland but even so, I would think most people would pass a shop at least once a month. Just take the bottles with you then?
I'm not so sure, when those 20p bottles get added up £5-10 off a shop is probably pretty appealing to a lot of people rather than just chucking the money into the bin. Many people I lived near on a council estate in the UK would just throw bottles onto the ground when they were done with them. If they were worth something, I doubt a lot of those same people would still throw it away. It was the same when recycling schemes started there, lots of people didn't bother until the council would only take 3 black bags and would occasionally go through the black bags to check for recyclable stuff. These sort of people need to be forced to do it, because the power of suggestion or education isn't enough for them.
You're relying on these same people deciding it's now worth carrying around an empty bottle to take it home later (which might be hours away), store it for a week or two and then take it back to the shop, all for another 20p back off their next shopping bill. I'll be amazed if they do it in significant numbers. To get a fiver back on your shopping you'll be needing to bring back 25 cans/bottles. The sort of person who can't even bring themselves to use a bin, isn't going to start carrying rubbish around because it's worth 20p.
These people need a much bigger incentive and preferably one that doesn't collaterally impact people who already recycle well.
That doesn’t mean the recycling doesn’t happen, it just means they process all your rubbish and recover recyclable material in the processing centre. Even if your provided separate bins, it will still go through a similar process.
There are pros and cons to doing this. It’s easier for the resident, just one bin for everything. There issues are that you’ll recover less good quality material, particularly paper because it’s contaminated with other waste.
Council’s have a legal obligation to recycle but there’s more than one way of doing it.
We dont use one bin for both, just get given bags instead.