Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (March Poll)

Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?

  • Remain a member of the European Union

    Votes: 400 43.3%

  • Leave the European Union

    Votes: 523 56.7%
  • Total voters
    923
  • Poll closed .
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I voted out this time, I voted in last thread. If the referendum was today I still would struggle to decide, but that's the way I've been leaning at the time of voting.

I still don't think there's enough information with the right clarity as to the economic and social impact to make the right informed choice though. Long way to go for that yet.
 
scorza said:
Not quite - they do form groups which are something like our political parties. To pass legislation you need >50% of the vote in the EP, the largest group has something like 30% of the MEPs in the EP, so they need other groups to vote with them to pass legislation. It's true that there are no UK MEPs in the European People's Party, which is the largest group.
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Thanks for the info.
And don't forget the bigger the group the more money they get.
 
deuse said:
Already been posted 100s of times and As the reason given by NF has been posted as much.
Got anything new to bring to the table?
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Just because it's been posted before doesn't mean it's not just as relevant now as it was then.

If we want Europe to work for us, we need to be invested in it and we're not. Can you agree that if we do vote to stay in, that we should make the most of the situation?
 
I'm an OUT as well and will probably remain so regardless of the hysteria news item of the week.

Both sides are using glass balls to predict what will happen when in fact no one knows what's going to happen next month let alone a few years so I think its time for a change and if it all goes wrong in a few years- rejoin the EU and go all. But until then try our luck with that organisation called the commonwealth which worked fine for us
 
Burnsy2023 said:
Just because it's been posted before doesn't mean it's not just as relevant now as it was then.

If we want Europe to work for us, we need to be invested in it and we're not. Can you agree that if we do vote to stay in, that we should make the most of the situation?
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So you never read what happens when NF isn't there. shakes head
And you never read the edited post! what's the point with you.
 
Burnsy2023 said:
Can you agree that if we do vote to stay in, that we should make the most of the situation?
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I agree with that, if we vote to stay in then our Parliament will become less and less important, eventually becoming some sort of super-council while the European Parliament will become more important and who France, Spain, Germany, Poland etc vote for in their elections will have a massive effect in the UK.
 
dowie said:
I said the EU is run by bureaucrats...

MEPs are not just like MPs, MPs propose legislation and vote on it, MEPs merely provide the rubber stamp...
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Only through private member's bills which are rare. Most of the UK's legislation is proposed by quangos or government department, by mostly unelected civil servants.

I'd also like to make the point that MEPs can also vote to reject legislation which they have done.

dowie said:
MPs are appointed to ministerial posts and oversee govt departments, MEPs aren't
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That is true, but EU commission posts are chosen by heads of EU member states who in the UK aren't directly elected either.

dowie said:
EU legislation is proposed by unelected bureaucrats, EU departments are headed by unelected bureaucrats...
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The first bit isn't any different to the UK, the second, I'll admit is true, but I'm not sure that's necessarily a bad thing.
 
PR can only realistically 'shield' the top two slots on the party list, yes, and not forever, as the Scottish example demonstrates with its historic decimation of the Tories, LDs, and now Labour. Compared to FPTP, the upopulars went down faster beyond the wall and with some eclat!

So say the party leader and his deputy or one other senior grandee may remain holding the banner for a while, but without their party gaining sufficient representation, they'd be about as effective as a chocolate teapot.

PR also shifts the focus from personalities to policies and the substance behind them.

Perhaps the strongest aspect of the system is, however, its wider representative reach, which both brings the extreme, or fringe, views into the mix and allows for them to be debated and challenged in the sphere of public politics. This is both more democratic, and is much better than letting some of these views to be left simmering under the surface and internet forums, as is the case with the Westminster model.

dowie said:
MEPs are not just like MPs, MPs propose legislation and vote on it, MEPs merely provide the rubber stamp...
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They have the power to both modify and reject legislation. Further, national parliaments need to ratify and write anything coming from the EUP in compatibility with the relevant national legislation already in place. From major treaties to unfair trade deals, both the EUP and the national parliaments can send the bills back to the drawing board or stop them completely. We are also quite capable of using our veto powers, when we totally disagree.

The Commission, one member per member state, I might add, has the legislative initiative, sure, but it is balanced by the strategic oversight body of the European Council -- a body for the freely elected leaders of all the member states and its own president, who propose the EC president, and take into account recent parliamentary elections.

The European Parliament can dissolve the Commission; the national parliaments can vote out unpopular national leaders, hence removing them from the Council.
 
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deuse said:
So you never read what happens when NF isn't there. shakes head
And you never read the edited post! what's the point with you.
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That's because many MEPs are not interested in building alliances and relationships with other MEPs. If they did, then we'd have much more influence to actually block laws. Of course, if we sit at the back of the room and complain when nobody listens to us then we're not going to get anywhere - that's why politicians need to be talking and negotiating.
 
Burnsy2023 said:
That's because many MEPs are not interested in building alliances and relationships with other MEPs. If they did, then we'd have much more influence to actually block laws. Of course, if we sit at the back of the room and complain when nobody listens to us then we're not going to get anywhere - that's why politicians need to be talking and negotiating.
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It's no different to Westminster in this regard, really. One MP sitting in the corner for some singular cause won't achieve much without allies in established parties. Well, heck, look at how impotent Labour is, atm. Lots of MPs under FPTP still doesn't guarantee solid representation; and with the proposed changes to the Trade Union political funding model; reduction in the number of MPs; potential exist of the Scottish MPs from the Union or their castration, whichever comes first; and, most importantly, the unchecked power of the dominant party to redraw boundaries on the electoral map; it beggars belief how people can possibly expect more representation and democracy in the independent UK after Brexit.

Burnsy2023 said:
That is already the case regardless of whether we're in the EU or not.
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+1; nor will the economic troubles in Greece, or elsewhere in the EU, possibly caused by our exit, will stop affecting the home economy. You cannot isolate the UK from global systems and the shocks that now come with them by voting Out.
 
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