Soldato
- Joined
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Star Trek : Strange New Worlds
- Thread starter Kyo
- Start date
the way he said it came across like that... they were stronger because there were more of them... nothing to do with working together rainbow nonsense
Soldato
Thoroughly enjoyed the episode. I didn’t know a glob of phlem would turn into that…
Una needs some major attention though. For a No1 she is very poorly used imo. Didn’t detect any woke crap either, it was just a darker than usual episode.
Una needs some major attention though. For a No1 she is very poorly used imo. Didn’t detect any woke crap either, it was just a darker than usual episode.
Soldato
With everyone else this week felt like they'd just took Alien and stuck it on a Star Trek ship.
Soldato
- Joined
- 4 Feb 2018
- Posts
- 13,316
Just started to watch this so 3rd ep.
Have they got space covid? First they mentioned low vit D now they are going into lockdown.
I just want to know. Do they have enough PPE?
Have they got space covid? First they mentioned low vit D now they are going into lockdown.
I just want to know. Do they have enough PPE?
Soldato
Okay, so this thread is turning to **** then.
Meanwhile for any vaguely sensible person left on here - don't watch the preview for episode 10 unless you want it spoiled to hell and back.
Meanwhile for any vaguely sensible person left on here - don't watch the preview for episode 10 unless you want it spoiled to hell and back.
There's a monumental TOS reference/call forward/call back/call...wherever. And it'll either change some stuff...or we'll see just how much the SNW showrunners respect canon.
I wanted to like it!
Bugger, it seems this is the season finale.
Enjoyed it on the whole, look forward to next season.
When I seen where it was going I thought this could be interesting. But it just felt far too silly to me, at time it felt like I was watching fans cosplay the best of trek.
My opinion on this undoubtedly influenced by my fondness for the vastly superior episode it's based on.
Yet another representation of Kirk as some reckless, rule breaking, idiot, more in line with the spoofs than actual trek. Kirk (TOS) was actually a pretty serious, thoughtful commander. Balance of terror begin an excellent example of that!
How big is that Neutral zone, those ships were practically on top of each other!
My opinion on this undoubtedly influenced by my fondness for the vastly superior episode it's based on.
Yet another representation of Kirk as some reckless, rule breaking, idiot, more in line with the spoofs than actual trek. Kirk (TOS) was actually a pretty serious, thoughtful commander. Balance of terror begin an excellent example of that!
How big is that Neutral zone, those ships were practically on top of each other!
Bugger, it seems this is the season finale.
Enjoyed it on the whole, look forward to next season.
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Soldato
1x10 - A Quality of Mercy
Yeah. Everyone who watched the episode preview and thought "I bet I know how they're doing this", you were exactly right. Wibbly-wobbly, timey-wimey.
The Good
The Bad
The Kurtzman
Thoughts on the season, series
Oh, I got the answer to my question in this post - cliffhanger it is!
Memory-Alpha said:
Yeah. Everyone who watched the episode preview and thought "I bet I know how they're doing this", you were exactly right. Wibbly-wobbly, timey-wimey.
The Good
Anson Mount, obviously.
Loved that alternatefuturePike was wearing an outfit very reminiscent of the movie era.
I have a serious fondness for Wah Ming Chang's Romulan Bird of Prey (TOS)/Vas Hatham class (FASA)/Warbird, War Eagle, King Eagle (SFB) design, so any time it gets to be on-screen is good with me.
If you're going to riff on an Original Series episode then "Balance of Terror" is a good 'un to work from. Not just because submarine warfare IN SPAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCCCCEEEE but also because it was a story with genuine emotional weight. And they respected that emotional weight here.
Loved the nod to one of the dramatic TOS music cues when they got the look at the Romulan bridge. And the very TOS-esque camera push-ins for closeups on characters.
Anyone else squeal when they heard that Scottish burr talking to Spock as he worked on the phaser repairs? No? Just me? Okay then
VFX team had an exceptional week, even by their high standards. Including a whole lotta Romulan ship designs.
They clearly planted the seed for Spock's actions in "The Menagerie" here, what he owes the captain and why he'll risk a Federation death sentence to help him.
Loved that alternatefuturePike was wearing an outfit very reminiscent of the movie era.
I have a serious fondness for Wah Ming Chang's Romulan Bird of Prey (TOS)/Vas Hatham class (FASA)/Warbird, War Eagle, King Eagle (SFB) design, so any time it gets to be on-screen is good with me.
If you're going to riff on an Original Series episode then "Balance of Terror" is a good 'un to work from. Not just because submarine warfare IN SPAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCCCCEEEE but also because it was a story with genuine emotional weight. And they respected that emotional weight here.
