The 5 year plan to £50k

[FoxEye]

Starting my job in September on £42k within the data science consulting sphere... It increases to £50k almost by default the following year at which point I'll either stay or start to drift into the banking industry again. However, this is dependent on a lot of factors. For 21 I'm very content, although I don't wish to stay below 6 figures for too long.

Instantly dislike you

Can't believe this thread is still going? Lol

Surely OP has surpassed the 50k mark now. If not then I sure hope you raised that figure. These days 50k just doesn't cut it.... Not for me anyway.

Stop taking the pee. £50k is almost twice the national average.

But the answer anyhow is... nope, I'm nowhere near atm. Frankly at this moment in time I have *no* useful skills whatsoever.

Whatever direction I end up taking, I'm going to have to start at the very bottom. Because right now I'm completely unskilled.

 

[Hedge]

This all makes me feel more content with what I've got. I'm about to get up and head to my average paid job that I love, in my nice car that I love (while my average car is in garage), spend a day enjoying my work, head home to my nice house with a nice big garden and then sit down and watch my 58' TV with my 5.1 sound system and eat a nice average wage man's dinner this evening.

It's nice to see some people have achieved very high wages but it doesn't always equate to the best lifestyle. I've got a great work/life balance and never feel drained or angry about things.

 

[dowie]

Yup but the LPC is sooo career specific and sooo easy / arguably pointless.

I guess more comparable to a specialist masters then, obvs say a physics or economics masters student from a good uni has a wider range of options.

Though failed lawyers do find other careers surely - I mean back office/admin type roles like compliance in a bank or some sort of HR function - perhaps something that they could have landed anyway with their LLB if they'd made a choice to not pursue law before choosing an LPC but meh...

I know someone who was a Business Analyst at a firm I worked for, he went without work for a year and paid something like 20k for a masters in 'mathematical trading' at Cass business school... after graduating, he didn't get a job as a trader, he got another Business Analyst role and a tiny pay rise. There are plenty of courses out there either at mediocre universities or aimed at fields with significant competition that pose that sort of risk to the students.

 

[Nitefly]

It always struck me as stupid to do an LPC without at least a TC lined up, and preferably with them paying for it + money on top. Obviously law schools will rake in the cash from anyone regardless of their prospects... like with many masters programmes, tbh... they're just great ways to make money, and it's not their fault if people are stupid enough to take such a big financial gamble. Although I've no idea to what extent self-funding is necessary at the lower end of the scale/if the aim is 'just' to be a highstreet solicitor or whatever.

Yup, I did something similar, and qualified just after my 30th. It's a lot of work, but an awful lot more interesting than my previous marketing career.

Edit: In relation to the LPC, I found it a necessary evil. It was an absolute doddle and should have been six months at most, but a couple of the modules gave me a reasonably thorough grounding in the work I now do. Trying to work with paralegals who haven't done it and don't know their way around things like the CPR is a nightmare.

That said, doing it if you've not got a TC lined up is an awful idea. It's a huge financial and time commitment, and there's no guarantee of a job at the end.

If it's not 'stupid' or an 'awful idea' it is definitely a ballsy one. I know quite a few people who have done it, paralegalled and moved onto better things (a TC), usually as a result of some blip on their academic record, or maybe it's additional poor interview performance - I can't be sure. Ultimately unless you've got a very good academic record and have enough quirky things about you to pass the 'robot lawyer 252' HR tests, often the price of entry to the career is forking out for a course which arguably shouldn't exist. Seems like a bit of a kick, particularly to those with first class degrees (from good unis) yet average A levels.

That said, of my LPC year, for which the classes were somewhat gruesomely split into 'TC people only' and 'everyone else' for the core subjects.... the 'TC exclusive' class was by far away the most competent (on average). There was a mix for the non core subjects. Some very clever people in the non-TC groups but some absolute dopes as well.

 

[grudas]

This all makes me feel more content with what I've got. I'm about to get up and head to my average paid job that I love, in my nice car that I love (while my average car is in garage), spend a day enjoying my work, head home to my nice house with a nice big garden and then sit down and watch my 58' TV with my 5.1 sound system and eat a nice average wage man's dinner this evening.

It's nice to see some people have achieved very high wages but it doesn't always equate to the best lifestyle. I've got a great work/life balance and never feel drained or angry about things.

I agree. That's what I'm chasing in life too if I get crazy rich I won't complain but all I want right now is my own house and to simply continue progressing through my career.

 

[Dunks]

Decisions indeed!

That must be quite an interesting industry to work in? If you don't mind me asking, was the decision to move away from design work yours?

I recently led the refit of our new building, into labs from what was a office building. Really interesting stuff. Absolute nightmare as well, but very interesting. Fair amount of exposure to the BSE world in facilities, so I certainly agree with you on that one.

Our outsourced IT guys seem to have a pretty good gig, if you're good at breaking down technical stuff for non-techies, you'll go far in that industry. You certainly seem like you'd have a head start getting into it!

Out of interest, would you continue doing your current job down south if you could?
[...]

