Although I'm not doing any strength stuff at the moment, I'll hit 250kg some day!!!
*** The 2010 Gym Rats Thread ***
- Thread starter Freefaller
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That ratio between bench and deadlifts look about right to me.
Don't worry about benching big numbers - just keep training. It'll come in time.
What's wrong with a full body workout?!
Furthermore, one you can stick to and challenges you!
Crunchman, understood, no worries - I do that often myself!
Crunchman, understood, no worries - I do that often myself!
That's pretty much what I remember SL 5x5 being.
Personally I add a few more movements, or a "fun" day. However, for a good starting program it's a good one if followed well and worked hard at.
Personally I add a few more movements, or a "fun" day. However, for a good starting program it's a good one if followed well and worked hard at.
I've done a week's worth of HST @ 15 reps at the moment - it's quite taxing, but I'm struggling to get the "right" weights all the time.
Squats I've currently got at 100kg but I reckon a bit more weight is needed as 15 reps isn;t too taxing, even the second set. So maybe 110?
Bench I've got at 75kg - but that's quite tough as I haven't done benching in over 6 months.
Etc...
BORs and all other exercises I've gone too light just in case - week 2, I'll add some weight on to make it a bit more challenging. You never really take into consideration you're ability until you start measuring it like this. I'm more used to doing the 6-8 rep range, so 15 has thrown me out a little!
The only thing that is a struggle is the 2nd set of chins - technique starts to get messy!
Squats I've currently got at 100kg but I reckon a bit more weight is needed as 15 reps isn;t too taxing, even the second set. So maybe 110?
Bench I've got at 75kg - but that's quite tough as I haven't done benching in over 6 months.
Etc...
BORs and all other exercises I've gone too light just in case - week 2, I'll add some weight on to make it a bit more challenging. You never really take into consideration you're ability until you start measuring it like this. I'm more used to doing the 6-8 rep range, so 15 has thrown me out a little!
The only thing that is a struggle is the 2nd set of chins - technique starts to get messy!
Powercleans won't work your back out in the same way BORs will though. However, I do love them, they are a very good exercise. I'd add them on a separate day or as a warm up, or additional exercise. I like adding in Dips and Chins personally.
I agree with the idea of 1 day on 1 day off. And certainly doing a day of skipping or some body conditioning sessions in between.
I agree with the idea of 1 day on 1 day off. And certainly doing a day of skipping or some body conditioning sessions in between.
The thing about inverted rows is, that unless you have a weight vest it gets easy too quickly.
Can't you bring the bar up from some hooks on a power rack so as to not need to deadlift them? Personally I get a lot of feel from BORs along with chins for my back - but then I add in some t-bar rows for a really big stretch (this is not on the 5x5 program but in general work out).
I'd work on your technique as I think BORs are really under utilised - but maybe think about some t-bar rows? That heavy pulling action is wonderful for the back development.
Powercleans, are awesome, but, not a back specific exercise - if you want that thickness a good rowing movement is key.
The back is a big muscle group and can take a lot of punishment, like legs. However it goes against the 5x5 program a little, though maybe add it as a "bonus" day, or, just do it and see how you go?
Sure, powercleans AND inverted rows are fine, but as I said, I find inverted rows less challenging without adding some weight to myself.
So personally I wouldn't do inverted rows and choose to do chins or t-bars instead.
You have to tailor it to you, and if it doesn't work, change it again - training is so very dynamic, there's no right or wrong answer.
Can't you bring the bar up from some hooks on a power rack so as to not need to deadlift them? Personally I get a lot of feel from BORs along with chins for my back - but then I add in some t-bar rows for a really big stretch (this is not on the 5x5 program but in general work out
).I'd work on your technique as I think BORs are really under utilised - but maybe think about some t-bar rows? That heavy pulling action is wonderful for the back development.
Powercleans, are awesome, but, not a back specific exercise - if you want that thickness a good rowing movement is key.
The back is a big muscle group and can take a lot of punishment, like legs. However it goes against the 5x5 program a little, though maybe add it as a "bonus" day, or, just do it and see how you go?
Sure, powercleans AND inverted rows are fine, but as I said, I find inverted rows less challenging without adding some weight to myself.
So personally I wouldn't do inverted rows and choose to do chins or t-bars instead.