Loved the nod to one of the dramatic TOS music cues when they got the look at the Romulan bridge. And the very TOS-esque camera push-ins for closeups on characters.
Anyone else squeal when they heard that Scottish burr talking to Spock as he worked on the phaser repairs? No? Just me? Okay then
VFX team had an exceptional week, even by their high standards. Including a whole lotta Romulan ship designs.
They clearly planted the seed for Spock's actions in "The Menagerie" here, what he owes the captain and why he'll risk a Federation death sentence to help him.
The Bad
As good as this guy was, they hugely missed a trick not casting the guy who played Sarek in STD as the Romulan commander. And if you don't understand what I mean, watch "Balance of Terror" and "Journey to Babel" back-to-back 
Ortegas really didn't work in the Stiles role from "Balance of Terror" here.
"Balance of Terror" showed us the Romulan PoV at several moments to hammer home the fact that the Romulan commander and Kirk were not so different. Neither wanted war, neither really wanted battle, both bound by duty and honour to fight each other. But this episode is all about Pike's PoV - he's the one who has gone forward to this glimpse of an alternate future. So why did we go get the Romulan PoV after Pike's cease fire offer to them?
This isn't a knock on Anson Mount, but very specifically on how Pike was written this week. Is this episode really asking us to believe that Pike would have made the wrong calls in the battle against the Romulan Bird of Prey and that only James Tiberius "I'm sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome I am" Kirk in the regular, prime timeline could have averted war? That seems...illogical. Mind, there's a few holes here. The major one being of course that this is the Pike from 2259 not a hypothetical Pike who's lived those 7 years between then and 2266 when this battle takes place. I guess my point is this particular version of the Kobayashi Maru was unfair even by Kobayashi Maru standards
Possibly not something that he can reveal, because timeline integrity, but presumably Pike does remember that the Romulans are related to the Vulcans after his look-forward? Kinda problematic, that.
I'm not going to completely write him off just on the basis of this episode, but Paul Wesley as James T. Kirk? Nuh uh. He doesn't really have it yet.
Ortegas really didn't work in the Stiles role from "Balance of Terror" here.
"Balance of Terror" showed us the Romulan PoV at several moments to hammer home the fact that the Romulan commander and Kirk were not so different. Neither wanted war, neither really wanted battle, both bound by duty and honour to fight each other. But this episode is all about Pike's PoV - he's the one who has gone forward to this glimpse of an alternate future. So why did we go get the Romulan PoV after Pike's cease fire offer to them?
This isn't a knock on Anson Mount, but very specifically on how Pike was written this week. Is this episode really asking us to believe that Pike would have made the wrong calls in the battle against the Romulan Bird of Prey and that only James Tiberius "I'm sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome I am" Kirk in the regular, prime timeline could have averted war? That seems...illogical. Mind, there's a few holes here. The major one being of course that this is the Pike from 2259 not a hypothetical Pike who's lived those 7 years between then and 2266 when this battle takes place. I guess my point is this particular version of the Kobayashi Maru was unfair even by Kobayashi Maru standards
Possibly not something that he can reveal, because timeline integrity, but presumably Pike does remember that the Romulans are related to the Vulcans after his look-forward? Kinda problematic, that.
I'm not going to completely write him off just on the basis of this episode, but Paul Wesley as James T. Kirk? Nuh uh. He doesn't really have it yet.
The Kurtzman
alternatefutureLa'an Noonien-Singh 
So, we've ripped off "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas", we've ripped off "Aliens", now we're ripping off elements from the Marvel Trek comics 'Early Voyages' series for the episode framing here. Splendid.
Lookit, continuity is great in a thing like Trek. But you're either all-in on it or you're not. In "Balance of Terror", Outpost 4 Commander Hansen was played by Gary Walberg - a white New Yorker, with hair. Here, it's Commander Hansen Al-Salah played by Ali Hassan - a bald Canadian of Indian descent. The bride in "Balance of Terror" - played by Barbara Baldavin, a white woman. The bride here - played by Megha Sandhu, again Canadian by way of India. Does it matter? In isolation, no. Same as with Robert April's race lift from earlier episodes, or a transporter chief named Kyle being a dark-haired South Korean instead of a fair-haired Yorkshireman. But as a pattern of behaviour by the showrunners it matters a great deal. At a certain point you've got to do more to respect canon than just keeping the same names for people and things, and I think we passed that point several light years back.
