Supplements the debate/discussion thread

neoboy said:
Just to revive this a little bit, anyone has any experience with collagen protein? Hear all kinds of magical stories of joints feeling much better and decent body of evidence on examine.com.

Decent price on MyProtein so half a scoop a day can't to hurt to supplement my supplement of protein :p
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Wait, you mean protein that you digest into the base amino acids? Eat some meat :p
 
drunkenmaster said:
Modern diets are crap, but I couldn't care less, most people who workout or want to eat healthily will do so and people who don't do either won't be using supplements.

The main situation for using supplements, if thats what you want to call them, is losing weight. Because its the one situation where you are eating less food than normal, but want the body to work harder to burn fat, logically the two things simply don't gel together. You can't ask your body to work harder while eating less.

For putting on weight, protein's more than fine, largely because whey is a very very cheap and easy source to get protein from.

But for me, I don't really care what most people want to label these things as. If you want vit e , you can eat it in several foods, or take a pill, its the same damn stuff, and if you need it you need it, its just food packaged differently.

I don't supplement with protein, I need protein, its that simple, I choose for the sake of simplicity and budget, and I actually really like the shakes I make, to have whey protein, rather than burgers, its just food.

EAA's and other things are, for me, a joke, the cost for those substances aren't in the weight, but in the separation. in a 30gram scoop of protein which costs maybe 10-30p, you get more in weight of the EAA's than in a £0.50-1 serving of EAA's from any other source. In other words, throw in an extra 10grams of protein for far cheaper and get the same amount of extra EAA's.

Splitting products up just to get marginally higher percentages of a substance at a higher cost than just having more to start with, makes no sense. Its like chia seed vs Salba a supposedly marginally better "brand" of Chia seed. Its not magically better, if you eat 15grams of Salba, you'd want 16.5grams of generic Chia seed to get the same benefit. yet 15grams of Salba will cost 5 times the amount of 16.5grams of Chia seed anyway, its worthless.


If your diet is poor so called "supplements" will do nothing. If you are trying to get to your peak, certain things to make sure you aren't lacking in can help, but if putting on weight, you're likely eating more food than normal and already a higher intake of nutrients and vitamins anyway. Again I go back to the one real situation to make sure you aren't lacking nutrients, is losing weight when you're taking in less food than normal.
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What is a "modern diet"? - I thought that a modern diet was, short of not eating grain from grass, and berries from bushes, whatever else you care to make it. I`m not sure that eating excessive amounts of protein is the safe way for gaining weight, losing bone mass and blowing your kidneys quite possibly. To gain weight simply increase the intake by way of a balanced diet. What`s so wrong with that? Vitamins from food is not the same as taking a pill, the co-factors are required for normal absorption and utilization purposes, the supplements would require to be in their natural form, and also time released, a specific time as well. This is not all, but it`s some of it. Shall we go on?
 
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That is not me, it`s Drunkermaster! I engage with those supplements which current research suggests to perhaps being of some benefit over and above a normal healthy diet. Cancer Research UK is currently examining the potential benefits of taking additional quantities of antioxidants in fending off given forms of cancer. I have not been waiting around countless decades for this research to be completed, I have considered it to be worth my while investing in the main players from the start. As I said though, I adjust my position as research adjusts its own. I am currently sixty three years of age and my main hobby is in the training for new world record attempts. They are published to Youtube.
 
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Meal replacement shakes are the healthiest answer to under eating. Solgar are an excellent company, so to, Pharma Nord. You might also well require a comprehensive bone supplement, for you wont get much for your bones in a multi, and unless your fruit and vegetable intake is at least reasonable, a balanced antioxidant supplement too. Again here, there would not be much in a multi. High potency multi`s can do more harm than good, you want one that offers up to only twice the RDA`s
 
koolpc said:
I dont eat fruit or veg. Diet is awful. Eat rubbish due to low earnings.

Looking at getting an electric pressure cooker and then finding cheap veg / meat etc and make stews etc etc.
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Don't spend money on multivits if you can't afford to get fruit and veg.

