Singapore Grand Prix 2011, Marina Bay Street Circuit - Race 14/19

Bifröst said:
The Hamilton and Massa incident was a bit unfortunate for both drivers, Massa had the inside line and would have cut off Hamilton anyways and Hamilton did have a bit of a run off area but he did lock up. Both drivers had to pit (hammy twice) so the penalty was fair although like the BBC team said, if Massa didn't have a punctured wheel then he possibly wouldn't of got a drive through. Still I found it amusing that Hamilton finished miles ahead of Massa even though (might be wrong) he went into the pitlane 5 times?
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The drive through was the only extra stop that Hamilton had (compared to Massa) I believe, and seeing as JB was far ahead of Alonso, that just shows today how much better the McLaren car was today compared to the Ferrari

How much time did Massa lose due to the puncture? Stupid move by Hamilton and he deserved the drive through imo, He didnt stand a chance of getting past there, and he ruined another drivers race un-necessarily

I dont think the rest of LH's drive was that good - he was gifted / let through for so many places hardly any (if any at all) were proper racing over-takes, most made it dead easy for him.

The safety car ruined any race that would have happened (or the rule not allowing those at the front to overtake the back markers), the lotus and sauber did a lot of stupid blocking at the restart while SV was bolting away , I seem to remember them not even trying to keep up with him to the "racing line" they were so bad)
 
CS||nuTs said:
I dont think there are many teams that would NOT take him, he is still one of the most exciting drivers in the field by a country mile. I think a lot of his problems on the track are more down to his lifestyle off the track. Sort that out and he would be back to his best in no time at all.
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What about his lifestyle off the track? Is he blending in with the wrong crowd or something?
 
What I mean though... is it his management company or has he got issues away from teh circuit, meddling with teh wrong crowd as in peers and letting something shift his focus in that kinda way?
 
CS||nuTs said:
I dont think there are many teams that would NOT take him, he is still one of the most exciting drivers in the field by a country mile. I think a lot of his problems on the track are more down to his lifestyle off the track. Sort that out and he would be back to his best in no time at all.
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I agree with you partly - but Lewis also needs to learn from his own mistakes, which he blatantly ISNT doing imo

Im all for measured and risky overtakes to keep the excitement up etc but so many times he doesnt actually need to do it in that particular area of the track (like today, he wasnt anywhere close to making it stick) - he keeps on forcing bad positions and getting penalties etc because of it .

Surely any team would be cautious taking him because of this (given his level of experience) - its like rookie mistake over and over with someone who has 4/5 years experience
 
smr said:
What I mean though... is it his management company or has he got issues away from teh circuit, meddling with teh wrong crowd as in peers and letting something shift his focus in that kinda way?
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Just things like moving to a PR company for his management; having the all those celebrities at his races - it just seems his F1 career has to be shared amongst all that rather than being the most important thing in his life if he wants further accolades (its a short lived career in most respects). Then its his general attitude/intelligence regards his conduct on track and the current friction with his McLaren contract. Hes a very talented bloke, but that doesnt mean hes the finished article...

You just dont hear the same about Vettel or even people like Alonso/Button and I very much doubt thats just down to the fact hes an English sportsman.

EDIT: Compare that to when he was under his Dads management and the worse he was doing off track was moving to another country or not joining Button in a charity triathlon (and that was just to avoid affecting his F1 season in anyway)...

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
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Another team would think twice about taking him for several reasons..
1. Price, he's far too expensive now the squeeze is on..
2. PR nightmare, am I black for example. I've seen it said quite a few times that as the first black f1 champ he should have been brilliant, but he was supposedly awkward and pretty useless as a champion. Next to his team mate who was said to have been exemplary it doesn't help his cause.
3. He wants to do less and less sponsor related activity - not a good idea!
4. He is a 100% product of McLaren and I doubt another team would bend over to accomodate him like they do. I seriously doubt he'd perform half as well elsewhere
5. The most important one, he's being beaten by his team mate in nearly every way including on track, a team mate who was written off as having no chance against him before now
 
Massa needs to get over his incidents with Hamilton. He's right to feel aggreived - Hamilton's mistake cost Massa positions and points today - but Hamilton served his penalty, and it was not a major issue. Someone loses their front wing on another car in every single race. I think Kobayashi has lost his front wing on someone in most races so far this year and no one has had fisticuffs with him yet. It's just bad luck that Massa's tyre deflated.

But based on Massa's comments and actions, especially after he accused Hamilton of holding a grudge, I think it's clear that Massa is currently holding the grudge and that he needs to drop it and move on

3dcandy said:
Another team would think twice about taking him for several reasons..
1. Price, he's far too expensive now the squeeze is on..
2. PR nightmare, am I black for example. I've seen it said quite a few times that as the first black f1 champ he should have been brilliant, but he was supposedly awkward and pretty useless as a champion. Next to his team mate who was said to have been exemplary it doesn't help his cause.
3. He wants to do less and less sponsor related activity - not a good idea!
4. He is a 100% product of McLaren and I doubt another team would bend over to accomodate him like they do. I seriously doubt he'd perform half as well elsewhere
5. The most important one, he's being beaten by his team mate in nearly every way including on track, a team mate who was written off as having no chance against him before now
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1/2/3. He's a PR dream come true. From what I understand he's the most valuable celebrity endorsement in Britain except for Becks. He brings huge sponsorship potential to the team as a result, and any team would love to have him on their books for that reason. His high pay check is because of his sponsorship and endorsement value which is played out in all of the PR days he has to do for McLaren. Less PR days obviously means a smaller pay cheque - that's something for negotiations
4. Why would this be a problem? All teams do their best to accomodate their drivers.
5. He's certainly not been impressive in the last 3-4 races, but Hamilton is still one of the best drivers out there. F1 fans always seem to have such short memories, but the second half of this season doesn't undo the fact that he's proven himself capable of beating any driver out there when he matched Alonso.
 