So, we've ripped off "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas", we've ripped off "Aliens", now we're ripping off elements from the Marvel Trek comics 'Early Voyages' series for the episode framing here. Splendid.
Lookit, continuity is great in a thing like Trek. But you're either all-in on it or you're not. In "Balance of Terror", Outpost 4 Commander Hansen was played by Gary Walberg - a white New Yorker, with hair. Here, it's Commander Hansen Al-Salah played by Ali Hassan - a bald Canadian of Indian descent. The bride in "Balance of Terror" - played by Barbara Baldavin, a white woman. The bride here - played by Megha Sandhu, again Canadian by way of India. Does it matter? In isolation, no. Same as with Robert April's race lift from earlier episodes, or a transporter chief named Kyle being a dark-haired South Korean instead of a fair-haired Yorkshireman. But as a pattern of behaviour by the showrunners it matters a great deal. At a certain point you've got to do more to respect canon than just keeping the same names for people and things, and I think we passed that point several light years back.
Thoughts on the season, series
SNW S1 got a bunch of stuff right. Some stuff missed the mark. And there was stuff that made you think 'God damnit Kurtzman...'.
First, the bad.
La'an Noonien-Singh Nothing majorly wrong with the actress - Christina Chong rated a 'mostly half-decent' for me, which is about my bar for modern Trek acting. She had to have a tragic backstory, because everyone in modern Trek has to have one of those (even Pike, though he at least was able to snark and make light of it in this season finale). And okay, I've made my peace with that. But why did she have to be a descendant of Khan? What did that do for her, storywise? Answer - nothing. It's barely brought up. All it does is introduce a plot hole for "Space Seed", when you'd think Spock would point out that he once worked alongside a descendant of the guy they'd just thawed out. Utterly pointless. And all they had to do was pick a different name...
The STD/JJTrek aesthetic. It's horrendous enough inside - eye care must be a big thing for the team in sickbay, because damn. All those bright lights and reflective surfaces everywhere. There's no way in hell I could ever work on that ship, not with my photophobia. I'd have a permanent migraine. But then we get to the outside, where the ship is now so much larger than in TOS. And a different colour.
And a different shape.
*Spock eyebrow*
At this point we have to call the series a soft reboot of the whole Original Series era really, even extending to the original films - too much has changed that simply can't be rationalised or explained away in-universe. And in a franchise that until quite recently had managed to show a couple of centuries worth of visual continuity without screwing things up too much. Disappointing.
I dislike the uniforms. I hate that they killed Hemmer off, and that Rebecca Romijn's Una/'Number One' had pretty much bugger all to do for vast swathes of these ten episodes. I rolled my eyes clean off their mountings at the 'M'Benga's daughter' storyline with all the issues that it had. We saw far too much of T'Pring, as good as Gia Sandhu was.
So what did I like?
Anson Mount. Most of the cast did a good enough job, but he is genuinely very good indeed as Pike. A welcome return to form for Starfleet captains. And speaking of welcome returns - standalone episodes rather than an arc with MCU-level stakes. Praise be to $DEITY. Loved the little nods to TOS. Subtle stuff like familiar sound effects, or props (like the communicators and tricorders). But also stories that gave off TOS vibes without necessarily being wholesale re-treading of old ground.
Overall I think they pitched it pretty well in terms of tone. Yeah, it occasionally veered into territory that was a bit melodramatic. But whatever it was doing in the main didn't feel too forced. Humour is a big one for this - it can be natural and free-flowing as in the 4th film, or it can end up horribly out of place like it did at points in the 5th one. Here, with precious few exceptions, it all felt pretty natural. The dialogue, with some notable exceptions, was orders of magnitude better than you'd get in your average STD episode.
And the usual stuff that modern Trek has actually been doing fairly well even when everything else was in the toilet. Fantastic visual effects. Great music cues. The makeup for the various alien races. The set design, outside of previously-mentioned gripes.
What do I need to see going forward?
Longer seasons wouldn't go amiss. Rather less of the Gorn. Rather more of Una, assuming that the character isn't on her way out with her arrest at the end of S1. And if they can keep the quality high, if they can resist the temptation to fall back into The Bad Place™ that much of Kurtzman Trek inhabits, they'll have a real winner.
But yeah. On the whole, a promising start.
First, the bad.