You have to tailor it to you, and if it doesn't work, change it again - training is so very dynamic, there's no right or wrong answer.
If its week 1 you're at around 80% 15 rep max so it isnt meant to be too taxing (well, not to failure anyways). I'd keep upping it 2.5kg/side to see if you can hit 120 for 15reps just as a rough guess by end of week 2 for 100% 15 rep max.
Also, 120kg for 15 rep max makes me cry. I think I could possibly have that for 5 reps
Also I've just joined bodybuilding.com (mainly for hilarious threads). Watch my post maturity/quality go downhill from here.
I've been at this for a while thought dude
Don't compare yourself to me - aim to better yourself - that's all you can do! Yeah I think I will keep adding some weights until I feel it taxing - you're right it should be 80% on week 1, so it's probably ok that I've been going light.
120kg @15 for squats should be more than achievable.
My program that I've devised is a killer though, when it gets to the 5 reps it's going to be heeeeaevvvvvy! Can't wait!
I challenge you to 130 then
Haha! Hmm as long as I can do them over a minute - sure!
Similar movement yes, but I wouldn't call it the same.
I prefer mixing back with triceps, and I think day 2 is a little bit too much for that day. Why not add a 4th day?
Yeah you could - but BORs hit the core a bit more IMO. However, as long as you nail the t-bar row technique you should be getting the same out out it. Make sure you use 15kg plates as it will give you a bigger ROM. The body position should be fairly similar to BORs anyway.
Cheers for the reply. I could add a 4th day and keep it rolling again, the only reason that I didn't is I'm tending to keep to 3 days in the gym per week with running on Mondays and Fridays so the way it works out there I'm not destroying my legs immediately before a running day - doesn't matter hugely though as I can always plod round the course whatever I've done in the gym. If you've got a better layout of the plan then I'm always open to advice.
There's now a new Smith machine in the gym which needs some sort of fettling as it sounds like sharpening knives when you use it, they've removed the weights stand that was a substitute for a squat rack and the cable crossovers machine is broken again but the new one hasn't arrived yet. Everything's obviously getting better there but we've just received a silly little triceps bar so it's all ok...
Not related to this topic at all but there appears to be a rather attractive French girl at your parent's place, why did this never happen when we lived together?
Yeah Sandra's rather cute, only 17 though - still legal though
Thick as **** but easy on the eye! Ok, back to the 3 day split... it's tough, because 3 days for me is not enough...
How about doing an upper/lower split?
I.e. do legs basically on all 3 days, but also do some upper work.
However with your running that might be tough on you.
How about a push/pull split?
Chest / Back
Shoulders / arms
Legs
You know how you've responded to different types of training so probably best you tweak it to suit your week? I like the strength training element though.
I like that split.
Dave - do both - but if you have a shrug bar use that. It's good to vary things. You can go heavier with a barbell usually
Dave - do both - but if you have a shrug bar use that. It's good to vary things. You can go heavier with a barbell usually
They should make your hams feel like they're on fire.
Oh yes, there will be an element of lower back work out like most exercises of that sort
However you should really be targeting the hams more than anything else.So what does weight have to do with anything that people can lift?
FWIW I'm just shy of 6'1" only weigh around 15 1/2 stone at the moment, but achieved a lot of my lifts (in my sig below) without being much heavier.
I train more for strength and power - though most people that have met me call me, well actually from a guy in the gym yesterday said "heavy set". In my old gym I was probably the one lifting more than anyone else in the gym bar bench which I'm not bothered about.
As a result of my training I have gained some size too which I don't mind.
Other people here train specifically for strength, and some for size. I don't see the two as mutually exclusive personally, and I'd rather be strong than look big - however, fortunately, I have the strength to back up my slightly thicker set build. I'd like to think that when you can throw 200lbs over your head (which is more than most men weigh) it's a pretty clear sign of strength and power - which is quite scary if you think about it.
Over 19 st @ 6'4" - without seeing pics I'd probably guess your carrying a fair bit of fat? If not, then perhaps you're just genetically thicker set than most - however I'd be surprised that after 3 years you haven't developed more strength if you're naturally stocky.
Bodybuilding is about sculpting your body yes, it's about enhancing your appearance, symmetry, and developing each muscle fibre to be more defined, larger and lowering the fat in your body. So you're right - if those are your goals and you're achieving it, it's great!
