Star Wars VIII : The Last Jedi [WARNING: SPOILERS]

VincentHanna · 6 Jan 2018 at 01:47

aardvark said:
star wars has always been a very limited universe and this film just limited it much more - i think the whole franchise is bankrupt of content, its impossible to be new/fresh in this universe it seems.

It had loads of new/fresh content and many people hated it

Kyo · 6 Jan 2018 at 09:41

VincentHanna said:
It had loads of new/fresh content and many people hated it

New content is one thing but this movie goes completely off direction which in many parts isnt Star Wars, some really flimsy ideas and very questionable decisions. This movie has managed to annihilate the last 30 years of Star Wars mythos in a single sitting. Sorry for me Rian Johnson is in the category of Scott Buck. SW it was not.

dannyjo22 · 6 Jan 2018 at 10:08

Combat Fighter said:
The followers of Ashla.

Links to canon please.

I can find only one reference to my mind and it’s in Star Wars rebels and so flimsy it could mean anything. When Kanan meets Bendu.

TallPaul1878 · 6 Jan 2018 at 10:16

Let's not pretend Disney are doing anything else with the Star Wars franchise beyond scrubbing as much of the previous story away so as to leave them with a clean slate to create their own stories.

Star Wars fans need to accept that nothing is canon now. Disney are turning Star Wars into another generic space sci-fi series. It could be The Chronicles of Riddick or Star Trek, the only thing that identifies the new direction as Star Wars are the light sabres and X Wings.

I would assume that Chewy and the droids will be kept on for some comic relief.

TallPaul1878 · 6 Jan 2018 at 10:19

dannyjo22 said:
Links to canon please.

I can find only one reference to my mind and it’s in Star Wars rebels and so flimsy it could mean anything. When Kanan meets Bendu.

Star Wars canon is being scrubbed away. I actually enjoyed watching Rebels with my kids. Don't expect ANYTHING in future to have anything to do with the original movies.

VincentHanna · 6 Jan 2018 at 10:33

Rebels is still canon AFAIK

It was all the books that aren't.

PlacidCasual · 6 Jan 2018 at 10:41

Rebels is excellent and shows you can add compelling new characters and stories to Star Wars.

Kyo · 6 Jan 2018 at 11:35

PlacidCasual said:
Rebels is excellent and shows you can add compelling new characters and stories to Star Wars.

They could have picked anything the 40 years from the lore, books and it would be miles bette, more authentic but as Hollywood has proven time and again (not always but more often than not) it becomes a pile of steaming nonsense when they mess, digress and move away from the source material.

v0n · 6 Jan 2018 at 13:47

They had to get rid of EU, because logistically, picking anything from EU would be intellectual property nightmare, Luke's wife from one author, Chewie's kids from another, Leia's kids from three or four different ones, then you have to deal with ubergeeks spoiling the plot all over the net and/or rising alarms that some part of the plot doesn't adhere to volume 16 of some obscure graphic novel somewhere. Obviously using EU would produce better plot than (points widely at the poster of TLJ) whatever this... is, but then again, who could predict that people writing billion dollar franchise for Disney would do so as a kids carpet play script - "and then Luke comes out of the cave and Kylo is like 'all the lasers on that man, fire', pew, pew, wakka, wakka, oh my god, he's still standing there 'nooooooooo' " - that kind of thing - and the lady that supervises them (Kennedy?) doesn't seem to have a clue what this "war of stars" thing is meant to be, but her "daily tips for the producers" fax in the morning says "include popular social topics: hackers, digital coin gambling, chauvinists, gay community leaders, animal well fare rights (check), if in doubt, turn everything to eleven (check)".

Shamikebab · 6 Jan 2018 at 14:03

Surely IP wasn't owned by the authors?

I agree that EU had to be discarded though for a number of reasons. One a lot of it sucked, two what is good in a book isn't always good in a film. As soon as they changed anything people would whine. and yeah the other reasons you gave.

Steampunk · 6 Jan 2018 at 14:16

I think the core of the problem is that like a lot of directors, Johnson didn't want to do someone else's work. He had JJ/Kasdan TFA before his movie, the Kasdan/Treverrow TLJ script already done, but he wanted to do his own thing, make his own name, and Disney were dumb enough to let him throw out what went before.

It's like he said "oh, don't want to do the Snoke storyline, kill him off, don't want to deal with Rey's manifest destiny story, bin that, don't want to do Luke as a messianic figure, throw that away, don't want to do Finn mortally injured, make him recover with no ill-effects in the first five minutes. Guardians of the Galaxy crossed with the new Ghostbusters? Michael Bay style with a Star Wars theme? Children's toys and merchandising? That's the way to go!"

Five.Stars · 6 Jan 2018 at 18:29

b0rn2sk8 said:
Are you sure about that? This isnt the old Jedi Order with a highly disciplined training programme. That was ALL destroyed in Ep3 and all the Jedi were killed. Kylo clearly isn't anything like as skilled as the likes of Qui Gon, Obi One, Yoda, Darth Maul or even Anakin. He is also very arrogant which is a huge weakness.

The person Kylo was learning from was Luke, who lets face it had 20 mins with Yoda and went off to fight what was left of Anakin/Vader after Obi One gave him a good slapping in Ep3. Luke is far from a Jedi Master, he is strong with the force but not a Master by any stretch of the imagination. That takes decades of disciplined training and mentoring from the Jedi Order which doesn't exist anymore. The fact Kylo wasn't very disciplined or even that good was shown in TFA and TLJ.

Luke was back to finding his own way through the force and attempting to re-build what was lost but he failed.

Yet he stopped a laser blast in mid-air, something none of the above performed, so it is established pretty much from the first scene in TFA that he is extremely powerful.

VincentHanna · 6 Jan 2018 at 18:31

Vader absorbed them with his hands, so maybe stopping one in mid air isn't so amazing

Five.Stars · 6 Jan 2018 at 18:38

Whether it was "amazing" or not, it showed a level of knowledge of the force that could only be gained by some form of training, if we are to follow the rules set forth in the previous 6 movies and all the other canon material released subsequently.

VincentHanna · 6 Jan 2018 at 18:41

Remember when like force pulled his lightsaber from the snow?

No training.

Moothead2 · 6 Jan 2018 at 19:23

Except he was taught the basics by Obi Wan and then had a year to continue training himself...

Dem2k · 6 Jan 2018 at 19:24

JediFragger said:
Tbf she closed her eyes first to 'let the Force in'

VincentHanna said:
Remember when like force pulled his lightsaber from the snow?

No training.

That's true, Though he was put in a situation where if he didn't he would have died, his face also looked beaten up and he would have died from hypothermia if not for Han.

Think it's instinctual in us that heroes characters that struggle and are shown to be vulnerable/human yet overcome the odds develop into more interesting characters and appear more heroic.

Fubsy · 6 Jan 2018 at 19:24

VincentHanna said:
Remember when like force pulled his lightsaber from the snow?

No training.

He had some form of guidance from ghost Obi-Wan though.

Shamikebab · 6 Jan 2018 at 19:25

If it requires training then how do you train yourself?

Yoda even says it is just about belief.

Begbie · 6 Jan 2018 at 19:47

Shamikebab said:
If it requires training then how do you train yourself?

Yoda even says it is just about belief.

It's been a while since I read it, but didn't Darth Bane show some powers before any training?