La'an Noonien-Singh
Nothing majorly wrong with the actress - Christina Chong rated a 'mostly half-decent' for me, which is about my bar for modern Trek acting. She had to have a tragic backstory, because everyone in modern Trek has to have one of those (even Pike, though he at least was able to snark and make light of it in this season finale). And okay, I've made my peace with that. But why did she have to be a descendant of Khan? What did that do for her, storywise? Answer - nothing. It's barely brought up. All it does is introduce a plot hole for "Space Seed", when you'd think Spock would point out that he once worked alongside a descendant of the guy they'd just thawed out. Utterly pointless. And all they had to do was pick a different name...The STD/JJTrek aesthetic. It's horrendous enough inside - eye care must be a big thing for the team in sickbay, because damn. All those bright lights and reflective surfaces everywhere. There's no way in hell I could ever work on that ship, not with my photophobia. I'd have a permanent migraine. But then we get to the outside, where the ship is now so much larger than in TOS. And a different colour.
And a different shape.
*Spock eyebrow*
At this point we have to call the series a soft reboot of the whole Original Series era really, even extending to the original films - too much has changed that simply can't be rationalised or explained away in-universe. And in a franchise that until quite recently had managed to show a couple of centuries worth of visual continuity without screwing things up too much. Disappointing.
I dislike the uniforms. I hate that they killed Hemmer off, and that Rebecca Romijn's Una/'Number One' had pretty much bugger all to do for vast swathes of these ten episodes. I rolled my eyes clean off their mountings at the 'M'Benga's daughter' storyline with all the issues that it had. We saw far too much of T'Pring, as good as Gia Sandhu was.
So what did I like?
Anson Mount. Most of the cast did a good enough job, but he is genuinely very good indeed as Pike. A welcome return to form for Starfleet captains. And speaking of welcome returns - standalone episodes rather than an arc with MCU-level stakes. Praise be to $DEITY. Loved the little nods to TOS. Subtle stuff like familiar sound effects, or props (like the communicators and tricorders). But also stories that gave off TOS vibes without necessarily being wholesale re-treading of old ground.
Overall I think they pitched it pretty well in terms of tone. Yeah, it occasionally veered into territory that was a bit melodramatic. But whatever it was doing in the main didn't feel too forced. Humour is a big one for this - it can be natural and free-flowing as in the 4th film, or it can end up horribly out of place like it did at points in the 5th one. Here, with precious few exceptions, it all felt pretty natural. The dialogue, with some notable exceptions, was orders of magnitude better than you'd get in your average STD episode.
And the usual stuff that modern Trek has actually been doing fairly well even when everything else was in the toilet. Fantastic visual effects. Great music cues. The makeup for the various alien races. The set design, outside of previously-mentioned gripes.
What do I need to see going forward?
Longer seasons wouldn't go amiss. Rather less of the Gorn. Rather more of Una, assuming that the character isn't on her way out with her arrest at the end of S1. And if they can keep the quality high, if they can resist the temptation to fall back into The Bad Place™ that much of Kurtzman Trek inhabits, they'll have a real winner.
But yeah. On the whole, a promising start.
Oh, I got the answer to my question in this post - cliffhanger it is!
Soldato
About half way through the final episode and so far I have not found myself skipping large parts. I'll finish it tonight but feels like the strongest episode so far.
Soldato
I’m on tablet so can’t type for crap atm. Just finished that episode and hugely enjoyed it.
JRS’s comment about ‘Seed’ is great and it never even hit me during my watch. Feel sad that such a quality show is now over for a unforeseen time. I always looked forwards to running home after work on Thursdays just to see that marvellous head of hair.
JRS’s comment about ‘Seed’ is great and it never even hit me during my watch. Feel sad that such a quality show is now over for a unforeseen time. I always looked forwards to running home after work on Thursdays just to see that marvellous head of hair.
Soldato
They need longer seasons. Ten episodes is too short for a show like this. Don't need to go the full old school American network TV with 25, but 13-14 would be nice.
Soldato
Yet there were still loads of filler episodes. I think there would just be more dilute story lines and even more filler if there were more. 2nd half of this episode is disappointing so far.
Soldato
We-e-e-ell...they weren't filler the same way that a serialised show might have. The episodes are standalone. A show like STD, if they throw any episode in that doesn't advance The All-Hallowed Story Arc™ then it feels like padding. A show like SNW, you don't have that problem. What you do have is some good episodes and some less good episodes.
This episode, IMO, was good. It only rarely irritated me, which for an hour of modern Trek is some kind of miracle
Soldato
The mere fact I watched the whole episode without skipping was a good sign. They need to be rid of the insubordinate lesbian though. She is just annoying but was supposed to be "cute"
Soldato
To be (briefly) fair to Ortegas, this time out they didn't have her playing her.
They basically handed her character the role of playing Lt. Stiles from "Balance of Terror" in this, right down to the mistrust of Spock following the Romulan visual reveal.