Yeah, mainly my decision, I'm still in the same team I was in before doing design work, so I'm still working on the same product but just testing it rather than designing it!

I probably would continue to do my job down south, there's a few places in Stevenage which have positions similar to my previous design role and also my testing role (all types mechanical/electrical engineering roles really), which is commutable from our flat (1 hour door to door, which is manageable) but not having much luck so far! That's my preferred option.

There's also lots of interesting sounding engineering positions available in other areas of the company as well that I would probably enjoy working in though, but that'd mean staying in Derby!

 

[TacticalFish]

For those discussing the LPC & GDL stuff: https://www.legalcheek.com/2017/04/its-official-the-lpc-and-gdl-are-being-scrapped/ Is this story true?

Yeah, mainly my decision, I'm still in the same team I was in before doing design work, so I'm still working on the same product but just testing it rather than designing it!

I probably would continue to do my job down south, there's a few places in Stevenage which have positions similar to my previous design role and also my testing role (all types mechanical/electrical engineering roles really), which is commutable from our flat (1 hour door to door, which is manageable) but not having much luck so far! That's my preferred option.

There's also lots of interesting sounding engineering positions available in other areas of the company as well that I would probably enjoy working in though, but that'd mean staying in Derby!

Ah that's interesting, was design work getting boring?

I see quite a few engineering positions around Cambridge, probably a bit more of trek than London.

Best of luck getting something further down South!

 

[dowie]

For those discussing the LPC & GDL stuff: https://www.legalcheek.com/2017/04/its-official-the-lpc-and-gdl-are-being-scrapped/ Is this story true?

If they're going for a universal exams/assessments that anyone can sit (whether a law grad or not) then I wonder why there is a requirement for a degree in the first place - why couldn't say a good A-Level candidate attempt this just as they can with say Accountancy?

 

[Dunks]

For those discussing the LPC & GDL stuff: https://www.legalcheek.com/2017/04/its-official-the-lpc-and-gdl-are-being-scrapped/ Is this story true?



Ah that's interesting, was design work getting boring?

I see quite a few engineering positions around Cambridge, probably a bit more of trek than London.

Best of luck getting something further down South!

Yeah a little, things move slowly in the nuclear industry so there wasn't a huge deal of 'cutting edge' concepts or design/manufacturing methods being used. I'd probably enjoy it more if that was the case!

I've seen loads in and around Cambridge, but it's a little bit too far!

 

[MichaelAwkward]

The dept. I work is in Ops and Finance, so have some exposure myself. From what my manager says, it seems to be the modelling she enjoys most, which I think I would too. Analytical work can be rewarding too.

Ah that's interesting, my understanding was that you'd either do AAT or one of the higher qualifications? Is my understanding incorrect, or did you just go a different route? Best of luck getting into the aviation industry, is a tricky one to get into?

I decided that doing AAT Level 4 made more sense for me, as someone without any prior experience in accounting, as it's typically offered as a classroom teaching package where as F1-F3 for ACCA are usually home study only. AAT Level 4 means you're exempt from doing those first knowledge papers and is a perfectly decent qualification in itself. A number of employers that I approached whilst job hunting said that they'd rather have someone with AAT and experience who was studying ACCA than someone who had just started ACCA.

In some parts, AAT actually covers subjects in more detail than in ACCA (inheritance tax for example).

I've no idea about the aviation industry - I suspect so! I currently work for a private school so I imagine the culture and atmosphere is a world apart.

On a separate note I think some of the people in this thread are a bit out of touch with reality... saying that £50k isn't a lot of money and that it doesn't cut it. I have family members who earn more than £50k but they typically have less savings and less disposable income than me because quite frankly they're crap at managing their own finances and waste money on a daily basis. Perhaps that's part of it.

 

[Uther]

It will be interesting to revisit this thread in another two years, when the five years are up. Some people will have changed their lives using this thread as a catalyst, while the OP will probably still be sitting at home with mum.
Prove me wrong OP.

 

[Josh]

I've added £10k since this thread began but still 2 pay grades away from £50k, as a civil servant I'll have to be someones favourite to get close to that.

Might be time to ply my trade in the private sector soon.

 

[TacticalFish]

A number of employers that I approached whilst job hunting said that they'd rather have someone with AAT and experience who was studying ACCA than someone who had just started ACCA.

In some parts, AAT actually covers subjects in more detail than in ACCA (inheritance tax for example).

Ah OK, TBH that doesn't surprise me at all. My manager worked as a purchase ledger assistant for a year or two before starting her CIMA training. If I were to go down the Accountancy route, I think I'd like to do the same as you, sounds like it gives you a great head start and grounding on ACCA.

 

[Freefaller]

This all makes me feel more content with what I've got. I'm about to get up and head to my average paid job that I love, in my nice car that I love (while my average car is in garage), spend a day enjoying my work, head home to my nice house with a nice big garden and then sit down and watch my 58' TV with my 5.1 sound system and eat a nice average wage man's dinner this evening.

It's nice to see some people have achieved very high wages but it doesn't always equate to the best lifestyle. I've got a great work/life balance and never feel drained or angry about things.