Most supermarkets will do their knobbly section (50p bags of carrots, 60p cabbage, etc.) that will be substantially cheaper than tablets and pressure cookers.

You are storing up gut and other problems if you don't.
 
Yeah I'm basically on a dirt poor student diet at the moment, but hitting all my macros and vitamin/mineral targets well over the requirements.

As tempting as frozen Tesco lasagnes are at 65p, it's not that hard to eat better for not much more, frozen fruit and veg are a life saver right now.

Can post my typical day of eating and all the macros from Cronometer if you like.
 
neoboy said:
Yeah I'm basically on a dirt poor student diet at the moment, but hitting all my macros and vitamin/mineral targets well over the requirements.

As tempting as frozen Tesco lasagnes are at 65p, it's not that hard to eat better for not much more, frozen fruit and veg are a life saver right now.

Can post my typical day of eating and all the macros from Cronometer if you like.
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Sure thing... will it include all the typical Wednesday/Friday cheeky ones, too? ;)
 
mrthingyx said:
Don't spend money on multivits if you can't afford to get fruit and veg.

Most supermarkets will do their knobbly section (50p bags of carrots, 60p cabbage, etc.) that will be substantially cheaper than tablets and pressure cookers.

You are storing up gut and other problems if you don't.
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I got no cooker or hob in bedsit so pressure cooker looks like a good alternative.
 
Good blender might help in that situation as takes up very little space, what about access to a microwave? How is the fridge space for batch cooking?
 
Kates David said:
What is a "modern diet"? - I thought that a modern diet was, short of not eating grain from grass, and berries from bushes, whatever else you care to make it. I`m not sure that eating excessive amounts of protein is the safe way for gaining weight, losing bone mass and blowing your kidneys quite possibly. To gain weight simply increase the intake by way of a balanced diet. What`s so wrong with that? Vitamins from food is not the same as taking a pill, the co-factors are required for normal absorption and utilization purposes, the supplements would require to be in their natural form, and also time released, a specific time as well. This is not all, but it`s some of it. Shall we go on?
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I have exactly no idea why you quoted me because afaik I haven't posted in this thread for multiple years so that is way old but, asking if we shall go on with your frankly rather insane points. You've ignored almost everything you've quoted and brought up things I didn't remotely recommend all while entirely ignoring the central point of the post so, no, you really shouldn't go on.

Just for the record, no where in that post did I recommend consuming excessive amounts of protein to gain weight. As for a modern food that the majority eat, not exactly difficult to understand I was referring to the likes of premade meals with good fats removed and loaded up with sugar and salt, poor quality proteins and generally not being particularly fresh. Shedloads of preservatives in half of everything you don't strictly make for yourself, etc. Most people eat badly, most people who work out and want to be healthy will generally eat healthier anyway. By quoting me literally years out of context, I presume I was replying to someone who thought supplements were 'bad' and that just eating good food is all you need to do.

Supplements are food, nothing more or less, food is anything your body consumes to maintain life and growth, if you eat a portion of chicken or a whey shake with some lets say flax seed added or whatever else, your body can utilise that for multiple things from burning for energy to growing muscle. If you choose to eat more chicken or you choose to have more protein shakes makes no fundamental difference. It's just food in different packaging, the same way eggs and beans give you a different combination of vitamins, minerals, proteins, etc.
 
I have decided to dump Protein shakes in favour of skyr. 85p from Lidl plus some milk and your choice of fruit, honey or something. Taste a millions times better than any shake ever has. 0 fat. 10g sugar, 40g protein.

Almost means I can just go to the shops when I run out instead of waiting for delivery.
Makes for a filling breakfast without feeling like I've eaten a brick and I feel better for it.
 
ChroniC said:
I have decided to dump Protein shakes in favour of skyr. 85p from Lidl plus some milk and your choice of fruit, honey or something. Taste a millions times better than any shake ever has. 0 fat. 10g sugar, 40g protein.

Almost means I can just go to the shops when I run out instead of waiting for delivery.
Makes for a filling breakfast without feeling like I've eaten a brick and I feel better for it.
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It is much better... Until you realise you're lactose intolerant. :eek::o
 
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