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CS||nuTs said:
I dont think there are many teams that would NOT take him, he is still one of the most exciting drivers in the field by a country mile. I think a lot of his problems on the track are more down to his lifestyle off the track. Sort that out and he would be back to his best in no time at all.
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And a car is that is not as good as the Red Bull.

What do you do at Red Bull, if you can tell me that is. :D
 
3dcandy said:
Another team would think twice about taking him for several reasons..
1. Price, he's far too expensive now the squeeze is on..
2. PR nightmare, am I black for example. I've seen it said quite a few times that as the first black f1 champ he should have been brilliant, but he was supposedly awkward and pretty useless as a champion. Next to his team mate who was said to have been exemplary it doesn't help his cause.
3. He wants to do less and less sponsor related activity - not a good idea!
4. He is a 100% product of McLaren and I doubt another team would bend over to accomodate him like they do. I seriously doubt he'd perform half as well elsewhere
5. The most important one, he's being beaten by his team mate in nearly every way including on track, a team mate who was written off as having no chance against him before now
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At the rate he's going Lewis ain't gonna be handling any kind of ambassadorial role in F1 when he retires is he!
 
smr said:
At the rate he's going Lewis ain't gonna be handling any kind of ambassadorial role in F1 when he retires is he!
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Why would he need to? Lewis could go to the US and have $24mil a year contract in a heart beat ;)
 
scaled.php


Not seen this before...

The cakes!!!! YUM :p
 
Damn it, I was going to stick a wad of money on Vettel winning the WDC.. But you can't bet on it anymore :p
 
Setroc said:
Massa needs to get over his incidents with Hamilton. He's right to feel aggreived - Hamilton's mistake cost Massa positions and points today - but Hamilton served his penalty, and it was not a major issue. Someone loses their front wing on another car in every single race. I think Kobayashi has lost his front wing on someone in most races so far this year and no one has had fisticuffs with him yet. It's just bad luck that Massa's tyre deflated.

But based on Massa's comments and actions, especially after he accused Hamilton of holding a grudge, I think it's clear that Massa is currently holding the grudge and that he needs to drop it and move on



1/2/3. He's a PR dream come true. From what I understand he's the most valuable celebrity endorsement in Britain except for Becks. He brings huge sponsorship potential to the team as a result, and any team would love to have him on their books for that reason. His high pay check is because of his sponsorship and endorsement value which is played out in all of the PR days he has to do for McLaren. Less PR days obviously means a smaller pay cheque - that's something for negotiations
4. Why would this be a problem? All teams do their best to accomodate their drivers.
5. He's certainly not been impressive in the last 3-4 races, but Hamilton is still one of the best drivers out there. F1 fans always seem to have such short memories, but the second half of this season doesn't undo the fact that he's proven himself capable of beating any driver out there when he matched Alonso.
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1,2,3 from what I understand, that's because of endorsements that end this year, most of which aren't going to be renewed and deals that were signed before the latest banking crisis hit shares etc. There is NO WAY he'll get the deals like that again. I also understand that most of the deals are based on the fact he's never lst to a team mate - the jury's out on that one but it's not looking great for him at moment...
4. Yes, but like I say, he's perceived as being difficult now. Would you risk taking on a volatile character who may upset the team, and especially as he's not performing well either?
5. The team was built around him, he was being touted as the next best thing, and a dream driver. He's hit more people and been in trouble with the stewards more than anyone else this season whilst his team mate has overtaken more than anyone else. Oh yes, Hamilton the best overtaker in F1...not on this years performance at all. You are judged relative to your team mate...

I'm pretty sure that at this rate Hamilton will only win 1 WDC. He'll do a Raikkonen and disappear to another formula and fail...however he may prove me wrong!
 
3dcandy said:
Oh yes, Hamilton the best overtaker in F1...not on this years performance at all. You are judged relative to your team mate...
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Button only has more overtakes because of Canada. And that was a pretty weird race.

I'm pretty sure that at this rate Hamilton will only win 1 WDC. He'll do a Raikkonen and disappear to another formula and fail...however he may prove me wrong!
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I think Lewis will win another WC. But he needs to get his head together first and get a car close enough to the sharp end to let him do it.

Even without the foolish mistakes he's made, he wouldn't be challenging Vettel for the Championship this year - those Red Bulls are just too fast.
 
Speculation on future endorsements is pointless, but what's obvious is that he's on the opposite end of the spectrum to "disaster" in the PR area.

All the top drivers are difficult. Look at the way Red Bull treated Vettel when Vettel smashed into the side of his team mate, or how Ferrari have treated Alonso.

5 is still just a case of short memories.
 
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