I've been lifting seriously (used to go to the gym just to "do the machines") for about 3.5 years now, maybe 4. I started off struggling with 60kg bench, 80kg squats (though to my defence they were full deep squats) and 100kg deadlifts. So from 240kg to 600kg I've more than doubled my strength, added about 2 stone, improved my cardiovascular health and my diet. It's taken a long time to do that, and I'm still doing that now.
Don't focus on what other people do in the gym, if you lift heavier then them, fine, but challenge yourself, not others. If you're into bodybuilding, ignore the weight and focus on your training for developing your shape. Worry not, what other people do.
Leg press is deceiving, though 420kg is a good number, I don't always believe that the leg press is representative of the actual weight lifted - however 140kg squat is a good strong weight - so worry more about your squats than leg press.
Should have read your post in full!
So there you have it, you're cutting, and training in such a way that isn't conducive to strength gain. What's wrong with that? Does it matter than a lot of us are shorter and can lift twice what you can? No. Heck, someone like Dark Shadow, or Nightmare, are around 70kg and on some lifts are lifting effectively 2x as much as me (in terms of bodyweight lifts). Sure the numbers aren't as big, but in relation to their bodyweight they've got me blown out of the water! I think it's great! There are some people like, Morba and Tank who are massive but ridiculously strong as well, and then there are others who focus purely on muscle shape like a bodybuilder. We're all different with different goals and abilities.
Personally, and this is just what I feel - so don't take this personally, and it's not a reflection on your post, it's just me being rhetorical. I feel that building muscle should be conducive to strength - the training should still affect your body the same way and size comes as a result - I don't understand the size over strength training psychology - it just doesn't interest me.
Thought I'd give a quick overview of my gym to you lot - posted it in a thread on UKM where I found the link to the gym in the first place!
It's quite an interesting read as Physical Culture has got a heck of a history:
http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/general-conversation/80805-physical-culture-gym-putney-9.html#post1955457
It's quite an interesting read as Physical Culture has got a heck of a history:
http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/general-conversation/80805-physical-culture-gym-putney-9.html#post1955457
I think going to a proper gym will motivate you more. I've been to plenty of gyms where I've been among the "average" sized people - it doesn't phase me as I'm there for me, but it does give you motivation! More so when you're lifting as much if not more than people juiced up to the eye balls!
I think you've definitely got a "want to improve" attitude, and you're sure of yourself which is good. It's good to understand that there's always lots more to learn no routine or diet is perfect, and your body is a dynamic thing that is constantly changing, being challenged, fighting off illnesses, fixing you, building muscle, blood cells, skin cells etc... there's so much that goes on.
Just keep concentrating on your achievements and you'll get there - however I'd agree - move to a better gym if you want motivation.
I do rate bench press as it's a good compound exercise, it targets arms, back, shoulders, chest, and a bit of core work. It's a good exercise, IF, and only IF, you get the technique right.
Deadlift to me is the ultimate exercise, sure it won't develop chest or much front delt or other muscles, but it will engage every leg muscle, most of the the upper back, neck, core core core!
Squats again, but with more focus on legs.
Bench is important, and IMO if you only ever did 4 exercises, the ones I'd do are, Bench, Deadlifts, Squats and chins. You don't REALLY need anthing else. They will generate the most test, the most amount of bone density improvements, broaden you, and make you a strong ****er for your day to day life. Clearly a bit of variation will also help, and powerlifting movements like PP and powercleans etc... are vital too.
You must remember however, I'm not a bodybuilder, or at least it's not my goal to be perfectly chiseled etc... I'm after strength and power, and size is a nice outcome.
Deadlift to me is the ultimate exercise, sure it won't develop chest or much front delt or other muscles, but it will engage every leg muscle, most of the the upper back, neck, core core core!
Squats again, but with more focus on legs.
Bench is important, and IMO if you only ever did 4 exercises, the ones I'd do are, Bench, Deadlifts, Squats and chins. You don't REALLY need anthing else. They will generate the most test, the most amount of bone density improvements, broaden you, and make you a strong ****er for your day to day life. Clearly a bit of variation will also help, and powerlifting movements like PP and powercleans etc... are vital too.
You must remember however, I'm not a bodybuilder, or at least it's not my goal to be perfectly chiseled etc... I'm after strength and power, and size is a nice outcome.