I'm nearly perfectly content - my commute is just slightly longer than I'd like, but I love my job, although hard and long hours (my choice), but like you, I get home to a nice big house (which does need work, the eternal DIY looming over my shoulder!), with a big garden, with my family, with a couple of nice cars on the drive. That said, I have more than doubled my salary since this thread was started - it inspired me to push myself. So thanks OP for your help.

 

[Liefrich]

But you can paralegal without one . I never went through the whole process, but is it really that hard? I mean, do you really need a very good academic record/quirky extracurricular stuff/be lucky and get through tests? Does having an LPC mean you can get around those requirements? The most recent example, which I know the most about, is my brother getting a TC after being a paralegal for around a year (he didn't need the LPC... is that often a requirement to be a paralegal?!)... but he certainly has blips on his academic record.

Does anyone produce figures on what proportion of people have to self-fund? And also what proportion of self-funders actually become solicitors?

I graduated from the LPC in 2009 and obtained my TC in 2012 (reduced to 18 months). I self-funded with a Natwest Professional Loan which has been paid off.

Due to the financial crash 2009 was an awful time to graduate and most people at my Law School (Cardiff) did not have training contracts. However, almost all the relatively competent ones (not necessarily the best academically) are all qualified and doing well.

I disliked the LPC intensely and much preferred the theoretical undergraduate stuff. I think initially legal graduates tend to want to look solely at the City firms and if they don’t reach those “highs” think that it is not worth it/or that they have failed. I remember reading certain websites and almost giving up before I even started. This is a misconception as you can get a hugely rewarding legal career in smaller or regional firms, plus if you are actually any good (in practice) you can carve a reputation out for yourself. I also think a lot of firms are starting to realise that the race for top academics does not mean great fee earners; hence we are now getting away from the LPC and bringing in legal apprenticeships.

However, if you really want to be rich – go into finance!

 

[Nitefly]

But you can paralegal without one . I never went through the whole process, but is it really that hard? I mean, do you really need a very good academic record/quirky extracurricular stuff/be lucky and get through tests? Does having an LPC mean you can get around those requirements? The most recent example, which I know the most about, is my brother getting a TC after being a paralegal for around a year (he didn't need the LPC... is that often a requirement to be a paralegal?!)... but he certainly has blips on his academic record.

Does anyone produce figures on what proportion of people have to self-fund? And also what proportion of self-funders actually become solicitors?

Some firms do require an LPC to 'paralegal'. Otherwise you are a paralegal by another name.

Some firms strongly prefer paralegals to have an LPC, when there is a section of candidates. Otherwise, it's not a requirement. It's not uncommon for people in your brother's situation to do the LPC part time whilst continuing to paralegal.

As for it being 'hard' to get a TC, is it's definitely 'competitive' to get a good one. I know a couple of people that have struggled but have since persevered - well done to them.

 

[Nitefly]

I graduated from the LPC in 2009 and obtained my TC in 2012 (reduced to 18 months). I self-funded with a Natwest Professional Loan which has been paid off.

Due to the financial crash 2009 was an awful time to graduate and most people at my Law School (Cardiff) did not have training contracts. However, almost all the relatively competent ones (not necessarily the best academically) are all qualified and doing well.

I disliked the LPC intensely and much preferred the theoretical undergraduate stuff. I think initially legal graduates tend to want to look solely at the City firms and if they don’t reach those “highs” think that it is not worth it/or that they have failed. I remember reading certain websites and almost giving up before I even started. This is a misconception as you can get a hugely rewarding legal career in smaller or regional firms, plus if you are actually any good (in practice) you can carve a reputation out for yourself. I also think a lot of firms are starting to realise that the race for top academics does not mean great fee earners; hence we are now getting away from the LPC and bringing in legal apprenticeships.

However, if you really want to be rich – go into finance!

Yep - I know someone who trained in a high street firm and now works in the city on 6 figures. Which is ridiculous as they were lazy / rubbish - but perhaps the fool is me

 

[Liefrich]

Yep - I know someone who trained in a high street firm and now works in the city on 6 figures. Which is ridiculous as they were lazy / rubbish - but perhaps the fool is me

Being a good lawyer has nothing to do with being great at exams. You need to of course be studious enough to pass and pass well, but social skills, billing and the ability to attract/keep clients is way more important than AAAA at A level and a double first from Cambridge.

Ultimately I am dealing with people constantly. You of course need a great understanding of the law but more importantly you need to make sure your clients understand the position and have confidence in what you are telling them.

 

[Nitefly]

Being a good lawyer has nothing to do with being great at exams. You need to of course be studious enough to pass and pass well, but social skills, billing and the ability to attract/keep clients is way more important than AAAA at A level and a double first from Cambridge.

Ultimately I am dealing with people constantly. You of course need a great understanding of the law but more importantly you need to make sure your clients understand the position and have confidence in what you are telling them.

I meant they were a crap, lazy lawyer - didn't train with me but an ex-colleague

 

[Liefrich]

I meant they were a crap, lazy lawyer - didn't train with me but an ex-colleague

Haha - good looking?